How did you handle pushy parents that demand their kid solo at 10 hours and get their license at 45...but their kid is mediocre.

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Princesspilot206

Princesspilot206

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Princesspilot
I am about ready to pass this kid off to someone else because his parents are basically telling me he has to solo to get into a good college. It would look better on his application. The kid flies...okay...but is shy and hesitates to make calls on the radio. It's beyond me that they do not value their kids safety and are prioritizing some achievement that cant wait.
 
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I'm not a CFI (so, probably no help).

I'm wondering why soloing is at all useful for getting "into a good college."

Does the kid love to fly?

In any case, I imagine it's important for the CFI to recognize the times when the student isn't a good match for the instructor.
 
Not a CFI. But...Don't be like your student. Speak up. Be direct. Explain what your cert means and the responsibility you bear.

End with, "it will happen when it happens". If they want it to happen sooner tell their kid to study and be assertive or find a new instructor willing to overlook performance gaps.
 
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Princesspilot206 said:
I am about ready to pass this kid off to someone else because his parents are basically telling me he has to solo to get into a good college. It would look better on his application. The kid flies...okay...but is shy and hesitates to make calls on the radio. It's beyond me that they do not value their kids safety and are prioritizing some achievement that cant wait.
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Don’t pass your problem along to someone else. And don’t be vague or wish-washy about this. Be professional and direct.

Have a serious sit-down discussion with the kid and parents. Clearly and directly state the deficiencies preventing him from soloing, make your recommendations for how he can correct them, and lay out a plan with milestones. Then they can decide whether to continue with you or go elsewhere.

Is the radio his only problem? That should be easy to resolve.
 
I've seen that. The parent(s) make every decision for the kid. They tell him what he can or cannot say. So he grows up like that, unable to break free of the oppression and move forward.
 
Does this kid really wanna do this, or is it parents pushing it? Have a talk with the parents about what your standards are, they may want to go to another CFI. And worst case scenario, you are not obligated to be the CFI. I have passed off many students in my life. It isn’t worth the aggravation.
 
By the time he is 45 he will be able to make his own decisions. On a more serious note, I had school operators, friends, tell me they didn't want to deal with a spoiled kid who did not want to excel. They were right. Last year HE made the choice to advance. I respect the advice my friends gave, they see it daily. Follow your gut.
 
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Sounds to me like the parents don’t have the $$ for this and they are trying to push the process.

Regardless if you retain the student, I would advise the parents that 10 hour solo is pretty much unheard of these days, the average is 14-20, and a student solos after a student demonstrates satisfactory proficiency and safety, as judged by the instructor, on the maneuvers and procedures required in 61.87 - not hours in a logbook.

If you don’t maintain training folders for your students, stuff like this is when you need to so you can show the parents the student’s progress and where proficiency is still lacking.
 
Ed Haywood said:
"Do you want your kid to die?"
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Well, in my best example the kid DID NOT fly well…

I told the mom that to facilitate the solo demand I had arranged a little deal with the faa and rather than solo SHE was to accompany her child on the flight. Grabbed a headset and headed to the door.

This is unusual for me, but every once in a while… you just gotta do what ya gotta do.

16 yr old girl who would just let go of the controls at ANY point to grab her phone and take a pic! Among a thousand other things.
 
Tools said:
....

16 yr old girl who would just let go of the controls at ANY point to grab her phone and take a pic! Among a thousand other things.
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:eek:
 
I haven’t been in the training world for many decades. But I thought the standard was a check off from another instructor at each milepost. Maybe that’s just for the license check ride. Regardless, I’d have the student fly with another instructor just to ensure you’re seeing the situation clearly. Try not to poison the well & just ask the instructor to ride with the student & check your work.

If the student is not ready, the student is not ready. And it is confirmed.
If you are being too cautious, that’s good to know.
If the student & the other instructor click in a different way, that is a positive outcome too. Pass the student on.

Odd notion (and expensive) these parents have.
 
Maybe if you have more than 50 hours to solo the Majors won’t hire you?
 
Since 61.87 is complete and as long as another instructor validates his ability to fly, then I guess I will solo him. He better be perfect his whole training. I'm holding him to an incredibly high standard, and if he is not checkride ready at 45 hours, Im going to make it abundantly clear to his parents they need to back the f up. His dad is only a private pilot that flies an RV 8. The kid is smart, and is graduating hs early, but he is also a marching band nerd. I'll see if he performs as good as his parents make him feel like he is capable of doing.
 
Princesspilot206 said:
Since 61.87 is complete and as long as another instructor validates his ability to fly, then I guess I will solo him. He better be perfect his whole training. I'm holding him to an incredibly high standard, and if he is not checkride ready at 45 hours, Im going to make it abundantly clear to his parents they need to back the f up. His dad is only a private pilot that flies an RV 8. The kid is smart, and is graduating hs early, but he is also a marching band nerd. I'll see if he performs as good as his parents make him feel like he is capable of doing.
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Could it be a money thing? My Son got his ppl local flying school with a open checkbook.
He finished in a reasonable time.

Did the school pad it a little? Possibly but I chalked it up to just building hours.
 
rhkennerly said:
I haven’t been in the training world for many decades. But I thought the standard was a check off from another instructor at each milepost. Maybe that’s just for the license check ride.
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Not required for Part 61 training for either solo or the checkride. Never a bad idea, just not required.
 
Princesspilot206 said:
His dad is only a private pilot that flies an RV 8.
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I resent your use of the word "only," but setting that aside for the moment......

Why not strap dad in the backseat for a flight and let him see first hand what your concerns are? Is dad flying the RV-8 with the kid and letting him take the controls?
 
Princesspilot206 said:
his parents are basically telling me he has to solo to get into a good college. It would look better on his application.
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It’s been a few years since I’ve applied to colleges and grad schools, but they were all exceptionally ‘good’ schools, and NOT ONE had an ‘hours to solo’ question on the application
 
Princesspilot206 said:
I am about ready to pass this kid off to someone else because his parents are basically telling me he has to solo to get into a good college. It would look better on his application. The kid flies...okay...but is shy and hesitates to make calls on the radio. It's beyond me that they do not value their kids safety and are prioritizing some achievement that cant wait.
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Has the person passed the written exam?

If not make that a requirements. Lessons learned coming from a parent. Now my two are stalled they soloed but no written and I don’t know how to help.
 
Half Fast said:
I resent your use of the word "only," but setting that aside for the moment......

Why not strap dad in the backseat for a flight and let him see first hand what your concerns are? Is dad flying the RV-8 with the kid and letting him take the controls?
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That sounds like a recipe to get two people on the plane giving instruction, despite only one qualified to do so. Would be a hard pass for me after the OP's scenario.
 
I do think dad has let his kid fly enough to be under the impression/expectation bias that his kid could solo in 10 hours.

But good chance the kid was always single-tasking things.

Now, 10hr solo could be their way to show how much above average the kid is, compared to his college-aspiring peers.

I'd say having another CFI take a look at him is a great idea.
 
GaryM said:
It’s been a few years since I’ve applied to colleges and grad schools, but they were all exceptionally ‘good’ schools, and NOT ONE had an ‘hours to solo’ question on the application
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:yeahthat:

What sort of college is this kid heading for, anyway? IIRC, "Have you flown an aircraft solo?" wasn't on my application to Ga Tech. I guess if he doesn't solo, maybe he can go there instead....
 
schmookeeg said:
That sounds like a recipe to get two people on the plane giving instruction, despite only one qualified to do so. Would be a hard pass for me after the OP's scenario.
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Easily handled. The CFI is still PIC, and dad doesn't have flight controls in the backseat. If dad doesn't stay quiet, land. Lesson is over.
 
A set of college degreed parents pointedly asserting not merely PPL completion, but initial solo training milestone, as an inflection point of any consequence in a college application? yeah, I'll take 'things that didn't happen as stated' for 200 Alex....
 
Tools said:
16 yr old girl who would just let go of the controls at ANY point to grab her phone and take a pic! Among a thousand other things.
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Think of it this way:

In a car, she's only got a few seconds before she hits something when she does that. In a plane, you've got more time to realize how bad you screwed up before the impact occurs.
 
tsts4 said:
Tell them you train to standard and not time. Explain where the kid is falling short. If they don’t like the explanation tell them politely that they are free to move on to another CFI.
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I might start by telling the kid the situation and what he needs to do to solo, no matter how many hours it takes. Then see what the parents report back the next time they chopper in. There could be several communication breakdowns between the OP and the parents, but the link from teenage child to parent has these traits: outside the direct observation of the CFI, likely to cause issues in the parent-CFI link, and unlikely to be 100% accurate.
 
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