Mid-life Career Change to Airline Pilot. It's Doable.

Groundpounder said:
I hate wearing the hat, but what is worse is having to wear the blazer year round if you're on a global fleet. Sitting in a Euro terminal during the summer with a blazer on is a sweat fest. I think the Delta peeps only have to wear the hat during the summer.
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Nope, Delta is "required" to wear the hat all the time. Jackets required Nov-Feb
 
Mama said there'd be days like this...

I Had my first “bad” day since making this switch. So here's a day in the life of a reserve pilot that wasn't so great…

Reserve week. Super quiet. Five days on call and only one ferry flight, which was basically strapping into a rocket since the jet was 20,000 pounds lighter. IT. WAS. AWESOME!
Totally empty but I still made my PAs because I am a professional!

Day four rolls around. Crew Scheduling calls and says, “Come sit standby from 5 to 7.” Great. Done at 7 PM instead of midnight as my prescribed RAP dictated.

I get to the airport, walking around, minding my business, and the phone rings again. It's crew scheduling. I think I am going home early. Nope.
“Deadhead to Corpus Christi and ferry a plane back from maintenance.”

I am pumped. Another empty jet and I will be back home at a reasonable bedtime.

I get to CRP at 9:30 PM. No airplane. Kiosk says canceled. No release. Captain points to a lonely airplane way out on the ramp and says, “That's our plane. The mechanics are about to get on a plane from DFW to come out here and fix it”

We are in an empty airport. and when I say empty, not even a janitor. Bars and restaurants are closed. Just me and the captain watching the plane on flight aware with the MX on it. I say to the captain, if they fix it, who is going to fuel it, lower the jet bridge, tow it to the gate, etc? There's nobody here.

We call Scheduling to check our duty limits. He times out at 1:30 AM and I time out at 2:30 AM. I tell him we are absolutely getting sent to a hotel but not until we have waited here for way longer than we want.

He looks at me and says, “You are new, right?”
I say, “Yep.”
He says, “Honeymoon phase is over.”

They call us after MX arrives (11:00 PM ish) and say "We got you a hotel"
They let us know that the captain will ferry the plane back tomorrow but it will be late because they have to send him a new FO because I have exceeded a consecutive duty limit and am not legally allowed to operate an aircraft for 30 hours.

So my 2 hour standby stent turned into 20 hours where I basically flew as a passenger to CRP to sit in the terminal, and go back to a hotel, and then fly back as a passenger today.

I actually am not mad, I am bummed I don't get to fly but mostly feels like wasted time. I going to bid reserve 1 more time so I can get Christmas off then I am going to try to not be on reserve anymore.
Its not bad but when my wife asks "what is our schedule this week?" the reserve response is "Could be busy as hell or could just be a crap ton of naps. Who knows?"

Now I have the only job I have ever had where it is now mandated that I rest for 30 hours.

All in all not a bad "bad" day. I was sharing this with a "seasoned" pilot this morning. He looked at my shoes and goes "Winter is coming. Get some boots. De-Ice fluid is slippery AF and tastes like S**t."

Looking forward to confirming that.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
Mama said there'd be days like this...

I Had my first “bad” day since making this switch. So here's a day in the life of a reserve pilot that wasn't so great…

Reserve week. Super quiet. Five days on call and only one ferry flight, which was basically strapping into a rocket since the jet was 20,000 pounds lighter. IT. WAS. AWESOME!
Totally empty but I still made my PAs because I am a professional!

Day four rolls around. Crew Scheduling calls and says, “Come sit standby from 5 to 7.” Great. Done at 7 PM instead of midnight as my prescribed RAP dictated.

I get to the airport, walking around, minding my business, and the phone rings again. It's crew scheduling. I think I am going home early. Nope.
“Deadhead to Corpus Christi and ferry a plane back from maintenance.”

I am pumped. Another empty jet and I will be back home at a reasonable bedtime.

I get to CRP at 9:30 PM. No airplane. Kiosk says canceled. No release. Captain points to a lonely airplane way out on the ramp and says, “That's our plane. The mechanics are about to get on a plane from DFW to come out here and fix it”

We are in an empty airport. and when I say empty, not even a janitor. Bars and restaurants are closed. Just me and the captain watching the plane on flight aware with the MX on it. I say to the captain, if they fix it, who is going to fuel it, lower the jet bridge, tow it to the gate, etc? There's nobody here.

We call Scheduling to check our duty limits. He times out at 1:30 AM and I time out at 2:30 AM. I tell him we are absolutely getting sent to a hotel but not until we have waited here for way longer than we want.

He looks at me and says, “You are new, right?”
I say, “Yep.”
He says, “Honeymoon phase is over.”

They call us after MX arrives (11:00 PM ish) and say "We got you a hotel"
They let us know that the captain will ferry the plane back tomorrow but it will be late because they have to send him a new FO because I have exceeded a consecutive duty limit and am not legally allowed to operate an aircraft for 30 hours.

So my 2 hour standby stent turned into 20 hours where I basically flew as a passenger to CRP to sit in the terminal, and go back to a hotel, and then fly back as a passenger today.

I actually am not mad, I am bummed I don't get to fly but mostly feels like wasted time. I going to bid reserve 1 more time so I can get Christmas off then I am going to try to not be on reserve anymore.
Its not bad but when my wife asks "what is our schedule this week?" the reserve response is "Could be busy as hell or could just be a crap ton of naps. Who knows?"

Now I have the only job I have ever had where it is now mandated that I rest for 30 hours.

All in all not a bad "bad" day. I was sharing this with a "seasoned" pilot this morning. He looked at my shoes and goes "Winter is coming. Get some boots. De-Ice fluid is slippery AF and tastes like S**t."

Looking forward to confirming that.
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the airplane is pretty much never ready when crew scheduling says. It’s so consistent that when I’m told to go get the airplane from maintenance my first thought is “wonder what hotel they put me in.”
 
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SixPapaCharlie said:
….I going to bid reserve 1 more time so I can get Christmas off….
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Let’s see how this shakes out. Be mentally prepared to go thru the exact same thing you just went thru. Pray your airline doesn’t have a SWA-style meltdown.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
Mama said there'd be days like this...

I Had my first “bad” day since making this switch. So here's a day in the life of a reserve pilot that wasn't so great…

Reserve week. Super quiet. Five days on call and only one ferry flight, which was basically strapping into a rocket since the jet was 20,000 pounds lighter. IT. WAS. AWESOME!
Totally empty but I still made my PAs because I am a professional!

Day four rolls around. Crew Scheduling calls and says, “Come sit standby from 5 to 7.” Great. Done at 7 PM instead of midnight as my prescribed RAP dictated.

I get to the airport, walking around, minding my business, and the phone rings again. It's crew scheduling. I think I am going home early. Nope.
“Deadhead to Corpus Christi and ferry a plane back from maintenance.”

I am pumped. Another empty jet and I will be back home at a reasonable bedtime.

I get to CRP at 9:30 PM. No airplane. Kiosk says canceled. No release. Captain points to a lonely airplane way out on the ramp and says, “That's our plane. The mechanics are about to get on a plane from DFW to come out here and fix it”

We are in an empty airport. and when I say empty, not even a janitor. Bars and restaurants are closed. Just me and the captain watching the plane on flight aware with the MX on it. I say to the captain, if they fix it, who is going to fuel it, lower the jet bridge, tow it to the gate, etc? There's nobody here.

We call Scheduling to check our duty limits. He times out at 1:30 AM and I time out at 2:30 AM. I tell him we are absolutely getting sent to a hotel but not until we have waited here for way longer than we want.

He looks at me and says, “You are new, right?”
I say, “Yep.”
He says, “Honeymoon phase is over.”

They call us after MX arrives (11:00 PM ish) and say "We got you a hotel"
They let us know that the captain will ferry the plane back tomorrow but it will be late because they have to send him a new FO because I have exceeded a consecutive duty limit and am not legally allowed to operate an aircraft for 30 hours.

So my 2 hour standby stent turned into 20 hours where I basically flew as a passenger to CRP to sit in the terminal, and go back to a hotel, and then fly back as a passenger today.

I actually am not mad, I am bummed I don't get to fly but mostly feels like wasted time. I going to bid reserve 1 more time so I can get Christmas off then I am going to try to not be on reserve anymore.
Its not bad but when my wife asks "what is our schedule this week?" the reserve response is "Could be busy as hell or could just be a crap ton of naps. Who knows?"

Now I have the only job I have ever had where it is now mandated that I rest for 30 hours.

All in all not a bad "bad" day. I was sharing this with a "seasoned" pilot this morning. He looked at my shoes and goes "Winter is coming. Get some boots. De-Ice fluid is slippery AF and tastes like S**t."

Looking forward to confirming that.
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How does pay work for this then? Since you didn't fly you did all that for free?
 
NealRomeoGolf said:
How does pay work for this then? Since you didn't fly you did all that for free?
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Min pay rigs. The soft pay side of contracts. Not sure what the rig is at his job but at my shop we get a minimum of 5:15 hours per day averaged on the trip. So if you’re out for three days min pay of 15:45. Some places have a daily minimum not an average like we do.

Just depends on how it was negotiated.
 
The first rule about stumbling or falling on the ramp is that you need to immediately look up into the terminal windows to see if anyone noticed. :p
 
kayoh190 said:
The first rule about stumbling or falling on the ramp is that you need to immediately look up into the terminal windows to see if anyone noticed. :p
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You could bow and doff your cap, if you wear one. If it stays on, that is.
 
dtuuri said:
You could bow and doff your cap, if you wear one. If it stays on, that is.
Click to expand...

If only I had the coordination, I could be like Gene Wilder in Willy Wonka.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
Mama said there'd be days like this...

I Had my first “bad” day since making this switch. So here's a day in the life of a reserve pilot that wasn't so great…

Reserve week. Super quiet. Five days on call and only one ferry flight, which was basically strapping into a rocket since the jet was 20,000 pounds lighter. IT. WAS. AWESOME!
Totally empty but I still made my PAs because I am a professional!

Day four rolls around. Crew Scheduling calls and says, “Come sit standby from 5 to 7.” Great. Done at 7 PM instead of midnight as my prescribed RAP dictated.

I get to the airport, walking around, minding my business, and the phone rings again. It's crew scheduling. I think I am going home early. Nope.
“Deadhead to Corpus Christi and ferry a plane back from maintenance.”

I am pumped. Another empty jet and I will be back home at a reasonable bedtime.

I get to CRP at 9:30 PM. No airplane. Kiosk says canceled. No release. Captain points to a lonely airplane way out on the ramp and says, “That's our plane. The mechanics are about to get on a plane from DFW to come out here and fix it”

We are in an empty airport. and when I say empty, not even a janitor. Bars and restaurants are closed. Just me and the captain watching the plane on flight aware with the MX on it. I say to the captain, if they fix it, who is going to fuel it, lower the jet bridge, tow it to the gate, etc? There's nobody here.

We call Scheduling to check our duty limits. He times out at 1:30 AM and I time out at 2:30 AM. I tell him we are absolutely getting sent to a hotel but not until we have waited here for way longer than we want.

He looks at me and says, “You are new, right?”
I say, “Yep.”
He says, “Honeymoon phase is over.”

They call us after MX arrives (11:00 PM ish) and say "We got you a hotel"
They let us know that the captain will ferry the plane back tomorrow but it will be late because they have to send him a new FO because I have exceeded a consecutive duty limit and am not legally allowed to operate an aircraft for 30 hours.

So my 2 hour standby stent turned into 20 hours where I basically flew as a passenger to CRP to sit in the terminal, and go back to a hotel, and then fly back as a passenger today.

I actually am not mad, I am bummed I don't get to fly but mostly feels like wasted time. I going to bid reserve 1 more time so I can get Christmas off then I am going to try to not be on reserve anymore.
Its not bad but when my wife asks "what is our schedule this week?" the reserve response is "Could be busy as hell or could just be a crap ton of naps. Who knows?"

Now I have the only job I have ever had where it is now mandated that I rest for 30 hours.

All in all not a bad "bad" day. I was sharing this with a "seasoned" pilot this morning. He looked at my shoes and goes "Winter is coming. Get some boots. De-Ice fluid is slippery AF and tastes like S**t."

Looking forward to confirming that.
Click to expand...

It sounds like you may have learned an important part of the negative side of reserve life vs. line life, as you determine which lifestyle you prefer. Being home based, the nice part is that you can bid whichever you want and if you're on reserve, basically it means you can do stuff at home so long as you're ready to drop your bags and go. To me, that would be very appealing since that would give me lots more time in the shop and more likely to get the days of fI want. But the downside of it is exactly what you've run into. I think airlines are often going to be less efficient in scenarios like what you've run into, but if it makes you feel any better, my wife has run into more or less the same scenarios in her 135 world. She has a bit more latitude to work with core/dispatch on things like when to go to a hotel, and they generally won't end up trying to send another crew in (will just wait until the current crew goes green), but it's a similar sort of scenario. In my household we tend to work well with varied schedules, we enjoy the variety, but it's absolutely not for everyone.

My advice with the forced downtime is figuring out how to fill it with other things so it doesn't feel wasted. Catching up on reading you want to do, maybe video editing for your channel. At a hotel, get some exercise in at the gym. You'll figure out your routines, it'll just take some time. My wife's been effectively doing her same 135 job now for about 7 years, and her routine is constantly evolving (and with the unpredictable schedule a "routine" is in constant flux) but figuring that out has been key. During slow periods she'll have days where she's basically sitting in a hotel collecting Marriott/Hilton points.

Certainly understand the frustration, but as Bill said, it sounds better than sitting inside of a cubicle.
 
NealRomeoGolf said:
How does pay work for this then? Since you didn't fly you did all that for free?
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I get paid for my deadheads at the same rate as I do for flying. BUT to be clear unless I fly over 75 hours this month it just gets paid as part of my monthly minimum.
The other half is Time away from base. There is an equation they do to determine if the time away from base X some factor is more than hours flown and they would pay that instead of hours flown.
It wouldn't be cool to send a pilot on a 1 hour flight and give him a lost day so they are gone for 48 hours but only get paid for 1 hour.
 
kayoh190 said:
The first rule about stumbling or falling on the ramp is that you need to immediately look up into the terminal windows to see if anyone noticed. :p
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At our Indoc day we met the chief pilot and one of the FO duties is to do the pre and post flight. She made sure to point ou that we are always on camera. If I fall, I will locate the nearest camera and give it a thumbs up.
 
TCABM said:
Pray your airline doesn’t have a SWA-style meltdown.
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Wasn't LUV and their C64-based internal operating systems the only airline running when the rest were down due to MS Cloudflare outage?
 
Tarheelpilot said:
the airplane is pretty much never ready when crew scheduling says. It’s so consistent that when I’m told to go get the airplane from maintenance my first thought is “wonder what hotel they put me in.”
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I can confirm on the fractional side as well.

Maint and Scheduling are two different departments, and "It won't be ready today" often comes at 5pm or 8am, but never before a crew is sent to pick it up :)
 
Ted said:
It sounds like you may have learned an important part of the negative side of reserve life vs. line life, as you determine which lifestyle you prefer. Being home based, the nice part is that you can bid whichever you want and if you're on reserve, basically it means you can do stuff at home so long as you're ready to drop your bags and go. To me, that would be very appealing since that would give me lots more time in the shop and more likely to get the days of fI want. But the downside of it is exactly what you've run into. I think airlines are often going to be less efficient in scenarios like what you've run into, but if it makes you feel any better, my wife has run into more or less the same scenarios in her 135 world. She has a bit more latitude to work with core/dispatch on things like when to go to a hotel, and they generally won't end up trying to send another crew in (will just wait until the current crew goes green), but it's a similar sort of scenario. In my household we tend to work well with varied schedules, we enjoy the variety, but it's absolutely not for everyone.

My advice with the forced downtime is figuring out how to fill it with other things so it doesn't feel wasted. Catching up on reading you want to do, maybe video editing for your channel. At a hotel, get some exercise in at the gym. You'll figure out your routines, it'll just take some time. My wife's been effectively doing her same 135 job now for about 7 years, and her routine is constantly evolving (and with the unpredictable schedule a "routine" is in constant flux) but figuring that out has been key. During slow periods she'll have days where she's basically sitting in a hotel collecting Marriott/Hilton points.

Certainly understand the frustration, but as Bill said, it sounds better than sitting inside of a cubicle.
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Being in base is a gift that allows a pilot so much flexibility. I am off for 3 days but I added myself to the overtime list so they can call me each day and say "If you see any trips you want, let me know and we will give em to you" That would be hard to do if not in base.

I will say for the first 2 months being on reserve was tough because I didn't know how to treat the down time. I "felt" like they could call at any moment so I didn't really plan much in a day and at the end of the day I would have wasted most of it. I am shifting to the opposite. I assume I won't get called and live my life. I have a uniform put together on a hanger, and a 3 night bag, flight bag, and food bag prepped. They have to give me 2:45 notice before a flight and I am 25 min from the airport. I scored the perfect scenario w/ respect to base proximity.

So far the best thing about this job is the job itself. I want to fly more than anything and I am trying to fly to my legal limits. The scheduling is tough to understand, and the rules upon rules about getting shifts, appropriating sequences, rest time, proffering and bidding is a lot and using the App on top of a mainframe system is cumbersome as hell. That part is a headache but from the point of badging onto the jetbridge to walking out the other end of the trip is about the most fun I think I am capable of having. And they pay me for it.
 
ja_user said:
I can confirm on the fractional side as well.

Maint and Scheduling are two different departments, and "It won't be ready today" often comes at 5pm or 8am, but never before a crew is sent to pick it up :)
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The plane was put on maintenance hold at 7:00 AM, We landed at 9:30 PM and the maintenance guys flew in after.
How many times did I think 'Why would they send the pilots to get the plane before they sent the guys to fix it?"
I think with about 30 minutes of thought and a pen and paper, I could save airlines millions of dollars.
 
I dropped a plane off at FTW on a Thursday night at 5pm. I was supposed to just hang out Friday and fly it at 8am Saturday. When I actually parked in front of the MX hangar, a mechanic asked why I had brought it to them and I got a "Well its not happening tomorrow, maybe next week? "

So yeah, it was actually one day's work as in 8 hours or so. But not the same day, and certainly not before the parts arrived.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
Mama said there'd be days like this...

I Had my first “bad” day since making this switch. So here's a day in the life of a reserve pilot that wasn't so great…
Click to expand...
What, not even an ASAP report filed? If that's your "bad day," you are living a charmed life!
SixPapaCharlie said:
Now I have the only job I have ever had where it is now mandated that I rest for 30 hours.
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Fatigue has been a significant contributing factor in scores of accidents and incidents. [edited to include the following] What may seem like a decadent luxury is, in reality, essential to safe operations. Of course it's on us to make the best use of our required rest period, which is a special skillset in and of itself.
SixPapaCharlie said:
All in all not a bad "bad" day. I was sharing this with a "seasoned" pilot this morning. He looked at my shoes and goes "Winter is coming. Get some boots. De-Ice fluid is slippery AF and tastes like S**t."

Looking forward to confirming that.
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Sorry, I have to admit that I've never tasted s**t, but the flavor of Type I is definitely preferable to that of Type IV. I'm rather partial to the delicate citrus-with-notes-of-boysenberry-and-toasted-walnut palate of Safewing MP I, but the aroma of Kilfrost DF is less cloyingly sweet after it makes a trip through the ACM.
 
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SixPapaCharlie said:
Being in base is a gift that allows a pilot so much flexibility. I am off for 3 days but I added myself to the overtime list so they can call me each day and say "If you see any trips you want, let me know and we will give em to you" That would be hard to do if not in base.
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#2 on my Top Two list on the topic of advice-to-new-airline-pilots. Depending on how many of your cohort commute, living in base can add about 25% to your effective seniority as the commuters build their entire career around the logistics and effort involved in just getting to and from work. And if I understand correctly, you didn't even have to relocate. Pure win.
 
Roger Wilco said:
#2 on my Top Two list on the topic of advice-to-new-airline-pilots. Depending on how many of your cohort commute, living in base can add about 25% to your effective seniority as the commuters build their entire career around the logistics and effort involved in just getting to and from work. And if I understand correctly, you didn't even have to relocate. Pure win.
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Yeah I got a buddy that finished IOE the same day I did. he just consolidated today. I've got about 40 hours on him. He's a commuter.
 
DJTorrente said:
Wasn't LUV and their C64-based internal operating systems the only airline running when the rest were down due to MS Cloudflare outage?
Click to expand...

Yes. Every airline melts down eventually….there’s a term (IROPs) for it. The point remains when you’re paid to fly when your employer says to fly, static holidays & life events suddenly can become dynamic if you so choose.
 
DJTorrente said:
Wasn't LUV and their C64-based internal operating systems the only airline running when the rest were down due to MS Cloudflare outage?
Click to expand...
Southwest had an epic meltdown over Christmas, 2022. It ran from December 21st through December 30th. Their IT system could not manage the recovery.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
I was sharing this with a "seasoned" pilot this morning. He looked at my shoes and goes "Winter is coming. Get some boots.
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First, he’s obviously an extrovert if he’s looking at your shoes instead of his own during a conversation.

Second, I wore boots most of my career. I did fly for one company that required us to wear shoes that snow and slush could easily get over the top of, though. Fortunately they got their operating certificate pulled by the FAA.
 
MauleSkinner said:
First, he’s obviously an extrovert if he’s looking at your shoes instead of his own during a conversation.

Second, I wore boots most of my career. I did fly for one company that required us to wear shoes that snow and slush could easily get over the top of, though. Fortunately they got their operating certificate pulled by the FAA.
Click to expand...

I so miss my AF flight boots. If I could find them new, I’d buy another pair in a heartbeat; those things were the best all around general purpose footwear I’ve ever come across.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
I think with about 30 minutes of thought and a pen and paper, I could save airlines millions of dollars.
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Nope. The KWT's* (ER grads Aviation Management) have it figured out and don't need any input from someone like a pilot (unless that pilot is a ER Alumni).

Management is full of these.


* "Kids With Ties"
 
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