A&Ps, AI's and other aircraft mechanics

Timbeck2

Timbeck2

Final Approach
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Timbeck2
Looking for opinions on tools used for day to day GA aircraft repair. I'm building a "basic, starting, but must have" wish list for myself for my third and hopefully final career as an A&P mechanic. Specifically what brands do you recommend when it comes to rivet guns, squeezers and the like? What gun should I look for 2X, 3X, 4X? What gun gives a soft initial start as the one I've used doesn't and I forgot the brand. More questions to come. Oh and lastly, who makes the best #2 bit for screwdrivers? I've used Snap-On but I want opinions of others in the business.

Edit: Not starting out completely as I already have a full toolbox of screwdrivers, wrenches, ratchets, sockets, spark plug cleaner and gapper, oil filter tools to include cutter, pop rivets and gun, etc.
 
I use a variety of Phillips screw drivers and a nice set of standard 1/4” sockets. That will get you 90% there. Oh and a set of stubby open/ box wrenches.
 
Oh and also if you please, websites to buy from. I've seen several such as Brown but don't know anything about customer service, shipping, etc. Also I'd be interested in tool brands to stay away from.
 
Airframe special tools. Clecos and pliers, lay out dividers, rivet tools, mini pressure regulator, (set up to place in line) small air compressor, protractor for measuring flight control throws, cable tention-meter, oil can, grease gun. brake bleeder bomb.
 
Appreciate it Tom. I have a lot of those already but I don't have many airframe tools at all meaning aluminum shaping, layout and fastening tools. Clecos are clecos? Meaning: is one brand better than another?
 
Timbeck2 said:
Looking for opinions on tools used for day to day GA aircraft repair. I'm building a "basic, starting, but must have" wish list for myself for my third and hopefully final career as an A&P mechanic. Specifically what brands do you recommend when it comes to rivet guns, squeezers and the like? What gun should I look for 2X, 3X, 4X? What gun gives a soft initial start as the one I've used doesn't and I forgot the brand. More questions to come. Oh and lastly, who makes the best #2 bit for screwdrivers? I've used Snap-On but I want opinions of others in the business.

Edit: Not starting out completely as I already have a full toolbox of screwdrivers, wrenches, ratchets, sockets, spark plug cleaner and gapper, oil filter tools to include cutter, pop rivets and gun, etc.
Click to expand...

Timbeck:
Depends on the where, what, and how you plan to practice your new found skills: freelance, employee based, traveling, fixed base, etc.

But for discussion the majority of my hand tools are craftsman and proto. Have a few snap-on and mac where precision is required. I was never a fan of a complete snap-on or similar brand set of tools as it would kill me to cut or grind on a $50 wrench when a crowfoot was too short and a standard wrench to long.

As for buying... pawn shops, swap meets, and flea markets are other options. But you have to be diligent and know your prices and brands. Two months ago was minding my own business around the local saturday flea market when a boxed, complete set of Starrett micrometers (1" to 6") with gauge blocks attacked me. 50 dollar. And I don't even turn wrenches anymore. Be careful, buying tools can be like crack cocaine. One tool and you're hooked.
 
Believe me I know. I'm also a professional woodworker and my garage is so full of tools I can't fit a box of Chiclets in there. I'll be fixed base for the most part and most of the tools I have now are Snap On and Husky (Home Depot brand) with a few Harbor Freight tools mixed in. I won't think twice about modifying a HF socket or wrench. How about brand names for the rivet guns and squeezers? I know nothing about those.
 
Timbeck2 said:
Appreciate it Tom. I have a lot of those already but I don't have many airframe tools at all meaning aluminum shaping, layout and fastening tools. Clecos are clecos? Meaning: is one brand better than another?
Click to expand...
I didn't know there was more than one company making them.
 
I didn't either. So you're saying that Cleco is like Kleenex and Xerox?
 
Thanks again Tom. Looking at the site just opens up Pandora's question box. For example when to use a stubby rivet set as opposed to standard, etc.

:sigh: I've got a lot to learn.

edit: No, I don't expect an answer, just one of the questions I had.
 
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Don't you just go down the row of hangars and 'borrow' whatever you need?
That's what happened to me.
 
Well, the people have to be there in order to get into their hangar and I don't like borrowing anything.
 
Timbeck2 said:
Well, the people have to be there in order to get into their hangar and I don't like borrowing anything.
Click to expand...
Neither do I, it always seems when I borrow I brake it, then must buy the owner a new one.. So I have made a new rule, I need it, I buy it, I keep it.
 
Timbeck2 said:
Believe me I know. I'm also a professional woodworker and my garage is so full of tools I can't fit a box of Chiclets in there. I'll be fixed base for the most part and most of the tools I have now are Snap On and Husky (Home Depot brand) with a few Harbor Freight tools mixed in. I won't think twice about modifying a HF socket or wrench. How about brand names for the rivet guns and squeezers? I know nothing about those.
Click to expand...

Timbeck:
After reading some of your other replies and not knowing your entire plan, here are a few other things to consider.

Let's say you plan to be a one-man shop working out your T-hangar on a public airport servicing the local GA fleet. If so, the first "tool" I would purchase is insurance. Second, check for any airport rules governing your type of ops on the airport. Third, determine what will be your main reference source (OEM ICAs, FAA publications, etc.) for performing maintenance and plan accordingly.

Back on the tool side, I would recommend defining what you can physically perform at your location. For example, having a basic sheetmetal kit from ATS is always handy. But you'll need a compressor, table brake, shear, metal/rivet stock, etc. to really take advantage of it. Maybe a manual C-squeeze with a basic set and handful of rivets/metal scraps would be a better fit up front.

On the other hand, a mechanic without a compression tester, buzz box, or nitrogen bottle setup will be missing out on a few common items a pilot may bring to you.

You can also start small by offering owner-assisted and basic stuff that doesn't require a lot of specialized tools or equipment. If you're good at chasing sparks read up on aircraft electrical systems and invest in a good VOM and make you some long test leads. That was my niche as most mechanics were not partial to it. It also helped me break the ice as the new kid on the ramp.
 
http://www.yardstore.com/

They have two stores in Wichita. You can buy alot online, but I like digging through bins of clecos and drill bits. They have deals from time to time. I bought my squeezer for $10. I won't blink to modify it for a job.
 
First off, I ain't no A&P - I only maintain one airplane.

But...

What do you plan to do? Rebuilding damaged aircraft for fun and profit? You will need a lot of sheet metal sheet. Trunking? Opening a shop? I would think that would be a big factor in what you need to buy up front.

Now, for me, I am on the, buy it as you need it plan what with being a one horse operation and all. But the sheet that I have accumulated:

Compression tester (Aircraft Tool Supply), Brake Rivet Tool (ATS), a couple torque wrenches, tubing bending tools (Harbor Freight), tubing flaring tool (ATS - my A&P laughs at mine because it looks so new compared to his), hand nibbler, snips, compressor, multiple multimeters, floor jack and jack stands, engine hoist, panel lift (originally bought for hanging drywall, but now used to remove my lightweight wings), oxy-acytelene (from a previous life) - got a buddy that does TIG work for me.

Since my ride is rag and tube, I have limited sheet metal stuff - basic rivet set, cleco assortment (ATS), but I have fabric fixing stuff - Iron, pinking shears, oven thermometer with max/min temp display (the less expensive coil things are crap), an old Binks production gun (also from a previous life - I would go HVLP were I to buy something today), a stock of fun stuff like MEK, fabric, tapes, Poly-whatever, a stockpile of reinforcing rings, inspectin plates, and drain grommets...

Oh, and lots of nuts, bolts, screws, 99 extra Viton O rings that fit the fuel drain, and that kind of stuff that has accumulated over the years - way, way. way beyond handy.
 
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I use every year


Beadblaster
20inch disk sander (Its a monster and way overkill)
Acid Etch & Alodine
Epoxy Primer like Akzo Nobel 10P-8-11
Pneumatic Cherrymax Rivet Gun with offset head
Manual Rivet Squeeze with dies
Air compressor, the biggest that can operate on my hangar's service (220 VAC with a 20 amp breaker)
AFM8 Small Blue Daniels machined contact crimper with K42 positioner and another one I forget
HX4 Daniels Crimp Tool with Y205P crimp die for coax
Cheap multi-meter
Various contact insert/extract tools
Biggest bench vise Menards had
Airwolf Oil Filter Cutter
Digital Protractor
Big Ford wrench for axle nuts
Gram scale for mixing sealant or epoxies
A nice big 4 foot by 8 foot table
A decent cheap miter box saw
Laptop with Vividia bore scope
Magneto Timing Light
A 200 to 600 in/pound 3/8 drive Snap-On Torque Wrench (I think thats the range not sure)
A 40 to 200 in/pound 1/4 drive Snap-On torque wrench (I think thats the range not sure)
Spark Plug Blaster

Oh the list goes on and on.
 
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Bell206 said:
Timbeck:
After reading some of your other replies and not knowing your entire plan, here are a few other things to consider.

Let's say you plan to be a one-man shop working out your T-hangar on a public airport servicing the local GA fleet. If so, the first "tool" I would purchase is insurance. Second, check for any airport rules governing your type of ops on the airport. Third, determine what will be your main reference source (OEM ICAs, FAA publications, etc.) for performing maintenance and plan accordingly.

Back on the tool side, I would recommend defining what you can physically perform at your location. For example, having a basic sheetmetal kit from ATS is always handy. But you'll need a compressor, table brake, shear, metal/rivet stock, etc. to really take advantage of it. Maybe a manual C-squeeze with a basic set and handful of rivets/metal scraps would be a better fit up front.

On the other hand, a mechanic without a compression tester, buzz box, or nitrogen bottle setup will be missing out on a few common items a pilot may bring to you.

You can also start small by offering owner-assisted and basic stuff that doesn't require a lot of specialized tools or equipment. If you're good at chasing sparks read up on aircraft electrical systems and invest in a good VOM and make you some long test leads. That was my niche as most mechanics were not partial to it. It also helped me break the ice as the new kid on the ramp.
Click to expand...

It will be three of us. One IA and me and another guy who wants his A&P that is more experienced than I am because he was working with the IA before he was hired by Apple. All three of us own airplanes, the IA is partial owner of a 172, the other guy owns a turbo 210 and me and my Cherokee. Hangar and insurance is already in place. We are working on a 182 now with at least two more planes on the way. A Bonanza with an engine swap and a Cherokee 180 annual due. Pilots in our hangar row have started to use the IA and he needs help because good mechanics in Tucson are getting hard to come by. All of the tools you mentioned are available from either one of us owns it or knows where to borrow it. Someday I will retire again and would like to work on airplanes on my own schedule. That's the end goal here. I don't like not having my own tools.
 
I think I did a thread here a year ago about all those special, home-made tools you'll need.
That special wrench to take off the nuts of an 0-200 sump; the bent-punch to drive the lower alt bolt out of the rear mount alternator IO520, the far nut of the vac pump on many engines; etc etc. :)

I was joking about borrowing tools - just an observation about all my missing tools!
 
Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe said:
First off, I ain't no A&P - I only maintain one airplane.

But...

What do you plan to do? Rebuilding damaged aircraft for fun and profit? You will need a lot of sheet metal sheet. Trunking? Opening a shop? I would think that would be a big factor in what you need to buy up front.

Now, for me, I am on the, buy it as you need it plan what with being a one horse operation and all. But the sheet that I have accumulated:

Compression tester (Aircraft Tool Supply), Brake Rivet Tool (ATS), a couple torque wrenches, tubing bending tools (Harbor Freight), tubing flaring tool (ATS - my A&P laughs at mine because it looks so new compared to his), hand nibbler, snips, compressor, multiple multimeters, floor jack and jack stands, engine hoist, panel lift (originally bought for hanging drywall, but now used to remove my lightweight wings), oxy-acytelene (from a previous life) - got a buddy that does TIG work for me.

Since my ride is rag and tube, I have limited sheet metal stuff - basic rivet set, cleco assortment (ATS), but I have fabric fixing stuff - Iron, pinking shears, oven thermometer with max/min temp display (the less expensive coil things are crap), an old Binks production gun (also from a previous life - I would go HVLP were I to buy something today), a stock of fun stuff like MEK, fabric, tapes, Poly-whatever, a stockpile of reinforcing rings, inspectin plates, and drain grommets...

Oh, and lots of nuts, bolts, screws, 99 extra Viton O rings that fit the fuel drain, and that kind of stuff that has accumulated over the years - way, way. way beyond handy.
Click to expand...


Thanks Geoffrey, good suggestions and although a little too late, your panel lift suggestion would have saved us a LOT of headache when we installed the wings on the 182 a couple of weekends ago. This after we changed the fuel bladders...I learned that there is a lot of cussing being done with installing new fuel bladders by the way.
 
bnt83 said:
I use every year


Beadblaster
20inch disk sander (Its a monster and way overkill)
Acid Etch & Alodine
Epoxy Primer like Akzo Nobel 10P-8-11
Pneumatic Cherrymax Rivet Gun with offset head
Manual Rivet Squeeze with dies
Air compressor, the biggest that can operate on my hangar's service (220 VAC with a 20 amp breaker)
AFM8 Small Blue Daniels machined contact crimper with K42 positioner and another one I forget
HX4 Daniels Crimp Tool with Y205P crimp die for coax
Cheap multi-meter
Various contact insert/extract tools
Biggest bench vise Menards had
Airwolf Oil Filter Cutter
Digital Protractor
Big Ford wrench for axle nuts
Gram scale for mixing sealant or epoxies
A nice big 4 foot by 8 foot table
A decent cheap miter box saw
Laptop with Vividia bore scope
Magneto Timing Light
A 200 to 600 in/pound 3/8 drive Snap-On Torque Wrench (I think thats the range not sure)
A 40 to 200 in/pound 1/4 drive Snap-On torque wrench (I think thats the range not sure)
Spark Plug Blaster

Oh the list goes on and on.
Click to expand...

Appreciate the response Brian.
 
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A couple of questions that haven't been answered yet. What is a good rivet gun, (not a starter) to buy? I'm assuming I want one with a trigger that more of a soft start than an instant on. What's the difference in 2X, 3X and 4X? I'm guessing its the capacity of the "number of 16ths" it has. I see a lot of "red box" rivet gun sets.
 
fine....vs...course hard hitting rivet gun. There are reasons for each. It really depends on which size rivet you plan to drive.
 
Watch Craigslist for retiring mechanics and people who inherited tools, there's all kinds of interesting stuff out there.
 
Just a guess but is that first picture on the left of tools made to remove the cylinder nuts?
 
yup....:confused:

If you've removed cylinder #5 or #6 from a Bonanza....you'll know what that is. The bottom nuts are next to impossible to remove with standard cylinder wrenches. :lol:
 
JAWS said:
http://www.yardstore.com/

They have two stores in Wichita. You can buy alot online, but I like digging through bins of clecos and drill bits. They have deals from time to time. I bought my squeezer for $10. I won't blink to modify it for a job.
Click to expand...

I thought that site was just going to be a bunch of used tools like, well a yard sale. That's a good site and thank you. I've bookmarked it with the others. I'm not going to be "hard to buy for" at Christmas.
 
Checkout_my_Six said:
yup....:confused:

If you've removed cylinder #5 or #6 from a Bonanza....you'll know what that is. The bottom nuts are next to impossible to remove with standard cylinder wrenches. :lol:
Click to expand...

I've used the commercially made wrenches or at least tried to use them. They were too thick and borrowed so we couldn't grind them down.
 
Timbeck2 said:
It will be three of us. One IA and me and another guy who wants his A&P that is more experienced than I am because he was working with the IA before he was hired by Apple. All three of us own airplanes, the IA is partial owner of a 172, the other guy owns a turbo 210 and me and my Cherokee. Hangar and insurance is already in place. We are working on a 182 now with at least two more planes on the way. A Bonanza with an engine swap and a Cherokee 180 annual due. Pilots in our hangar row have started to use the IA and he needs help because good mechanics in Tucson are getting hard to come by. All of the tools you mentioned are available from either one of us owns it or knows where to borrow it. Someday I will retire again and would like to work on airplanes on my own schedule. That's the end goal here. I don't like not having my own tools.
Click to expand...
Sounds like fun!
 
Timbeck2 said:
It will be three of us. One IA and me and another guy who wants his A&P that is more experienced than I am because he was working with the IA before he was hired by Apple. All three of us own airplanes, the IA is partial owner of a 172, the other guy owns a turbo 210 and me and my Cherokee. Hangar and insurance is already in place. We are working on a 182 now with at least two more planes on the way. A Bonanza with an engine swap and a Cherokee 180 annual due. Pilots in our hangar row have started to use the IA and he needs help because good mechanics in Tucson are getting hard to come by. All of the tools you mentioned are available from either one of us owns it or knows where to borrow it. Someday I will retire again and would like to work on airplanes on my own schedule. That's the end goal here. I don't like not having my own tools.
Click to expand...

Tombeck:
Excellent setup to walk into. On rivet gun, 2x etc. is stroke/cycle of the gun action. The higher the number the harder the impact. I think they use a 10x to build bridges....... ATS guns/kits good middle market stuff, Sioux Air top end. Just don't buy a harbor freight air chisel and use as a rivet gun because a rivet set fits.

As for your other tools, you have two chinese blueprints in front of you. Ask your two compadres if you can look through their tool boxes. Make a list of every tool that looks well used. Buy everything on list you don't own now. Accessorize with additional tools as needed. But most of all keep the work fun. Good luck.
 
Timbeck2 said:
I've used the commercially made wrenches or at least tried to use them. They were too thick and borrowed so we couldn't grind them down.
Click to expand...
those were an older set that were ground down and broke....then I removed the boxed end and brazed a new box end from a cheap set of wrenches...cut in half and rotated the end....and re-welded. It worked great.

You'll find as you do jobs....that tool improvision is often required. A seasoned mechanic has a tool box full of custom made tools for certain jobs......o_O
 
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