Cheap Modern Sedans (Cars)

Sounds like your mind is already made up, but I'd consider selling it for a couple of reasons:

1. When you sell something it has to have value to the buyer. Being an 05 with that mileage a dealer can still retail it and someone can still finance it, you still have some good resale value. Look how sharply a cars value falls off after a certain age or mileage. Something 15 years old with 200K+ is a $2k car.

2. Car mechanics make a lot more than airplane mechanics. In my area they charge about $80-90 per hour. I'm sure your area isn't cheap either. Do you know what your car will be worth after you do all those repairs? The same as it was the day before.

3. Money is cheap right now. If you have to put these repairs on a credit card at a high interest rate compared to car financing, how does that make sense?

4. I assume your car is a necessity for work. How about the cost and inconvenience of having your car in the shop to do all of these repairs? Or breaking down and having to find other transportation? This is bound to happen much more often as a car ages.

5. Fiscal consistency. You already mentioned it, but having a predictable payment is better than having some major problem and having to come up with the money to fix it.

I would agree with the other posters if you had the ability to self maintain. Or you had multiple vehicles so that if one broke down you could still get by. However, in this case I don't see it.

I'd take the $149 payment on a new one, with a warranty. If you want to get ahead, try to pay the next one off early and keep putting that payment in the bank.
 
bbchien said:
do the clutch and the exhaust FIRST. These are immediate safety items. The exhaust may be MUCH less than you think.
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Why would you replace a clutch unless it has started to slip? A clutch gives a LOT of warning before it fails and until it starts slipping badly, the car is driveable. The time between the first time you feel/hear a clutch slip and when it becomes a real aggravation is weeks or months...
 
Dan Thomas said:
I drive a 2006 Hyundai Sonata, easily the best car I have ever owned. Phil Edmunston (of Lemon Aid fame) says that Hyundai is building better cars than anything coming out of Japan. Indeed, the Elantra won Car of the Year awards at at least two shows in the last two weeks.
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Best article I ever read about Hyundai (dated late 2009):

http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/10/value-proposition/
The opening lines just cracked me up:

I rented a Hyundai.
They pulled up this eggplant colored piece of ****, with the Coke-bottle flairs over the rear wheels, and I winced. A Hyundai? Wasn’t there anything else?
​
 
Bright Child decided she 'needed' a better car than her almost-free pickup truck. So against strong maternal advice, she bought a pretty little Toyota for 'only' so much a month. A couple of years later she was T-boned, the car was totaled, and she 'only' had six payments left. She was devastated to still have payments on a car that was in a junkyard. Mama, bless her little heart, didn't say a word. Didn't have to.

Mama's car, BTW, is an embarrassment. A 1995 Volvo, original clutch, very little maintenance required, and no idea how many miles... the odometer broke as soon as the warranty expired, at 115,000. The car, though very esthetically challenged, still hums like a top. Every time I consider replacing it, I remember that involves dealing with car salesmen, and I get over it.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
So then I wonder why mine is still good at 130K?
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My jeep went over 220,000 on one clutch. The only reason I replaced it is the throw out cylinder failed.

Did 130,000miles on my F150 before the throw out cylinder started leaking.

I agree the most economical thing is keep it and use the money you save on payments to get maintain and repair it. I typically spend less then a new car payment per year on maintenance on my jeep with 273,000 miles on it.

Brian
 
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kimberlyanne546 said:
Tires just aren't cheap.
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Yes they are.... you're just not looking at the correct source. See my previous post on what I sell tires for.

There has to be a local recycler or used tire shop in your area who can get you a set of tires with mounting and balancing for less than $200 for all 4.
 
Amelia said:
Mama's car, BTW, is an embarrassment. A 1995 Volvo, original clutch, very little maintenance required, and no idea how many miles... the odometer broke as soon as the warranty expired, at 115,000. The car, though very esthetically challenged, still hums like a top. Every time I consider replacing it, I remember that involves dealing with car salesmen, and I get over it.
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I love my Volvo. Volvos seem to be indestructible. I've heard a joke about them: Volvo stands for "vehicle outlives vehicle owner".

If you don't want to deal with car salesmen, you can order a new Volvo with Overseas Delivery, which is a set price, no haggling involved. You pick your new car up in Goteborg, Sweden, drive around Europe, drop it back, Volvo ships it back to you, all in a set price less than MSRP here. You can get an even better deal if you buy one that someone else ordered, but then decided they didn't want, and it's just sitting there in Goteborg. I ordered a Volvo by OSD a few years ago, and it was great fun.
 
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bbchien said:
There is very little that is worse enslavement than debt. Keep the car. :)
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Double this!

In today's America, debt is normal. It's very calming to be wierd!
 
bluee said:
I love my Volvo. Volvos seem to be indestructible. I've heard a joke about them: Volvo stands for "vehicle outlives vehicle owner".
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BTW, I just acquired a 01 S40 1.9T at auction recently. Will be parting it out once it gets here from New Orleans.

.
 

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Amelia said:
Bright Child decided she 'needed' a better car than her almost-free pickup truck. So against strong maternal advice, she bought a pretty little Toyota for 'only' so much a month. A couple of years later she was T-boned, the car was totaled, and she 'only' had six payments left. She was devastated to still have payments on a car that was in a junkyard. Mama, bless her little heart, didn't say a word. Didn't have to.

Mama's car, BTW, is an embarrassment. A 1995 Volvo, original clutch, very little maintenance required, and no idea how many miles... the odometer broke as soon as the warranty expired, at 115,000. The car, though very esthetically challenged, still hums like a top. Every time I consider replacing it, I remember that involves dealing with car salesmen, and I get over it.
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Old Volvos never run right and never stop running. There's a whole cultural thing about this that an author named Trevanian mentioned in Shibumi. Basically the characters put a new dent in the Volvo every time they get in or out of the car, because it won't die so they can replace it with a clear conscience.
 
Find a mechanic you can trust. They are out there, and you generally find them word of mouth. Ask around. Have them evaluate the car. There is the possibility of being nickel and dimed to death by keeping an old car, even a Honda, running. Be honest, have you changed the oil regularly, checked diff lube, changed filters and all that? If you have, you are a rare woman indeed.
If the car passes muster, (good compressions, good trans, oil pressure measured by a mechanical guage bearings, wheel and driveline all in spec) then keep the car and replace the wear items. If not, sell it and purchase a well-researched new car, maintain it and keep it forever.

0r buy a used, well maintained Jeep Cherokee, after having it checked out by aforementioned mechanic. Suckers last forever, and ask very little in return. Bought mine new in '89, 300k on the clock and runs like new. AW4 transmissions are bulletproof, as are the 4.0 liter sixes.
 
I wish I had my last Grand cherokee.

Sold it with 190,000 miles. 4.0 and 42RE trans. Running great, for 2k. It was pristine too, clean inside and out, leather, good paint, everything worked...

Now I have an 2001 GC with the 4.7. The 4.7 is burning oil, the window motors are systematically self destructing, the stupid electronic climate control blend doors break, I had to replace the transmission solenoid ($350) and the plastic radiator tanks have just sprung a leak. Still with 189k on it I've gotten my money's worth.
 
I had a Jeep Cherokee also. I wish Cherokees were still built, I don't like the new Jeeps. My Cherokee I sold in Germany for more than I paid for it in the US.
 
95 Saturn 190,000 miles - (lived through all 3 kids learning to drive, now the college car for the youngest); I put a salvage engine in it at 160,000 after kid#2 blew it up - to be kind to him, 2 injectors failed on a mountain drive

95 Wrangler 185,000 miles - my daily driver; replaced the clutch at 150,000 due to failed throwout bearing (but the clutch was pretty much down to the end of its material)

97 Dodge Ram Cummins 190,000 miles - rebuilt transmission at 150,000 - built to handle the extra 120 hp I added, and the next 100-200 hp I have in the plans - mostly 5th wheel rv towing

2002 Chrysler 300M 110,000 miles - wife's car - she wants a new one :( ...


all have been paid off for years - you can do a LOT of maintenance for a lot less than 4, 5 or 6 years of car payments. My Jeep makes 20mpg. Sure, I could buy something that gets better (like my kid's VW Jetta TDI - makes a very solid 45+mpg) but those payments don't offset the fuel savings.
 
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Right now for us its a race between Ol' Blue and Leah's Subaru Outback Impreza to die first. I'd like to replace the Impreza with a newer full size Outback with trailer towing capability. I think it'd make a good long haul glider pulling machine.
 
I like the Mazda 3 in that segment. Have you looked into that? For best value, buy one that is a year old and has the 4-year/50k warranty.
 
I will say that I just had to replace the clutch in my car at 128K miles, however in this case it's a Porsche and those were 128K hard miles :)
 
jtheune said:
I will say that I just had to replace the clutch in my car at 128K miles, however in this case it's a Porsche and those were 128K hard miles :)
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Fun! Last week I was looking at a Porsche in a parking lot, and it was automatic. I didn't know Porsche made automatics. Isn't that defeating the purpose of a fun sportscar? My Dad had a couple old Porsches, a 1969 911 S Targa, and a 1956 356. Beautiful cars. We all wish he had kept the 356, because I think they are rare.
 
Chip Sylverne said:
Find a mechanic you can trust. They are out there, and you generally find them word of mouth. Ask around. Have them evaluate the car. There is the possibility of being nickel and dimed to death by keeping an old car, even a Honda, running. Be honest, have you changed the oil regularly, checked diff lube, changed filters and all that? If you have, you are a rare woman indeed.
If the car passes muster, (good compressions, good trans, oil pressure measured by a mechanical guage bearings, wheel and driveline all in spec) then keep the car and replace the wear items. If not, sell it and purchase a well-researched new car, maintain it and keep it forever.

0r buy a used, well maintained Jeep Cherokee, after having it checked out by aforementioned mechanic. Suckers last forever, and ask very little in return. Bought mine new in '89, 300k on the clock and runs like new. AW4 transmissions are bulletproof, as are the 4.0 liter sixes.
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Did you read my post? I take it in for EVERY service - for 10 years - all my Civics. Oil, and what they call "minor / major" so it goes like this:

Oil change

Minor (which includes an oil change)

Oil change

Minor (stuff like fluids, tire rotation, battery and tread check, brakes percentages report, etc)

Oil change

Major (much more in depth)

Oil change

Etc - each is about 5,000 - 8,000 from the one before it, I think. So the "Majors" are every 30,000 miles. This is all what Honda recommends, or better, they even wash and vacuum the car and give me a full report and photos of their work.
 
You should talk with my wife. I love her with all my being, but getting her to even get her car washed is a concession...
I'll stick with the advice about a good honest independant mechanic. I don't have much use for dealer service depts, my experience was not good. YMMV. But if you've maintained your car as you say, she's just about getting broken in...keep her.
 
jesse said:
I personally love people that buy new cars and then sell them because one day they need a little work. Buying a new car will be WAY more expensive then any of the above repairs you mentioned. You might be able to get another 130,000 miles out of that car. Why not go for it?

Look at the big picture Kim. If you get a newer or new car you're going to be:

1.) Buying an item that WILL depreciate rapidly
2.) Paying higher registration fees
3.) Paying sales tax
4.) Paying higher insurance
5.) Paying interest

You could fix every item on that list in a matter of a few months car payments. Then you could easily be set for another 130,000 miles.

You do not buy a new car to save money. You buy a new car because you want a new car. If you want to save money fix your car and take your savings and invest it.

Actually..now that I think about it.. I need people like you to buy new cars, so that I can buy your used one, and save many many thousands throughout my life that accumulates to millions more at retirement time. So on that note, be a good American and buy a new car!
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+1

kimberlyanne546 said:
Agreed but the crappy features (stick in SF) are what often brings a NEW CAR down in price, and we're talking thousands here, is what got me into my Civic (first new car I've ever owned):

Nobody wanted it. It sat there. No bells and whistles. Hell the doors and windows don't even work without your elbow grease. Less to go wrong, I say. Oh and it was a top mpg (top 15 in US) for the stick shift. I can easily get 40mpg highway if I stay at 60mph and pi$$ the other drivers off.
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Sounds like my 1999 Jeep Wrangler, although it does have an automatic. Crank the windows, lock the doors by hand. No problem.

Oh, and the Yaris? Worst POS I've driven in years. The thing that killed it for me (rental, thank goodness) was the instrument cluster in the middle of the dash. All out of the normal line of sight when driving. Unsafe in my view.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
Nissan Versa
Toyota Yaris
Hyundai Accent
Honda Fit
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Fit is far away the least troublesome among the 4, even with the recall for the door switches. Yaris is also exempliarily reliable, but it's a blandmobile. If you go to TrueDelta.com, you can see the data.

Versa is popular for the price, but it's even more of a tin can than Yaris. The CVT in it will die well before 150k miles. That is despite Nissan making the best CVTs in the industry by far.

Accent is supposed to be ok. Despite the awesome warranty, the repair stats are about twice worse than Yaris. I guess Hyundai has the money to pay for warranty repairs.

If I wanted a 3-door, I'd get the little Yaris. If I needed a normal car, I'd get Fit. If I weren't limited to the 4 you listed, I'd get something else. For the record, I drive a 2010 Wrangler.
 
Ghery said:
+1
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I went through the excercise a couple of times, and decided that old cars are not worth it. Once you start throwing money at a persistent main seal leak, or something like that, it's time to junk it. Cars are very different from airplanes in this regard, economically.
 
Ghery said:
Sounds like my 1999 Jeep Wrangler, although it does have an automatic. Crank the windows, lock the doors by hand. No problem.
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If she wants a Jeep Wrangler I have an 1998 stick with 22,000 miles which I will drive to California for her. :)
 
zaitcev said:
I went through the excercise a couple of times, and decided that old cars are not worth it. Once you start throwing money at a persistent main seal leak, or something like that, it's time to junk it. Cars are very different from airplanes in this regard, economically.
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Yup, and that's about the time I retire the old beast and get something new. When it isn't economical to keep it on the road, replace it. But not before. My 1999 Wrangler has over 175000 miles on it and it's running strong. My wife's 1997 Grand Cherokee had around 187000 miles on it when it was traded on her 2006 Jeep Commander. She's pushing 100000 miles on that one.
 
bluee said:
Fun! Last week I was looking at a Porsche in a parking lot, and it was automatic. I didn't know Porsche made automatics. Isn't that defeating the purpose of a fun sportscar? My Dad had a couple old Porsches, a 1969 911 S Targa, and a 1956 356. Beautiful cars. We all wish he had kept the 356, because I think they are rare.
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They have been offering autos for a long time, some of them rather innovative concepts like the 'PDK' transmissions that are basically electronically shifted conventional transmissions. I prefer stick, but performance wise you dont give up anything with the PDK tranny (you actually gain 0.2-0.4sec in the 0-60mph test).
 
zaitcev said:
I went through the excercise a couple of times, and decided that old cars are not worth it. Once you start throwing money at a persistent main seal leak, or something like that, it's time to junk it. Cars are very different from airplanes in this regard, economically.
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Yeah, but a 130k is not an 'old car' and all she is looking at right now are consumables and tweaking, not a persistent main seal leak (=shot crank bearings).
 
Everskyward said:
If she wants a Jeep Wrangler I have an 1998 stick with 22,000 miles which I will drive to California for her. :)
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oooooh ... I could turn back 150k on the clock and move up a couple of years? no no no no .... I won't even ask "how much?"
 
weilke said:
Yeah, but a 130k is not an 'old car' and all she is looking at right now are consumables and tweaking, not a persistent main seal leak (=shot crank bearings).
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Well, even that is just a matter of dropping the pan and throwing in main bearings whe you do the seal. No biggie. But if the oil pressure is good, bearings are too. Rings and low comprwssion, now THAT's an issue...
 
gkainz said:
oooooh ... I could turn back 150k on the clock and move up a couple of years? no no no no .... I won't even ask "how much?"
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Mmmmm temptation...

Arvada isn't all that far away either.
 
It's interesting to see the miles that most of us our getting out of our cars now. The last several cars I've had - 145k currently, 170k? and sold it to get a more reliable used car for a college kid, and another that had way more than the broken odometer said (broke at 135k and ran for another 3-4yrs before I sold it).

Most of us remember the days when a car was lucky to last past 80k without rusting apart.
 
Matthew said:
It's interesting to see the miles that most of us our getting out of our cars now. The last several cars I've had - 145k currently, 170k? and sold it to get a more reliable used car for a college kid, and another that had way more than the broken odometer said (broke at 135k and ran for another 3-4yrs before I sold it).

Most of us remember the days when a car was lucky to last past 80k without rusting apart.
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And you all walked up hill to school in the deep snow - both ways!
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
And you all walked up hill to school in the deep snow - both ways!
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Well, yeah.

--

Since I buy a new car about once every decade, I'm really impressed at (generally) how much better they get each time. If you find something that works, stick with it.
 
bluee said:
Fun! Last week I was looking at a Porsche in a parking lot, and it was automatic. I didn't know Porsche made automatics. Isn't that defeating the purpose of a fun sportscar? My Dad had a couple old Porsches, a 1969 911 S Targa, and a 1956 356. Beautiful cars. We all wish he had kept the 356, because I think they are rare.
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I'm buying my daughter an NB-era Miata in a few years when she gets old enough so that she'll learn how to drive a standard, learn how to drive a car that rewards a good driver, and because I like that there's only two seats.

I might even let her drive my '91.

He should have kept the 356... that's a true classic.
 
TMetzinger said:
I lived in a valley, No matter how I went to school or came back in involved uphill climbs and snow.

Barefoot.
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Barefoot, and the winds were gusting so high the windchill factor made the day feel like negative forty degrees. Oh and the snow storms changed to hail storms with hail stones so large they gave the children and elderly head injuries.
 
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