Stupid question ref: oil changes

StraightnLevel

StraightnLevel

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Q: For people doing your own oil/filter changes, where do you source your oil and filters, and how do you dispose of waste oil?
 
I've sourced oil both from Spruce and a local Distibutor, filters always from Spruce, and oil disposal at AutoZone or Advance Auto (an oil change place might also be an option). Depending on where you live a local Distibutor might be problematic, but Spruce is always an option. These days I get my oil from Phillips (I'd do the same if I used AeroShell) at either Sun'n Fun or Osh which saves on shipping. Same with filters and CamGuard from Spruce at the shows.
 
I keep filters and cases of oil on my shelf. I usually source them from Spruce since there’s a store 5 minutes from my house but I have a half dozen other stores within 45 minutes that I pass by fairly often. Around here Walmart and a local grocery/hardware chain stock Aeroshell oil. Hazmat oil and fluids disposal is free (up to 5 gallons per visit) at my local landfill.
 
Walmart, Autozone, Rock Auto, etc. ... I fly an experimental with a auto conversion. Waste oil is put back into the empty containers and taken to my Autozone automotive & air parts store. :biggrin:

BTW, I do oil analysis & use Camguard in my Shell engine oil ...
 
Used to buy it from a local oil jobber until they stopped carrying aeroshell. Now I buy it from Spruce when I need to get my order over 350 for free shipping.
I have a challenger oil filter, I haven't bought any filters in years now. I take my used oil in a 5 gallon fuel jug to work when it get's full. We have a waste oil tank.
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Gary Ward said:
Used to buy it from a local oil jobber until they stopped carrying aeroshell. Now I buy it from Spruce when I need to get my order over 350 for free shipping. I have a challenger oil filter, I haven't bought any filters in years now. I take my used oil in a 5 gallon fuel jug to work when it get's full. We have a waste oil tank.
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I have the same filter and used to love it. Now I sort of like it. On a Vans flyer's website, some people with connections to an oil analysis lab ran tests on the Challenger, Tempest, Champion, and a WIX filter they like in the EAB world. The short of it is Wix was best. Champion slightly beat Tempest. Challenger was not even close. The best that could be said about it was that it is better than just having a screen. During the early 2020s when you couldn't find a Champion or Tempest filter, Challenger sales boomed, rightfully so.
All that said, I recently bought a replacement element for mine, and I'm going to keep using it for the next 5 years!
 
Doc Holliday said:

Airplaneoil.com

AirplaneOil is the most inexpensive choice for aviation oil on the internet. We carry Aeroshell, Phillips, Eastman, and Exxon/Mobil oil, piston oil, hydraulic oil, mineral oil, turbine oil, and greases.
airplaneoil.com airplaneoil.com
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I'll have to check them out on my next order.
I've bought a bunch from Aircraft Spruce. Because it was easy and I could throw a case of oil into my cart to pump my total up to the free shipping level for what I already needed to order.
Recently, I ordered two cases of mineral oil from https://aviationoiloutlet.com/ . Prices were good, but it took a month for the oil to arrive. It was out of stock, but nothing on the website indicated that. You only found out AFTER you placed your order. Not real happy about that.
 
Every so often I'll ask my A&P buddy to add a couple of cases to one of his Spruce orders. Or I'll add a case or two to my orders if it gets the total price over the free shipping threshold. In a pinch, there is a small town FBO about 20 minutes away by air that sells for the same price as Spruce.

I have a screen instead of a filter, so I keep a stock of gaskets and lock washers.
 
Oil and filters from Sun’n’Fun - Spruce sells it a nice discount and will drive it out to your plane or car. I bought three cases this year.

Disposal at the county dump. No charge for used oil, and it’s just 15 minutes up the road.
 
StraightnLevel said:
and how do you dispose of waste oil?
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Most oil change centers are required to take oil. So the shop at the airport might take it from you, or maybe the Zippy Lube (or similar) on your drive home.

Regulations I'm sure vary state to state, but you should find someone that will take it. Usually for free.
 
Our EAA chapter makes a bulk order twice a year. The distributor is down the road (about 30 mi on I-70) and he delivers to our chapter hangar, then we take what we ordered.
The airport takes our used oil.
 
Kiddo's Driver said:
The short of it is Wix was best. Champion slightly beat Tempest. Challenger was not even close.
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I’ve been using one since the Covid-driven shortages as well. Can you elaborate on this? I haven’t really noticed any difference in my oil analyses.

I do like how they’re fairly easy to clean out and see what was caught. I just bought an ultrasonic cleaner to help get it even cleaner.
 
There are waste oil heaters but some I’ve met are a real pia.
 
Llewtrah381 said:
I’ve been using one since the Covid-driven shortages as well. Can you elaborate on this? I haven’t really noticed any difference in my oil analyses.

I do like how they’re fairly easy to clean out and see what was caught. I just bought an ultrasonic cleaner to help get it even cleaner.
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I wouldn't be able to do it justice. You might be able to google "vans oil test challenger 4548" and find the thread without being a member. If not, try joining Vans Air Force and then searching. The standard they tested to is ISO 4548-12.
 
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Kiddo's Driver said:
I wouldn't be able to do it justice. You might be able to google "vans oil test challenger 4548" and find the thread without being a member. If not, try joining Vans Air Force and then searching. The standard they tested to is ISO 4548-12.
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I found this when searching as you suggested. Very informative.

www.kitplanes.com

Oil Filter Testing - KITPLANES

Some aviation oil filters fall short of efficiency standards, but still protect engines—barely. Understand what yours really does.
www.kitplanes.com www.kitplanes.com
 
As other said, I buy enough oil and filters from Spruce to get free shipping. The exact order varies depending on what I happen to have left over. I used to buy my oil from my A&P because he sold it to me for what he paid, but he has since retired.

Once a year, I just have the shop that does my annual do the oil change and provide the oil and filter and send the oil out for analysis.
 
StraightnLevel said:
Q: For people doing your own oil/filter changes, where do you source your oil and filters, and how do you dispose of waste oil?
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Oil and filters from spruce; I live a few miles away from their warehouse so no shipping costs buying from them.
Airport accepts waste oil. Speaking of which, I've amassed about 60 quarts of it in sealed containers from oil changes over the years I eventually have to drop off so my hangar doesn't become an EPA supersite...
 
Kiddo's Driver said:
I have the same filter and used to love it. Now I sort of like it. On a Vans flyer's website, some people with connections to an oil analysis lab ran tests on the Challenger, Tempest, Champion, and a WIX filter they like in the EAB world. The short of it is Wix was best. Champion slightly beat Tempest. Challenger was not even close. The best that could be said about it was that it is better than just having a screen. During the early 2020s when you couldn't find a Champion or Tempest filter, Challenger sales boomed, rightfully so.
All that said, I recently bought a replacement element for mine, and I'm going to keep using it for the next 5 years!
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I read that on Van's. It did not change my opinion of the performance of the screen filter.
I am bias as I run a Filter One and Oberg racing filters for years which are screen filters. I used them on supercharged engines for 8 years and they were the standard.

Mine(Challenger filter) seemed to clean up my engine?
First oil change there was quite a bit of black carbon in the bottom of the filter housing. As the oil changes went on the filter housing had less and less carbon in it. You really get to see what is circulating through your engine oil with a screen type filter.
I have had mine since march 2022 and 324 hours so far. I had an oil analysis every oil change, no change in the reports since new. I let Blackstone know I switched to a challenger oil filter. I have 700 +some hrs since zero hours on this engine and 324 hrs since the challenger filter was installed. I see every thing I need to see in the screen filter, Much easier than dealing with 2' of pleated material after cutting the filter apart.
 
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Oil from PSC, don't have a filter, dump the used oil in the tank at the airport.
 
Gary Ward said:
I read that on Van's. It did not change my opinion of the performance of the screen filter.
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Take a look at the Kitplanes article I cited above. A bit scary but I’m not really sure what to do with the info. The Challenger is basically a sieve rather than a filter, so it has more or less a set size of particles it either lets through or blocks. The paper filters are more “broad spectrum”.

But most critical, after 3 grams of stuff, it blocks up and the pressure skyrockets. The standard is to be able to handle at least 15 grams. All of the paper ones were 17+.

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But is 3g a little or a lot? They do point out that “Many make TBO with nothing more than a strainer screen”. But still…

As I noted earlier, I’ve not seen a big change in oil analyses since switching. But I do tend to change the oil at 25-30 hours, which has always been my pattern. This info has me thinking I’ll keep up that pattern, especially now that I’m starting to see more carbon in the filter (I’m at 1900 hours). I don’t want the otherwise harmless carbon clogging up the filter completely.
 
I buy oil at S&F; it gets me a golf cart ride. If I were to run out of oil, one of the local airport has oil at a good price. I know others who buy it online. The airport has an oil barrel for oil disposal. I don't remember if it's Federal or State law, but in FL, places that sell oil are required to take used oil.

When I need filters, I buy a case from Spruce. I probably should shop around to see if there are better deals.
 
baboss said:
I really do think the old saying about oil/filters are cheap compared to an overhaul rings true.
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While I agree with the sentiment and am now wondering about the Challenger I have, neither article or anything else I’ve seen so far has offered up any data to show an actual difference. In fact, in 24 years and lots and lots of mowings, I have yet to change the oil filter in either my riding or push mower - because they don’t have one. Heck - I bet there are lots of mowers out there that rarely if ever get their oil changed (or maybe checked?) out there. This may be in the “lean while idling” category of discussion - not sure.

That said, now that Champions are available and affordable, I’ll probably switch back at the next overhaul.
 
Llewtrah381 said:
While I agree with the sentiment and am now wondering about the Challenger I have, neither article or anything else I’ve seen so far has offered up any data to show an actual difference. In fact, in 24 years and lots and lots of mowings, I have yet to change the oil filter in either my riding or push mower - because they don’t have one. Heck - I bet there are lots of mowers out there that rarely if ever get their oil changed (or maybe checked?) out there. This may be in the “lean while idling” category of discussion - not sure.

That said, now that Champions are available and affordable, I’ll probably switch back at the next overhaul.
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If you mow an hour a week for 24 years, that's 1248 hours ... about halfway to TBOH.

Also, if your mower engine quits, you do not fall out of the sky and die. Or pay 30 grand for a repair.

Sorry, feeling especially pedantic today.
 
Ed Haywood said:
If you mow an hour a week for 24 years, that's 1248 hours ... about halfway to TBOH.

Also, if your mower engine quits, you do not fall out of the sky and die. Or pay 30 grand for a repair.

Sorry, feeling especially pedantic today.
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Yeah - I get it. But don’t forget many of our engines started out either individually or as a model with just a rock screen for a filter. It would be interesting to see if longevity has improved in those with an oil filter added, controlling for oil quality improvements, flight hours, etc.

Having oil in the crankcase is the highest priority. Changing the oil periodically to get rid of corrosives and abrasives seems second. While I definitely think filters are essential, it’s not clear to me what statistical contribution they make to longevity. In this conversation, that’s important to me because I don’t know if not reliably filtering smaller than, say, 40 microns makes a difference or if only catching 3g of stuff before becoming a plug is a bad thing.

I just remember someone on here recently challenging the conventional wisdom re leaning for taxi and asking about the data ;)
 
Llewtrah381 said:
Changing the oil periodically to get rid of corrosives and abrasives seems second. While I definitely think filters are essential, it’s not clear to me what statistical contribution they make to longevity.
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The main benefit from filters is the increased oil change intervals. Its doubles the interval in most engines. And the reason lawn mower engines do not to have a screen or filter is due to the splash type oil system. However on mower engines with a pressure type oil system you will see a screen or filter installed. The oil doesn't wear out but gets very dirty from combustion process, etc. And if you use a filter on your aircraft engine AND use unleaded fuel you can double your oil change interval again to 100 hours for most engines. But as to extending the engine longevity, its not so much a single factor like oil filter use, but a combination of several factors which together extend the life of the engine.
 
Llewtrah381 said:
Yeah - I get it. But don’t forget many of our engines started out either individually or as a model with just a rock screen for a filter.
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I still have a screen on mine, not a filter. I prefer to change every 25 hours, and I do my own changes, so I don't see the advantage to install a filter. As someone else observed, my engine has lasted 50 years with a screen.

I actually think it is easier to inspect for particles with a screen. I flush the screen with mineral spirits, then pour the spirits through a coffee filter.

Accessing the screen is a bit more of a PITA, but I've got a lot of practice doing it.
 
Ed Haywood said:
I still have a screen on mine, not a filter. I prefer to change every 25 hours, and I do my own changes, so I don't see the advantage to install a filter. As someone else observed, my engine has lasted 50 years with a screen.

I actually think it is easier to inspect for particles with a screen. I flush the screen with mineral spirits, then pour the spirits through a coffee filter.

Accessing the screen is a bit more of a PITA, but I've got a lot of practice doing it.
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Well, with the recent Lycoming AD, I get to do both - change the filter plus clean the screen. Yeah - a little bit of a pain but it’s getting easier and less messy.

That is one nice thing about the Challenger filter: it’s pretty easy to rinse it from the inside out and then strain the rinsate through a coffee filter. Could do it on a paper filter too, I guess.
 
Ed Haywood said:
I still have a screen on mine, not a filter. I prefer to change every 25 hours, and I do my own changes, so I don't see the advantage to install a filter. As someone else observed, my engine has lasted 50 years with a screen.

I actually think it is easier to inspect for particles with a screen. I flush the screen with mineral spirits, then pour the spirits through a coffee filter.

Accessing the screen is a bit more of a PITA, but I've got a lot of practice doing it.
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Have done the same plane for 40 years. Filter or screen 25 hour changes, maybe out to 30 if on a cross country somewhere.

That assumes regular usage - otherwise change it based on calendar time.
 
Llewtrah381 said:
Well, with the recent Lycoming AD, I get to do both - change the filter plus clean the screen. Yeah - a little bit of a pain but it’s getting easier and less messy.
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I guess I should be more explicit. I have two screens: suction and pressure. I check the suction screen every other change, because it is a PITA to reinstall on an inverted oil system with a stiff hose. Pressure screen gets checked every change.
 
Aircraft Spruce charges too much for shipping and I seldom need to purchase $350 worth of stuff to get free shipping. I let Google search for buys through their "shopping" page. More often than not, I wind up buying my Tempest oil filter and Phillips Victory 20W 50 oil from an Amazon seller. The price is often higher than AS, but with free shipping and really rapid turnaround, I get my product faster and for less out-of-pocket expense overall.
 
Ed Haywood said:
I prefer to change every 25 hours, and I do my own changes, so I don't see the advantage to install a filter.
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Depending on what advantages you are considering, unless you fly over 75 hours per year adding a filter doesn't really provide any cost any cost advantage especially if one doesn't also follow the calendar based oil change interval. However, a filter does give you a better engine condition monitor due to the filter inspections vs a screen. For a top shelf recommendation, adding a filter, using oil analysis, and following both hour/calendar oil change intervals provide the best preventive measures especially on low usage engines.
 
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