Runup area/Hold short Etiquette

Discussion in 'Flight Following' started by FlyingMonkey, Feb 19, 2020.

  1. PaulS

    PaulS Final Approach

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    I call the tower when I'm ready to go. I don't wait to get to the line, that's the way it's done err, the way I was taught where I fly out of. I know some places don't want you to call, but whatever. If you are there and I call while you haven't, that's why.
     
  2. NavAir

    NavAir Pre-takeoff checklist

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    I always allow room for others to pass by if they are ready before me. In the pictured case below, I was ready first and departed first, we were both headed in roughly the same direction.

    IMG_3315.jpg

    He was definitely faster than I was...
     
  3. Hang 4

    Hang 4 Line Up and Wait

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    My interpretation - I'm ready to go, but I also can see there are others in line ahead of me, so me saying I'm ready is not a D-bag move, but rather just letting the tower and the guys in front of me know that I know I'm behind them. I could say all that crap or just say "ready to go in sequence".
     
  4. RussR

    RussR Cleared for Takeoff

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    Maybe just to get out of the way and make more room for anybody else entering the runup area. You said the hold short line was plenty long for side-by-side. Seems reasonable to me. You did not indicate there were any other aircraft also ready to depart, I thought it was just you and him.

    Again, he could have been being a jerk. But I haven't seen anything yet that necessarily indicates that.
     
  5. Tantalum

    Tantalum Final Approach

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    run up in secret somewhere else and then cruise up like a boss to the hold short line passed the line of people running up for half an hour "Tower, bugsmasher 123 with you, ready to go"

    jk, obviously
     
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  6. PaulS

    PaulS Final Approach

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    Cirrus drivers can't joke like that.
     
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  7. bluerooster

    bluerooster Pattern Altitude

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    Snydley Whiplash. Muttley was his dog/partner. Snydley was the one to raise his fist. Muttley would just laugh at Snydleys misfortune. ;)
     
  8. alfadog

    alfadog Final Approach

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    Thank you.
     
  9. James331

    James331 Ejection Handle Pulled

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    “Ready upon reaching”
     
  10. Adam Weiss

    Adam Weiss Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Is that a regional thing?
    In almost 500 hrs, I’ve honestly never heard that one.
     
  11. MooneyDriver78

    MooneyDriver78 En-Route

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    Neither have I, I wonder if this at an airport with no runup area, maybe runups done on the taxiway?
     
  12. PaulS

    PaulS Final Approach

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    I've heard it and used it, when I couldn't count how many were in front of me.
     
  13. alfadog

    alfadog Final Approach

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    Common at KTMB, home to 100+ training aircraft. I see it used when there are four or five folks ready to take off before you and you wanna get in the line with the controller. Just a courtesy, two words to let folks know you're with the program. There's always someone here gets their panties in a bunch if you don't do things exactly the way they do. Probably the same few someones.
     
  14. Matthew

    Matthew Touchdown! Greaser!

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    My primary CFI used to say that. At OJC it was, maybe still is, common for a lot of IFR charter aircraft to be waiting near the rwy, and then another 2 or 3 VFR aircraft would roll in. Not being able to hear all sides of the conversation (tower vs ground), it was sometimes hard to decide: is the airplane in front of me waiting here for takeoff clearance and should I stay behind? or is this airplane in front of me waiting here for a clearance and I should go around? My CFI's solution to that was the "in sequence" call and then tower would have a chance to sort out the traffic jam of who goes next. I'm not sure I've personally ever used that phrase, but I have heard it.
     
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  15. danhagan

    danhagan Pattern Altitude

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    How about a 40 minute run-up at Llano(KAQO) with the offender blocking the only means at getting to the runway (recent rain, unable to use grass runway). I landed and as I fueled he pulled into position. I finished, took my time in the bathroom, came out and cleaned bugs off the windshield and fuel sumped (he's till there). Jumped on board, straightened up the cockpit from the previous 3 hour leg, got snacks ready. Got equipment Ipad, Zaon all set, ran a non-rushed pre-start checklist and started engine (he's till there). He wouldn't respond on CTAF and forced me to shutdown after another 10 minute delay ... on top of that he went to the other end of the field with a 20 knot tail wind take off, holding me up again:mad::mad::mad:
     
  16. Clip4

    Clip4 Final Approach

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    Oh hell, just advise the tower you are #1 for departure once you get you taxi clearance.
     
  17. Timbeck2

    Timbeck2 Final Approach

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    I hear it every day as a controller but have never used it as a pilot. My interpretation is: "Hey tower, I just switched to your freq and I don't know who's already called up. So as a courtesy to those who may have called already, I'm ready to go after them." They may have seen other aircraft holding short and don't know who's called the tower already since they were on ground freq while taxiing out. Really not a big deal or something laugh worthy. <shrug>
     
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  18. Tantalum

    Tantalum Final Approach

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    thanks, I've heard this a few times and I always wondered myself exactly what it meant
     
  19. James331

    James331 Ejection Handle Pulled

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    Think it’s more a puppy mill thing, the only people Ive heard say that we’re the puppy mill CFIs who probably heard a regional airline guy say it, or the young sounding regional airline guys who were probably fresh from said puppy mill. Self licking icecream cone situation basically
     
  20. Jamie Kirk

    Jamie Kirk Line Up and Wait

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    I look at the pilot and of he looks back I give a him a thumbs up, if they’d really me they wave me forward. If I can’t make eye contact I do a short “Cesna 4J you read” just to be courteous.

    I’ve had too many people pull up to hold short just to do the run up there blasting the planes behind them.
     
  21. jordane93

    jordane93 Final Approach

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    I’ve heard it used at my airport. Seems to happen at busier airports. I never use it though.
     
  22. danhagan

    danhagan Pattern Altitude

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    If you name was JAMES Kirk instead of JAMIE Kirk, this would NEVER happen unless the offender wanted an old fashioned Star Trek azz whoopin';):):p
     
  23. Skip Miller

    Skip Miller Final Approach

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    KHPN it is used commonly.

    when the airport is very busy, I have also heard “East side” or “West Side” when taking off on 34. “Westchester Tower, Bugsmasher xxxx ready for takeoff in sequence East side 34”

    -Skip
     
  24. Grum.Man

    Grum.Man En-Route

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    It’s pretty obvious to the tower who is in the right and who is in the wrong if you are on the taxiway centerline and the other plane isn’t and is beside you.
     
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  25. Pugs

    Pugs Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Yep. Used in the military all the time when you roll into the hold short with 8 jets there and no idea who's a single ship, a section (2) or a division (4) and who has called for what. "take off in order" (or sequence)
     
  26. FlyingMonkey

    FlyingMonkey Pre-takeoff checklist

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    This happened at the hold short line. The run up area had plenty of room. He was in it, I was in it. 2 planes remained from a previous line of 4 at hold short line. I watched them depart one by one while I was doing my run up. I finished my run up, taxi'd to the back of the line. Now I'm #3, then #2, then pulling forward to #1 when Mr. Cirrus finally finishes his run up and decides to pull along side me and call the tower just before I do- I was right on the tail of the guy in front of me... I wouldn't do that- I would pull behind the planes in line, just seems like the polite thing to do...
     
  27. woodchucker

    woodchucker Cleared for Takeoff

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    I fly out of a Bravo frequently. I used to scoot towards the hold short line after finishing my runup before calling tower, but more recently I just call tower first and let them know I’m ready before scooting.

    I assume you go in order of call up for VFR bugsmashers so it’s probably better to just stay put until cleared to hold short or lineup or takeoff.

    Is that more or less correct?
     
  28. MooneyDriver78

    MooneyDriver78 En-Route

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    Cleared to hold short? There is no such thing.
    Since you are not in position to take off, shouldn’t you be talking to ground since you’re asking permission to taxi? Do you sit in the runup area until they ask you if you’re ready? Turbines don’t do run ups, so don’t be surprised if they just taxi by you and into position.
    That said, there is busy airports with runup areas not near the beginning of the runway, where they give you instructions to call them after your runup before taxiing, but this may have been because I was IFR and they wanted to wait for my release.
     
  29. Hang 4

    Hang 4 Line Up and Wait

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    Some places run-up is a non-movement area, so in theory you need clearance from ground to exit back to taxiway. My old airport had that on one side of the runway. Was not rigidly enforced.
     
  30. Timbeck2

    Timbeck2 Final Approach

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    If you're done with the run up, taxi (or scoot) to the hold short line and call the tower.

    Ground taxied you to the runway...all the way to the runway, which means up to but not over the hold short line. Talk to tower.
     
  31. MooneyDriver78

    MooneyDriver78 En-Route

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    I was responding to woodchuck staying in the runup area and calling tower from there.
     
  32. UngaWunga

    UngaWunga Cleared for Takeoff

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    Shut engine off, put on parking brake. Get out, walk over to other plane wingtip. Shake plane's wing to get their attention, give them the WTF look.
     
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  33. TommyG

    TommyG Cleared for Takeoff

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    Can’t wait for the other plane to finish their run up. Some CFIs like that Hobbs to tick away.

    I don’t call tower until I am #1 at the hold short lines. Never seen a reason to tell tower what sequence you are. They have enough things going on tow worry about #2,#3, etc.
     
  34. woodchucker

    woodchucker Cleared for Takeoff

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    You are correct. That was a mistype.
     
  35. N1120A

    N1120A Cleared for Takeoff

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    Sounds like you were at Camarillo

    Of course

    Who cares if you might be IFR? I regularly get priority when flying IFR when tower gets my release.

    Is this part of the CSIP training?
     
  36. Lndwarrior

    Lndwarrior Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Weird what you don't know after 30 years of flying. Never flown out of very large airport, like class B. Yet, I have never left a run-up area without calling Tower and saying I"m ready to go. I always thought I had to have tower permission to leave the run-up area.

    Also, I've never even seen/heard anyone, short of a commercial flight, pull up to a hold short line without first calling the tower. Maybe this is just the practice at very busy airports?
     
  37. FlyingMonkey

    FlyingMonkey Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Ground will clear you to taxi to the runway usually. This means you can taxi up to the hold short line without a further clearance from my understanding. At some airports I have been given a taxi clearance to taxi to the run up area, in which case after I'm done I contact ground again to get cleared to taxi to the runway. Some airports like Santa Monica, have a run up area that you must cross the movement line to get to, meaning you must call Ground again after the runup to cross the line and get back into the movement area.
     
  38. jordane93

    jordane93 Final Approach

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    Seems like it’s different for every airport. At my airport, we taxi to the run up area and when we’re done we just taxi and hold short of the runway. The run up areas, for the most part are adjacent to the beginning of the runway so we’re not taxiing too far from the run up area to the hold short line. I guess the proper thing to do would initially get clearance to the run up area then to the runway after we’re done. In my 10 years of operating at the airport, I’ve never heard anyone do this though.
     
  39. MooneyDriver78

    MooneyDriver78 En-Route

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    If IFR I’ll tell them so they know when I will need clearance.

    If VFR I’ll tell if #1 or #2, sometimes they want you to be ready:
    “Mooney expect to takeoff with no delay” or they’ll want you to lineup and wait, or they’ll have special instructions they need to communicate like “...can you give me early turn”. I’ve had numerous times I’m talking to tower while not #1. It gives them the option to talk to when convenient for them.
     
  40. Justin M

    Justin M Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Mine is similar (and similar in geography). We're cleared to taxi to the runway, stop in the run-up area on the way, then continue when ready to the runway. Once in a while we're only cleared to the run-up area, so we'll check with ground to get cleared to the runway from the run-up area.
     
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