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Discussion in 'Medical Topics' started by WannFly, Feb 25, 2021.
Hmm... Makes me wonder, have you had an antibody test at any point?
Very early, and was negative. But yeah, the thought seems to be I had some exposure so I got the typical second shot reaction first.
Pfizer #2 yesterday morning. Maybe a little fatigue late in the day, but nothing else to speak of. I've had worse soreness after a strenuous workout.
There was a bug in version 3.25 of the microchip software - but that should auto-update next time you are near a 5g tower. In the meantime, just don't hold your forearm over the scanner in the grocery store to avoid revealing your personal information.
Forearm? I thought it was forehead and back of right hand.
It's now been almost 48 hours and still zero side effects from the second. Counting myself lucky.
"The CDC says the study also demonstrated that the two mRNA vaccines can reduce the risk of all SARS-CoV-2 infections, not just symptomatic infections."
This is a big deal, because if a vaccinated person could get an asymptomatic infection, that person might be able to pass on the virus to others. This study result alleviates that concern.
Here's the actual paper:
Interesting report. Thanks for sharing.
Has anyone seen anything saying annual update shots will be recommended? Like we get for the other influenzas?
I'm still seeing speculation. The vaccines have good potential to be long-lasting against the strains that are out there now. But that isn't yet proven--they've not been in use long enough.
Real world protection is decent against all strains that are known now--protection level varies with the strain, but no current strains elude the vaccines. BUT, if new strains emerge that the current vaccines can't immunize against, it would likely require periodic updates to immunize against the new strains. Too soon to tell if that will happen.
We get flu shots annually because the flu strain is different.
From what I’ve seen the CV vaccines target a protein that’s on the outside of the virus. As far as anyone can tell, the new CV strains that pop up have that same protein.
That's pretty much how I understand it. The protein is the antigen. Hopefully we create antibodies that bind to the antigens and prevent the virus from entering our cells. A virus can't reproduce on its own. Put it in a Petri dish and it doesn't multiply. It can only reproduce using a host. The more times the virus reproduces, the more possibilities for it to mutate. Most mutations are either benign, or kill the virus. But occasionally, a mutation results in a more successful virus. So the best way to stop new COVID strains from appearing is to reduce its ability to reproduce. We do that by limiting the number of available hosts it can infect.
So how did it go?
Mrs. Half Fast and I received our second Pfizer shots at noon on Friday. By the afternoon I was feeling tired, but otherwise fine. I was glad when bedtime rolled around, as by nighttime I was feeling pretty whipped.
Then I got up at about 3 a.m. to go to the john, and WOW - I felt like I'd been hit by a truck. Aches all over, chills, dizzy, generally felt crappy. Saturday was rough for both my wife and me. Dosing with ibuprofen helped quite a bit, but we still had body aches and didn't move much all day. I spent most of Saturday dozing in a recliner. By Sunday morning, though, we felt much better. Still needed a nap this afternoon, and my shoulder is pretty sore, but otherwise the effects seem to have passed.
I don't know what causes some folks to react and not others. My 33 year old daughter got her second shot at the same time we did and had zero reaction. My 83 year old mother got her second on Tuesday and also had no reaction.
#1 Moderna a couple days ago. Didn't feel anything until about 12 hours later, then a slight ache in the arm. The next day I had a mild headache, but nothing bad.
Did two shots of Moderna in March, no problems with either one. Actually went smoothly both times, even in the goofiest state in the country. Had a friend semd me a video assuring me mass deaths are on the way for all shot takers, so that was pretty swell.
Thursday AM I get Pfizer #2. Will see if I end up taking Friday off.
The chills, fever and muscle aches are mediated by substances like TNF, IL-1 and IL-6 which are released as part of the immune reaction. There are individual differences in how much of this stuff is being released and how the remainder of the body reacts to it.
While the vaccines are still "experimental", me and my wife will keep taking Ivermectin
Ivermectin isn't even 'experimental' in treatment of COVID. It's good stuff for treating various parasitic infections, but it isn't an antiviral.
Don't get hung up on the fact that the three vaccines approved in the US were initially approved under Emergency Use Authorizations. Between them, they enrolled over 100,000 people in the phase three clinical trials, and the results for both safety and efficacy were spectacular. Most drugs that gain full FDA approval, as these will, enroll fewer than 2000 people in their phase three trials.
Yes, what GaryM said. The FDA specifically says NOT to take Ivermectin.
And if the term experimental is a hangup for you, I heard that Phizer is now seeking full FDA approval. So very soon, you'll be able to get on the wagon with a drug that we KNOW works.
I have an appointment tomorrow. Our county just opened up to everyone.
The Pfizer, Moderna, and J&J COVID vaccines are not "experimental." Emergency use authorization doesn't equate to the release of experimental products to the general population. The EUA for COVID vaccines allowed them to jump some regulatory time limits to get the next stage rolling while the phase 3 testing was still going on and allowed the approval of certain non-clinical aspects (manufacturing, etc...) that normally would have been serially done with the pre-release testing.
If you've signed up to get the drug, you should have been given the information on the benefits and risks for the particular one you were offered.
I've got mine even though I'm generally adverse to medications, especially for conditions that may only be inconvenient or uncomfortable but otherwise self-limiting. COVID, in my opinion, is not.
Pfizer #2 was last Thursday. Other than the bandaid pulling on arm hairs, it was a non-event with no side effects, much like my experience with #1.
I had ‘rona back in October in hindsight, had positive antibodies when I donated blood in November. Was expecting to get significant side effects when I got the vaccine but was pleasantly surprised to get nothing but a mildly sore arm from both doses of Moderna. Didn’t need to take or do anything either time.
I actually give shots at our city’s sites around town two days a week (all Moderna) - about 100 each day. I’ve been pleasantly surprised how very, very few people have had significant reaction to the first shot, young or old, previously infected or not. I obviously can’t follow up after second shots but word from patients about others they know who have had the second shot is equally encouraging.
By the way, as I’ve posted in other threads before, I didn’t honestly think I had the infection at the time but I completely lost my sense of smell and my sense of taste was really messed up. Taste is much better (but not normal) and SOME smell has returned but, nearly 6 months later, it is not even close to normal.
Yeah, there's no mention of "experimental" on the consent/information form.
The fact sheet says says:
"The Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine is an unapproved vaccine that may prevent COVID-19. There is no FDA-approved vaccine to prevent COVID-19."
"The Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine has not undergone the same type of review as an FDA-approved or cleared product. FDA may issue an EUA when certain criteria are met, which includes that there are no adequate, approved, available alternatives. In addition, the FDA decision is based on the totality of scientific evidence available showing that the product may be effective to prevent COVID-19 during the COVID-19 pandemic and that the known and potential benefits of the product outweigh the known and potential risks of the product. All of these criteria must be met to allow for the product to be used in the treatment of patients during the COVID-19 pandemic."
Just musing here: what you cite says it’s approved in part because there are no “adequate, approved alternatives”. Once one player gets full FDA approval I wonder if that instantly gives them a monopoly until others are fully approved as well; I wonder if approval of one undoes the EUA of all the others because there is now an “adequate, approved alternative”.
I suspect that won’t happen and the FDA will make a legitimate exception to the exceptions but it’s interesting to consider...
It wouldn't mean an instant monopoly. 'Adequate' here means 'available in sufficient quantities'. So Pfizer was approved under an EUA because it met safety and efficacy targets and there was no alternative, Moderna and J&J were approved despite there being an alternative (the recently-approved Pfizer vaccine), but it wasn't available in sufficient quantities. So I suppose one or two of the EUAs could be rescinded once there is sufficient vaccine to immunize everyone who wants it, but I suspect that won't happen.
EUAs can only be issued in response to certain declared Public Health Emergencies, and when the that regulatory trigger expires, so does the EUA. So EUAs are temporary...but one or more vaccines will gain full FDA approval so that use could continue even when Covid is no longer a declared Public Health Emergency.
A reference on EUAs
Got Pfizer #1 last week when California opened up to age 50 and above. Some soreness in my arm and, strangely, in my neck on the same side as the injection. Got tired and blah feeling later in the day, but by the next day all that remained was a bit of arm soreness.
26 hours after Pfizer dose 2, so far so good..... fingers crossed
Update : little bit of fatigue later in the day.
Shot done. Now I'm grounded for 48. Airplane is in annual anyway. Timed that right.
The FDA follows WHO recommendations. If WHO says NO that means YES
I'm not following the logic in your statement. Just curious... Why do you eschew proven vaccines, yet jump up in favor of the off-label use of a drug that the FDA specifically warns against? I'd really love to hear how you arrived at your somewhat odd conclusion.
No, it doesn't. The FDA is an independent organization. So is the CDC.
The amount of ivermectin you would have to take to equal that shown to have anti-viral qualities in a petri dish would make you very sick or kill you, despite the fact that it's a super safe drug in normal dosage.
As with a couple other posters, I find it very weird that you would choose a drug that hasn't ever been shown to do anything useful over the three vaccines that have been given safely to hundreds of millions of people and demonstrated to work.
Fully vaccinated since late February. Pfizer. Minimal side effects after first dose, pretty strong arm pain after second dose. Neither dose kept me from going about my day but I could barely lift my arm much at all for 24 hours after dose 2.
Also got an antibody test 2 weeks ago, and very impressed. My post-vaccine antibodies came back about 6 times stronger than the average person who has natural immunity.
The current vaccines will be effective for just bout any strain of COVID. The virus infects human cells through its spike protein, which binds the angiotensin converting enzyme 2 very tightly, that's what's allowed the virus to be so successful in humans. The spike protein is the target of all the vaccines. If the virus were to mutate the spike protein to the point of unrecognizability by a polyclonal antiserum, it is unlikely that the spike protein would still have affinity for the ACE2 receptor. That affinity is the virus' secret weapon.
These vaccines are nothing short of amazing. Produced in a year with astounding efficacy, they are truly medical miracles. It is a pity we haven't a culture that can effectively recognize this.
Got Pfizer #2 5 minutes ago. 10 more minutes of scrolling around on POA and then it’s back to work to figure out what I’m going to do for lunch today.
The wife and I had Moderna #1 yesterday.
This morning I feel like I have been working too hard, achy joints and muscles with the injection site really sensitive to touch.
My wife is feeling pretty bad. She feels achy and is complaining of a lot of pain in her upper arm where the injection was as well as a strong headache.
We were walk in customers. I took my mom for her #2 shot, and asked the pharmacist if he could take us. We filled out the paperwork, rolled up our sleeves and was out the door in 30 minutes from the time we walked in.
My mom is 89 and after shot #1 she said the injection site was sore, and so far the same for shot #2.
When I quote this to people it would be helpful if I could mention what field you're in
They didn't call it WARP speed for nuth'n....yup it was amazing and miraculous.
Yeah, man. It's a modern miracle. To put another impressive metric out there. It was 75 days after an unexplained disease hit Wuhan and 66 days after the first genetic sequence that the first vaccine (Moderna) entered Phase 1 trials.
I think it's really hard for most people to understand the magnitude of the bullet we dodge by having sars-cov-2 arrive at the end of 2019 instead of even 20 years earlier.