No Show Fee

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Racerx said:
Is it though? You came here to vent about it.

Sorry bud. You had the strength to go to the ER. You had the strength to send a text.
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"You were well enough to drag yourself to the ER... how sick could you have been?!?" Spoken like an employer of illegal labor who pines for the halcyon days of 19th century antebellum.
 
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bdoss2006 said:
Well what about when you’re badly sick, and are asleep almost around the clock, and the last thing on your mind is a flight lesson?
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I'm sorry you live a lone so there was no one else to call.

Two thoughts.

First, I think it is a good idea for a flight school or instructor with a stated cancellation policy to give a free ride on an illness no show. Once. Strict adherence on the first offense suggests (a) they are not worried about attrition and/or (b) are busy enough that if you cancelled, they would have been in a position to fill the slot.

Second, I understand you were really sick but, assuming the reasonableness of the policy (related to the first point) why is your illness their problem instead of yours?

{BTW, I have no official policy and don't charge for no shows, but your second time will be the last)
 
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the place I get my haircut at has a sign saying if you are a no-show to more than 1 appointment you get tar'd and feather'd and they also charge you the apt fee. I'm a man so I don't make haircut appointments but for those who do, they've been warned!
 
eman1200 said:
the place I get my haircut at has a sign saying if you are a no-show to more than 1 appointment you get tar'd and feather'd and they also charge you the apt fee. I'm a man so I don't make haircut appointments but for those who do, they've been warned!
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Sounds fair. But I'd want to watch the tar and feathering.
 
DJTorrente said:
"You were well enough to drag yourself to the ER... how sick could you have been?!?" Spoken like an employer of illegal labor who pines for the halcyon days of 17th century antebellum.
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Weird take. The alternative would be to hike rates by some 5 or 10% so that they could distribute no-fault no-cost no-shows to anyone who "didn't feel like it"? Maybe we could crib from Arrested Development and call this flight school Maeby Flight. :)

Then the school is noncompetitive in its area and withers. Possibly due to CFI attrition unless the school pays them for flights not taken due to the above. Or due to the rates otherwise.

It sounds like the instructor/school gave grace for this one time "didn't feel like it", which seems reasonable to me
 
To the OP - you need to step back from your emotions and ask yourself a few questions:

1. What is my end goal as a pilot?

If the end goal is the airlines or pretty much any type of transportation for hire, you absolutely need to learn to prioritize quickly letting someone know if you likely won’t be available for health reasons. Airline passengers are quite unhappy when flights are delayed.

2. How would I feel in a broke-ish instructor’s shoes in this situation? - because you might be that instructor in a few years…

3. Most of us have done this at some point, maybe not on a forum, but your posts and replies suggest to me that your first post, despite being posted as a question, was mostly seeking validation, rather than learning a different perspective. Are you willing to consider that sometimes your personal perspective could be wrong?

4. Most of us have had stomach viruses before. This isn’t something new or unique. Your reply to my post using ALL CAPS is internet for yelling… which makes it seem like you are pretty uptight with people who disagree with you or point out a hole in your argument. Is this something you want to display in a cockpit as a first officer?
 
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DJTorrente said:
"You were well enough to drag yourself to the ER... how sick could you have been?!?" Spoken like an employer of illegal labor who pines for the halcyon days of 17th century antebellum.
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Terrible take. It takes zero effort to send a text message. ZERO. OP probably had plenty of time while sitting in the ER waiting room. It's literally just a lack of concern for inconveniencing the CFI and impacting their livelihood. "I didn't feel like it" is just about the crappiest response one could have for the situation.
 
bdoss2006 said:
Yall I need some advice. I had a lesson scheduled this past Saturday, and Friday morning I woke up sick with a stomach virus. I wound up in the ER the majority of Friday morning, and even a week later I am still not 100% better. Well as you might imagine, I was still really sick on Saturday, and slept pretty much all day, and didn’t think to call or text my instructor to cancel. I woke up approximately 3.5 hours after the lesson time, and immediately texted and apologized and told him what had happened. Well today I was looking at my bank account, and noticed a $215 charge I wasn’t expecting. I texted him about it, and he said it was a no show fee from Saturday. I don’t think that is fair considering I was sick. What’s yalls thoughts and what should I do?
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bdoss2006 said:
Well I just don’t understand how that’s fair as sick as I was. I could never do that to someone if the roles were reversed.
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Really? You had no problem having your CFI shower, drive to work and stand around earning nothing because you couldn’t be bothered to send a text.

You also had no problem with another student and instructor being unable to use the aircraft you had reserved.

Grow up.
 
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MauleSkinner said:
How is “they applied a policy to me that applies to everyone, and I’m not happy about it,” not a victim mentality?
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There are many examples in history of "legal" "policies" that were nonetheless abusive of those to whom they were applied, and which, not coincidentally, would never have been established by those who did so had they the slightest inkling that they themselves might be subject to them.

Is OP a "victim"? in the strict sense of the language, probably. But I think it is abundantly apparent that the phrase "victim mentality" was used pejoratively. I can only assume the person who used it was never incapacitated by illness at any time in their life. More strength to him if so.
 
bdoss2006 said:
noticed a $215 charge
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midwestpa24 said:
Perhaps it is to be punitive, or perhaps it is not only compensating for the instructor but the lost rental on the aircraft as well.
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I figured $215 was about 3 hours at $70/hr. The instructor want to be paid for being at work. Employer still needs to pay taxes, insurance, benefits (if that a thing for a CFI.
 
DJTorrente said:
There are many examples in history of "legal" "policies" that were nonetheless abusive of those to whom they were applied, and which, not coincidentally, would never have been established by those who did so had they the slightest inkling that they themselves might be subject to them.
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Not relevant, as the OP didn’t establish the policy, and we have absolutely no evidence that the people who did establish it think it shouldn’t apply to themselves.
DJTorrente said:
Is OP a "victim"? in the strict sense of the language, probably. But I think it is abundantly apparent that the phrase "victim mentality" was used pejoratively.
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Agreed…and again, we have no evidence to he contrary.
DJTorrente said:
I can only assume the person who used it was never incapacitated by illness at any time in their life. More strength to him if so.
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Or possibly when he was incapacitated, he still accepted that he had made commitments that needed to be honored.
 
MauleSkinner said:
Not relevant, as the OP didn’t establish the policy, and we have absolutely no evidence that the people who did establish it think it shouldn’t apply to themselves.
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We might ask the school for a copy of the refund receipt when they cancelled a student -- likely on zero notice -- because their plane was down for maintenance. How common is that in the industry? Like I said -- one-way "policy".
 
DJTorrente said:
We might ask the school for a copy of the refund receipt when they cancelled a student -- likely on zero notice -- because their plane was down for maintenance. How common is that in the industry? Like I said -- one-way "policy".
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That wouldn’t make it unfair, nor make the OP a victim.
 
DJTorrente said:
We might ask the school for a copy of the refund receipt when they cancelled a student -- likely on zero notice -- because their plane was down for maintenance. How common is that in the industry? Like I said -- one-way "policy".
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Let’s compare an illness 24 hour prior to a flight and maintenance.

Most flight schools today use online booking. When the plane is cancelled on Friday for a Saturday reservation, the student gets notified by email on Friday. Even if the plane goes down an hour before the lesson, the student gets a notification.
 
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Clip4 said:
Let’s compare an illness 24 hour prior to a flight and maintenance.

Most flight schools today use online booking. When the plane is cancelled on Friday for a Saturday reservation, the student gets notified by emai on Friday.
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And whatever the maintenance cancellation policy of the flight school is, the OP accepted it along with the no show policy when he scheduled the lesson.
 
DJTorrente said:
There are many examples in history of "legal" "policies" that were nonetheless abusive of those to whom they were applied, and which, not coincidentally, would never have been established by those who did so had they the slightest inkling that they themselves might be subject to them.

Is OP a "victim"? in the strict sense of the language, probably. But I think it is abundantly apparent that the phrase "victim mentality" was used pejoratively. I can only assume the person who used it was never incapacitated by illness at any time in their life. More strength to him if so.
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You're right about one thing - I did use it pejoratively because, in this instance, in this context, it's accurate.
 
Get a note from the doc and show him and talk to him, many people say they are “sick” when they are not.

If I were the CFI and you were legit sick, had a tire blow out, wife went into labor, or other real reason you didn’t show I’d probably let it go as long as it was not a recurring thing, just feels the right thing to do

If it really bothers you get a different CFI, though this may set you back a little in training.

If you’re close to solo or finishing is probably worse case suck it up, sadly $200 isn’t too much in the world of flight training, however I would have zero sympathy for any lateness, forgot his notes, etc on the CFIs part. I do agree (if this was your first no show) he set a bad tone


Enforcing rules without injecting some common sense is as bad as not having any rules at all
 
Racerx said:
Is it though? You came here to vent about it.

Sorry bud. You had the strength to go to the ER. You had the strength to send a text.
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No I came here to ask for advice. It was resolved after I posted here.

That is a stupid statement. I work in EMS, and I can tell you not everyone that goes to the ER is capable of sending a text…
 
midlifeflyer said:
I'm sorry you live a lone so there was no one else to call.

Two thoughts.

First, I think it is a good idea for a flight school or instructor with a stated cancellation policy to give a free ride on an illness no show. Once. Strict adherence on the first offense suggests (a) they are not worried about attrition and/or (b) are busy enough that if you cancelled, they would have been in a position to fill the slot.

Second, I understand you were really sick but, assuming the reasonableness of the policy (related to the first point) why is your illness their problem instead of yours?

{BTW, I have no official policy and don't charge for no shows, but your second time will be the last)
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I don’t live alone. Never said I did
 
TCABM said:
Itneresting takes here; quite a polarizing topic.
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There are polarizing views on almost every "take responsibility" issue. Often the view is result-oriented. IOW, the people will be on one side when they like the result and on the other side when they don't like the result.
 
RyanShort1 said:
To the OP - you need to step back from your emotions and ask yourself a few questions:

1. What is my end goal as a pilot?

If the end goal is the airlines or pretty much any type of transportation for hire, you absolutely need to learn to prioritize quickly letting someone know if you likely won’t be available for health reasons. Airline passengers are quite unhappy when flights are delayed.

2. How would I feel in a broke-ish instructor’s shoes in this situation? - because you might be that instructor in a few years…

3. Most of us have done this at some point, maybe not on a forum, but your posts and replies suggest to me that your first post, despite being posted as a question, was mostly seeking validation, rather than learning a different perspective. Are you willing to consider that sometimes your personal perspective could be wrong?

4. Most of us have had stomach viruses before. This isn’t something new or unique. Your reply to my post using ALL CAPS is internet for yelling… which makes it seem like you are pretty uptight with people who disagree with you or point out a hole in your argument. Is this something you want to display in a cockpit as a first officer?
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This was not my first post, and it was not asking for validation, it was asking for advice. It wasn’t a hole in my argument. Please explain to me how it was. I said that in all caps because he said he had been taught to keep from getting dehydrated. It is extremely hard or impossible to stay hydrated with a stomach virus, hence why I went to the ER. I was emphasizing that’s what I had. I never plan to be a first officer as I’m only doing sport pilot.
 
SoonerAviator said:
Terrible take. It takes zero effort to send a text message. ZERO. OP probably had plenty of time while sitting in the ER waiting room. It's literally just a lack of concern for inconveniencing the CFI and impacting their livelihood. "I didn't feel like it" is just about the crappiest response one could have for the situation.
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Actually they got me back really quick as a matter of fact, and when sitting in the ER waiting room I couldn’t hold my head. That is absolutely not an exaggeration. It does not take “ZERO” effort to send a text.
 
bdoss2006 said:
I mean there was, but I just didn’t think of it I felt so bad
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...and that's understandable. I probably would have forgotten too. And I would have asked for forgiveness from the no-show fee. But I also would have understood if the answer was "no" because, after all, while it may not have been my fault, it was my problem.
 
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