I'm planning a trip to 06C, first time in the Chicago airspace. My plan is to file ifr, KJST - KAOH, then KAOH - KDPA - 06C. I see rwy 29 is preferred. Any thoughts/recommendations from those in the Schaumburg area, or who have made this flight?
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I've never gone into 06c ifr as there's no approaches. They'll keep you low. Usually even ifr in that area they'll keep you out of the Bravo. Schaumburg is a bit hard to see. There's a big water tank off the east end of the RW that I look for. Pilot Pete's is awesome, I hope that's in your plan. @kaiser flies out of there a lot and might have better advice. I've found Chicago to be pretty good to deal with, other than the fact they'll not let you anywhere near the Bravo.
kaiser
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I'm based at DPA (and technically 06C and PWK and 3CK and a little at ARR).
Filing? about 10-15nm out ORD App will ask you to cancel because no IFR into 06C. You also won't get bravo clearance inbound. Sometimes you'll get it outbound. Why fly into DPA if your final destination is 06C? is it for fuel? or Aircraft Spruce? If it's to fly an approach into DPA then go missed or SVFR to 06C? If so, please give me a pirep on this - I've never heard of it being attempted. I've done pattern work in Class G there but never left sight of the airport.
From the east I would fly:
KRZL (final refueling point, sometimes KOXI is cheaper)
CGT or EON (note that by EON arrivals to ORD satellite airports are at 4000)
BOJAK (if on flight following - stay low since MDW arrivals will be at 3000-4000) or JOT (if not on FF for MDW arrivals)
- At BOJAK I'm at 2000. At JOT I'm at 2000-3000, ORD app sends IFRs to DPA over JOT at either 3000 usually
Direct (if going over JOT you'll get tfc west of 1C5 at the same altitude)
06C from the south is almost impossible to see early - you have to use landmarks.
From the south it's:
"twin towers" - right over the charted Wheaton VFR point - two identical looking apartment buildings right next to each other
"land fill" - biggest hill for miles will be just to your west
"big white box" - big rec building designating the west side of 11/29
"water tower" - big round knob looking like water tower designating the east side of 11/29
"lakes" - a series of retention pond type lakes - this is where you start your downwind for 29.
you should see the ramp after land fill and you'll see the runway by the time you're on downwind. if landing 11 it's over the field at pattern altitude.
Pattern is 1600, I descend to pattern right before the low bravo shelf. The only obstruction that you're at risk of is 2.5nm ENE of 06C, but still keep an eye out.
Landing 29 feels like you're going to land on that building - that's ok, just follow the PAPIs in. it's a really good condition airport. Once the leaves are on the trees, I'd caution anyone landing there when the winds are strong out of the south - trees create a mess of the wind across the runway. I'm taking 20+ knots and worse with gusts. In the winter or before the trees have leaves it's not as bad.
I'll look through my videos to see if i have a landing at 06C.
As far as the airport itself, you must eat at Pilot Pete's. It has good Uber access and is pretty close to a Metra (metropolitan rail - goes to Chicago). There is a repair facility - FBO is Revv Aviation (for now). Tie downs are cheap or free (i think there is a cost but i've never heard of anyone really getting charged).
Filing? about 10-15nm out ORD App will ask you to cancel because no IFR into 06C. You also won't get bravo clearance inbound. Sometimes you'll get it outbound. Why fly into DPA if your final destination is 06C? is it for fuel? or Aircraft Spruce? If it's to fly an approach into DPA then go missed or SVFR to 06C? If so, please give me a pirep on this - I've never heard of it being attempted. I've done pattern work in Class G there but never left sight of the airport.
From the east I would fly:
KRZL (final refueling point, sometimes KOXI is cheaper)
CGT or EON (note that by EON arrivals to ORD satellite airports are at 4000)
BOJAK (if on flight following - stay low since MDW arrivals will be at 3000-4000) or JOT (if not on FF for MDW arrivals)
- At BOJAK I'm at 2000. At JOT I'm at 2000-3000, ORD app sends IFRs to DPA over JOT at either 3000 usually
Direct (if going over JOT you'll get tfc west of 1C5 at the same altitude)
06C from the south is almost impossible to see early - you have to use landmarks.
From the south it's:
"twin towers" - right over the charted Wheaton VFR point - two identical looking apartment buildings right next to each other
"land fill" - biggest hill for miles will be just to your west
"big white box" - big rec building designating the west side of 11/29
"water tower" - big round knob looking like water tower designating the east side of 11/29
"lakes" - a series of retention pond type lakes - this is where you start your downwind for 29.
you should see the ramp after land fill and you'll see the runway by the time you're on downwind. if landing 11 it's over the field at pattern altitude.
Pattern is 1600, I descend to pattern right before the low bravo shelf. The only obstruction that you're at risk of is 2.5nm ENE of 06C, but still keep an eye out.
Landing 29 feels like you're going to land on that building - that's ok, just follow the PAPIs in. it's a really good condition airport. Once the leaves are on the trees, I'd caution anyone landing there when the winds are strong out of the south - trees create a mess of the wind across the runway. I'm taking 20+ knots and worse with gusts. In the winter or before the trees have leaves it's not as bad.
I'll look through my videos to see if i have a landing at 06C.
As far as the airport itself, you must eat at Pilot Pete's. It has good Uber access and is pretty close to a Metra (metropolitan rail - goes to Chicago). There is a repair facility - FBO is Revv Aviation (for now). Tie downs are cheap or free (i think there is a cost but i've never heard of anyone really getting charged).
kaiser
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Best of what I've found so far is from one of my videos landing on 11:
These are the two key landmarks you'll be looking for. I'm coming in from the north to land 11. The big white box building is more prominent from the south.
These are the two key landmarks you'll be looking for. I'm coming in from the north to land 11. The big white box building is more prominent from the south.
That always got on my nerves. Plenty of other busy Bravos can handle VFR and IFR GA traffic, only ORD thinks they're some sort of gatekeepers for the unwashed.
They seem to miss the point that a cooperating target in the Bravo is better than an uncooperating one just outside it.
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My first xc with the instructor dialed 120.55 for flight following. Before I could finish entering the initial squawk code it got changed. Then got the elusive "cleared into the bravo".
So it does happen. But I think it depends where you're at and where you're headed. C81 is at the on the north side of the bravo and we were heading to RFD and just skirting it.
I've been there a few times, but I'm usually coming from almost the opposite direction (from the SW). From what I can remember, I always been given a transition through the DPA delta and then basically kicked off ATC immediately after leaving me on my own in that little segment of airspace under the bravo and between DPA and ORD. Last time I had to do a 360 for traffic while watching my GPS map VERY carefully as to not cross into anything I wasn't cleared to be in. Coming through the airspace on your proposed route I'd expect them to vector you... possibly multiple times or give you a reroute. I don't know Chicago ATC's flows and habits well enough to predict where, just expect it. I almost always get moved for traffic/reasons unknown when getting close to/under the Chicago bravo. I would highly advise having a good moving map navaid(like foreflight) up for situational awareness of the airspace around you.
All that said, it's not really all that difficult if you're used to working with controllers. If you find yourself on downwind for 29 you'll be looking straight down a runway at Ohare. The difference in scale makes it feel way closer than it is.
All that said, it's not really all that difficult if you're used to working with controllers. If you find yourself on downwind for 29 you'll be looking straight down a runway at Ohare. The difference in scale makes it feel way closer than it is.
Agreed. I flew my PA28 into the DC area (KHEF) and no one blinked.
Thanks for the flight plan. I chose DPA because I seem to recall someone telling me that center routed them through there. I would prefer staying below the whole mess anyway...I figured that was the common solution, but I see the final 9 miles doesn't give much between the PE and shelf above. I see the 1500 ft obstruction. Thanks for all the landmarks as well. It will certainly be an engaging trip.
Thanks, Pilot Pete's is def on the list.
If @kaiser is right, I'll be on my own about 15m out. It will be a challange, I expect.
Thanks...so far, worth the price of admission.
NealRomeoGolf
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If it were me I would file to EON and then direct and let them put you where they want you.
That may not work in the end but that's how I'd file it.
That may not work in the end but that's how I'd file it.
bbchien
Touchdown! Greaser!
Just stay to the NE and below 1900 (they like 1600). Just don't get "ample" on final for 29...keep it close. since there is no longer a prefernce of left traffic 11 and right traffic 29 keep your eye peeled on base!
Based at 1C5 and Pilot Pete's is a lot of fun.
Based at 1C5 and Pilot Pete's is a lot of fun.
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masloki
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As someone who has landed there only a handful times and has seen a decent chunk of airports, yeah, the water tower and warehouse on final will look really big. You totally clear them by many, many feet, like 20+ for sure.
Be on your altitudes, keep your eyes out, approach may be more or less helpful, kind of depends on the flow and who you get. If they are departing 27, I don’t think they’ll mind you much. Landing 9, then they get a little more persuasive about you staying low. Having dealt with them enough, do what is safe for you and they will have to sort the rest out.
And enjoy Pilot Pete’s, except the stroganoff, which is disappointing.
Be on your altitudes, keep your eyes out, approach may be more or less helpful, kind of depends on the flow and who you get. If they are departing 27, I don’t think they’ll mind you much. Landing 9, then they get a little more persuasive about you staying low. Having dealt with them enough, do what is safe for you and they will have to sort the rest out.
And enjoy Pilot Pete’s, except the stroganoff, which is disappointing.
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Had a trip there one in a PC-12. Really enjoyed lunch at Pilot Pete’s. Kinda wished it was an overnight.
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Those cows better knock that off or they'll go blind!
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A reason to go to KDPA would be if an instrument approach is needed to get below the clouds (i.e. descent to MVA isn’t low enough to cancel IFR); then you can fly an approach at KDPA, cancel on final, and proceed the few miles to 06C VFR. I would not recommend that for your first flight to Schaumburg, but locals sometimes do this when it’s marginal VFR.
- Martin
rwellner98
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Revv is getting ready to leave? But they just bought the place!
When I based there, the deal was that if you were there for a couple hours they didn't bother to charge, but they did charge overnights.
Especially in a bush plane with a nice headwind. I've been hitting my head on the bravo before reaching the end of the runway a couple times when conditions were right.
I'm going to be the gloomy gus and say that I'm not a big fan of Pete's. It's fine, I guess. And I haven't been there since I moved to Wisconsin a couple years ago.
I'm surprised no one has mentioned the baseball stadium yet. Between the stadium itself and the parking lots, that's a pretty easy to spot landmark and only 2250 ft from the runway. Really fun approach to make at dusk during a night game.
Makes sense, thanks.
Will do. Thanks.
kaiser
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the Revv bit is a rumor so we'll see. But then again, the new PC 12's are Garmin so that's wild.
Did not know about overnights.
Re: the baseball stadium, day or night I can never see it until I'm right on top of the airport so I didn't mention it. That being said, this is the only airport where I have a hard time getting into at night. Too many lights in all sorts of directions. I focused on the Rec Center and Water tower since the OP is coming from the (east/south) and planning 29. Landing 11 is easy from the south since you will see the airport once you're on top of it.
rwellner98
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Sure, that's fair. I guess I still had my mind on the possibility of flying VMC the last leg from DPA.
You're right about it being especially hard to locate at night. It's a single runway in an area filthy with lights. Very easy to get pretty much right on top of before you can spot it.
Anyway, I guess everyone has GPS these days so pretty easy to cross check when your eyes aren't finding it.
Larry in TN
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With ORD running two Major's hubs, and an international gateway, in a five active runway configuration and MDW running one Major's hub with two active, there isn't a lot of unused space in the CBA or CCA.
Do you think chicago has a better safety record? Fewer incursions, proximity alerts etc? Maybe they justify denying GA so ATC can devote resources to commercial traffic.
flyingcheesehead
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Interesting... I like that they have live music, and the food is good. And it's nice to be able to go to an airport restaurant that isn't a ghost town.
Interesting... I've never noticed it from a long distance out, but that's probably because I'm looking for the water tower. Word to the wise, though, they sometimes do fireworks at the stadium (possibly launched from the empty spot in between?) and the airport gets closed for the duration. Found that out the hard way one night...
Heh...
Maybe not, but NY, Norcal, and a few others kinda make them look bad. That said, Chicago is WAY better now than they were 20 years ago... And at least they aren't Vegas.
Warmi
Cleared for Takeoff
Thanks. Good look at that water tower...
Closing the circle…
Made this trip last weekend. Filed KHHG EON BOJAK 06C; got V38 EON JOT; then at MAPPS got direct JOT. No prob. North of EON, Approach tells me the traffic at ORD is landing east, am I familiar with the alternatives. (Crap) I tell him negative. He gives me 2 choices. Cancel my IFR and proceed to 06C, or continue through Dupage. Like an idiot, I asked for the Dupage option—I thought KDPA would just vector me through, then cancel the IFR and turn me loose on the other side. But no. Over KLOT Chicago gives me the new freq., and says that KDPA is using the RNAV 02L. (Double crap) I ask him to standby while I spend a hot 2 min (felt like 30) looking for the plate. Plus, for some damn reason I can’t get 120.9 dialed in. I come to my senses that this is nuts, confess to Chicago and ask for vectors to Schaumburg. He did, and that was it.
Still not sure what I was supposed to do with an approach to an airport I wasn’t landing at.
Seeing 06C was easy, thanks to all the landmark tips (@kaiser). It’s a great little airport.
They are now Holiday, by the way.
Made this trip last weekend. Filed KHHG EON BOJAK 06C; got V38 EON JOT; then at MAPPS got direct JOT. No prob. North of EON, Approach tells me the traffic at ORD is landing east, am I familiar with the alternatives. (Crap) I tell him negative. He gives me 2 choices. Cancel my IFR and proceed to 06C, or continue through Dupage. Like an idiot, I asked for the Dupage option—I thought KDPA would just vector me through, then cancel the IFR and turn me loose on the other side. But no. Over KLOT Chicago gives me the new freq., and says that KDPA is using the RNAV 02L. (Double crap) I ask him to standby while I spend a hot 2 min (felt like 30) looking for the plate. Plus, for some damn reason I can’t get 120.9 dialed in. I come to my senses that this is nuts, confess to Chicago and ask for vectors to Schaumburg. He did, and that was it.
Still not sure what I was supposed to do with an approach to an airport I wasn’t landing at.
Seeing 06C was easy, thanks to all the landmark tips (@kaiser). It’s a great little airport.
They are now Holiday, by the way.
rwellner98
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oh there’s lunch, land
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Yes, that's exactly right. The closest 06C has to an instrument approach is that approach at KDPA, to get below the overcast and proceed VFR to Schaumburg from there. I don't know of any place where this is documented in writing, but it's a fairly common local procedure.
- Martin
Right, but it was clear and a million, and chicago app knew I was 06C bound. Giving me the approach DPA was using before handing me over just threw me for a sec. Next time I'll just cancel my IFR at EON and stay under the shelf.
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