Unable to Solo, Advice needed

Discussion in 'Pilot Training' started by Rajiv Sharma, Aug 23, 2020.

  1. Sinistar

    Sinistar En-Route

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2016
    Messages:
    3,134
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Brad
  2. smv

    smv Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2019
    Messages:
    1,663
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    smv
    Maybe I am missing something here, but of all of the items you listed, only PIOs would prevent me from signing off a student for solo. A PIO is indicative of someone who does not know when it is time to go around. Keep in mind the criteria for solo with regard to landing is not perfection, it is safety.

    Assuming all of the other pre-solo items are acceptable, the question I ask myself before signing of a student for solo is:
    "Can the student consistently bring the aircraft in for a safe landing (without my input) and do they have the judgement to abort the landing and go around (again, without my input) when they cannot bring the aircraft in for a safe landing?"

    Hard landings, landing to the side of the centerline, drifting after landing, and missing a specific spot are all proficiency items that can be practiced and "perfected" after the student goes solo. I do not even introduce short or soft field landings until after solo.

    Perhaps if you started acting more like Pilot in Command while flying with your instructor and making proper go-around decisions rather than riding a poor approach all the way to a PIO your instructor would be more willing to give you that solo endorsement.
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2020
    fiveninerzero and Trogdor like this.
  3. woodchucker

    woodchucker Cleared for Takeoff

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2014
    Messages:
    1,480
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    woodchucker
    A thread was started in 2015 about that “Jacobson Flare” thing by the same person promoting it here. The 2015 thread reads like a con job. Lol

    OP: you will get it. Do fly with a different cfi if you can. I wish I could say all of my landings are good landings but that would be a lie.
     
    dmspilot likes this.
  4. Ian Pilot

    Ian Pilot Ejection Handle Pulled

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2020
    Messages:
    10
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    IanPilot
    Well it boils down to a bad CFI really. A good CFI would have either gave you a solid assessment 45 hrs ago about your shortcomings and used some honesty to either dissuade you from flying or recommended a change of style. Your money is precious and a good CFI would not waste it. Your CFI is the PIC here.
    This is also about life and death... you could solo but with the plethora of issues you describe would you risk yourself on a x-country solo? Encounter gusty conditions etc... maybe you would be better off wishing you were up than up wishing you were down at some point.
    Now not all is lost. Reassess yourself. Study more. Change instructors and take a deep breathe and maybe you'll do it fine.
    I know plenty of 100+ hrs that solo'ed after wasting their time with the wrong cfi...

    https://www.rapp.org/archives/2015/11/reluctant-instructor/

    On the plus side once you do your IFR you will be that closer to the 250 hrs required for a commercial.
     
  5. Kritchlow

    Kritchlow Final Approach

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2014
    Messages:
    6,543
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Kritchlow
    Haven’t read all the posts, but I had two students I did not let solo until well over 60 hours.... and even then I was a bit concerned (but not beyond yet non solo point).

    They did great on everything, but were just afraid to pull the nose up enough before touchdown. Hours, hours, and hours... Eventually they flew with the chief instructor, and he seemed to think as long as they weren’t landing on the nose they were okay.
    I never compromised safety, but I did realize perhaps my standards were too high.
     
    smv and 1000RR like this.
  6. Palmpilot

    Palmpilot Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2007
    Messages:
    17,888
    Location:
    PUDBY
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Richard Palm
  7. Darwinson Valdez

    Darwinson Valdez Filing Flight Plan

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2020
    Messages:
    1
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    nosni1
    I thought I was never going to learn. I bought a cushion to sit higher in the Cessna and two hours later my landing improve tremendously. I solo two lessons after. I am 5 10 and using a cushion.
     
  8. Rajiv Sharma

    Rajiv Sharma Filing Flight Plan

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2020
    Messages:
    3
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Rajiv
    Hello Everyone

    Thanks for the encouragement, I decided to give it another shot. You guys are very helpful. I am very grateful for all the help I got in this forum.

    Here is the plan I came up with after listening to several experienced pilots and CFIs.

    1. Use gopro camera to record my flying lesson.
    2. Instead of doing touch and go, make it a full stop landing. Discuss landing in detail with CFI and then taxi back to runway.
    3. Focus more on nailing the speed on final.
    4. Break down landing in multiple areas like final approach, landing on center line, landing on main wheels, side drift, flare height etc. Review each landing in these areas.

    I have taken 2 lessons after building this plan, my CFI and I rate each landing in areas listed in #4.This helped figuring out what I am consistently doing right and where I was missing the mark. I think the last 2 lessons made me more comfortable with landings and my confidence has gone up.

    My CFI thinks that I can do a supervised solo in next lesson if weather is good.

    Thank you,
    Rajiv
     
    TCABM, Crashnburn, Mason and 4 others like this.
  9. Rajiv Sharma

    Rajiv Sharma Filing Flight Plan

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2020
    Messages:
    3
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Rajiv
    Update: I finally got my solo endorsement done yesterday. It only took 67 hours :rolleyes:

    Thanks everyone for all the support and encouragement.
     
  10. Vance Breese

    Vance Breese Line Up and Wait

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2014
    Messages:
    886
    Location:
    Nipomo, CA
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Vance Breese
    I love a story with a happy ending.
     
  11. WannFly

    WannFly Final Approach

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2016
    Messages:
    5,745
    Location:
    KFAR
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Priyo
    Nice congrats. It’s more time in the air.... isn’t that why you decided to be a pilot ?
     
  12. smv

    smv Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2019
    Messages:
    1,663
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    smv
    :cheers::happydance::rockon::goofy::cornut::biggrin:
     
  13. Rgbeard

    Rgbeard Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2017
    Messages:
    1,756
    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ and Ensenada, Mexico
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    rgbeard
    Congratulations, PILOT!
     
  14. MacFlier

    MacFlier Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2018
    Messages:
    252
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    MacFlier
    Congrats!!! I hope you enjoy your new and well deserved wings!
     
  15. SoCal 182 Driver

    SoCal 182 Driver Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Sep 11, 2019
    Messages:
    346
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    SoCal 182 Driver
    +1
     
  16. WDD

    WDD Cleared for Takeoff

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2019
    Messages:
    1,000
    Location:
    Atlanta / KRYY
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    WDD
    Congrats!
     
  17. MacFly

    MacFly Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    May 11, 2020
    Messages:
    375
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    MacFly
    You might find a GoPro mounted on the tail tie-down ring pointed forward to be illuminating regarding your landing technique.https://www.amazon.com/MyPilotPro-L...ht+camera+tie+down+ring&qid=1600562462&sr=8-1
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2020
  18. WDD

    WDD Cleared for Takeoff

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2019
    Messages:
    1,000
    Location:
    Atlanta / KRYY
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    WDD
    Now go get that solo x country and schedule your practical!!
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2020
  19. ArnoldPalmer

    ArnoldPalmer Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2015
    Messages:
    193
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    ArnoldPalmer
    I had this problem going from Cessna to a Piper. My flight pillow has helped tremendously in the Piper.
     
  20. WDD

    WDD Cleared for Takeoff

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2019
    Messages:
    1,000
    Location:
    Atlanta / KRYY
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    WDD
    I’m 5’11” and my control and landings are much better if I put the seat all the way up, just shy of my head hitting the headliner. I can’t tell you why - but for me it works
     
  21. Larry in TN

    Larry in TN Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2013
    Messages:
    1,756
    Location:
    Nashville, TN
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Larry in TN
    So, what was it that got everything to click for you?
     
  22. Kevin Eggert

    Kevin Eggert Pre-Flight

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2020
    Messages:
    50
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Kevin
    Congratulation! Hopefully the rest of your training goes better than the first part did.

    On a side note, in reading through these comments, there were an awful lot that seemed to criticize the instructor. Not knowing the particular student, I would have to think that there are a certain number of student pilots that may never be able to solo. Some people just do not have the particular set of skills needed to be a competant pilot able to fly on their own. At what point does a CFI sit down with these students to reevaluate their aspirations and bring them into the context of what is attainable? There have to be occasions where a student will never have the skills necessary and no amount of training will fix it. When is the proper time to "crush someone's dreams"?
     
    Busflyer likes this.
  23. bobmrg

    bobmrg En-Route PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2007
    Messages:
    3,176
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Bob Gardner
    For what it is worth, i never did touch-and-goes with a pre-solo student but insisted on full-stops and taxi back with me doing the taxiing and discussing what has just happened. The human brain can only handle so many sensory inputs at once, and making the student responsible for a safe landing and an immediate takeoff while the instructor is yammering in the student's ear is an impediment to learning. Half or more of what the instructor is saying is not assimilated.

    Bob