NorCal Meetings Eternal page

Goofy said:
Look for some strange planes there too....

Seems fishing is allowed in the harbor, kids may enjoy that....:dunno:


Also fresh fish for sale to take home for dinner!
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Can you make it ?
Oh yeah, crab season opened yesterday. Get the live ones off the boats.
 
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I'm kidless this weekend, but might be bringing some self loading ballast. I'm in an Archer this time.
 
I have a guy looking at my plane at 10:30, so I might be a little late. I have a few of your numbers, so I will text.
 
Yezzir, the Princeton Seafood Company has a salmon salad with my name on it!
 
NOAA forecast is for NW 17-24 G30mph. Already the AWOS (650 728-5649) is 330@16 G21 and getting worse. Not sure if low-timers (myself included) would be comfortable with the turbulence off the hills. On the bright side, LVK is calm.
I would MUCH rather be at HAF if not for the forecast and the AWOS...
I'll check back here in a bit as to what y'all are gonna do.
 
Looks like the NOAA forecast has mellowed a bit, and so has the AWOS. I'll be there.
South parking area.
 
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Ok Clearprop and I are at the Pronceton Seafood Company in the harbor.
 
I m ready to take off but Awos is saying ceiling at 1400.
So no go for me
 
Was lovely around noon. About 1:30 some light ceiling types flowed in but broke up now and then. If anyone noticed the beautiful Long EZ with missle looking pods under the wings, that was Mike Melville.
He flew it round the world. He is also the first guy to fly Burt's Spaceship One into space!
 
Goofy said:
Was lovely around noon. About 1:30 some light ceiling types flowed in but broke up now and then. If anyone noticed the beautiful Long EZ with missle looking pods under the wings, that was Mike Melville.
He flew it round the world. He is also the first guy to fly Burt's Spaceship One into space!
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Yes I saw it. Was there some sort of canard get together going on?
 
Goofy said:
Was lovely around noon. About 1:30 some light ceiling types flowed in but broke up now and then. If anyone noticed the beautiful Long EZ with missle looking pods under the wings, that was Mike Melville.
He flew it round the world. He is also the first guy to fly Burt's Spaceship One into space!
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Cool, and to think I parked next to his plane today :)

I caught up with John (Clearprop), Aeric and Sac. It was at about 1,200 and marginal, when I departed around 2:45, but I got out OK. With a straight out, you don't really get near the clouds, because it was clear offshore.
 
John221us said:
Cool, and to think I parked next to his plane today :)

I caught up with John (Clearprop), Aeric and Sac. It was at about 1,200 and marginal, when I departed around 2:45, but I got out OK. With a straight out, you don't really get near the clouds, because it was clear offshore.
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That's our story, and were sticking to it!
 
Goofy said:
Was lovely around noon. About 1:30 some light ceiling types flowed in but broke up now and then. If anyone noticed the beautiful Long EZ with missle looking pods under the wings, that was Mike Melville.
He flew it round the world. He is also the first guy to fly Burt's Spaceship One into space!
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We saw him come in but I figured it was just another goofy guy in a canard. ;)
 
I thought 1400 will for sure cover the mountain tops and I may not be able to get in or later get out. guess I am chicken :D

Well I did not want to let the day go by without flying so...

I flew to LVK, full stop landing then asked ground for flight following to Los banos, they gave me a left Xwnd departure, later I changed the course and followed FWY5 to LSN few over the field and turned West flew over the san luis resvoir (kind of followed HWY 52) to frazier lake park finally, turned north west over the coyote and anderson lakes to RHV about 140 kts total.

Sorry to miss meeting you guys but got spectacular views and awesome flying, 2.5 hours of pure flying and nothing to stop me from going, loved it!!!
 
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rhvpilot said:
Did you face any problems getting out?
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You made the right choice. When I finally got there at 1:00, the clouds were just beginning to form. When you checked the AWOS at around 2:00, there was definitely cloud cover and when I left at around 3:30 it said 1200 broken. Odd thing is, the clouds were over the south end of the runway and to the east. The only way out, and a clear one it was, was straight out to the north. I made a departure to the north, called up Norcal and got a clearance through the Bravo and then south around the clouds home.
The trip you said you made was almost exactly the same one I did two weeks ago, except in reverse. I landed at Frazier Lake and checked out the airplanes on display for their monthly display day.
Sorry you couldn't make it out this time, we'll do it again somewhere soon!
 
You know, it's a bit far, but one of these times, we're going to have to visit Harris Ranch and experience the world's only olfactory instrument approach.

I've flown over LSN a whole bunch (that reservoir is an amazing VFR checkpoint), but I've never landed there. But, RHV, your next one should be Columbia. Definitely take the family and make a day trip out of it. The historical park is about a mile walk, and really worth it.
 
I have landed at Harris ranch once and later I stayed in their hotel. pretty nice for such a middle of no where place. they are known for their "corn fed" stake. olfactory instrument approach is needed. I was thinking we should meet up there sometime. pretty nice restaurant.
 
MAKG1 said:
You know, it's a bit far, but one of these times, we're going to have to visit Harris Ranch and experience the world's only olfactory instrument approach.

I've flown over LSN a whole bunch (that reservoir is an amazing VFR checkpoint), but I've never landed there. But, RHV, your next one should be Columbia. Definitely take the family and make a day trip out of it. The historical park is about a mile walk, and really worth it.
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I guess I gotta try out columbia with kids. My wife does not trust my flying skills yet:D

I was planning to go to Bakersfield or Fullerton on thanks giving weekend to visit some friends. Not familiar with the Bravo at LAX and makes me nervous going above the grape wine and then into Los angeles' congested, and complicated B space.
 
rhvpilot said:
Anybody any suggestions for flight to KFUL from KRHV.
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Where exactly are you going. There is a big difference between Bakersfield and Fullerton and a lot of airports in between. All of them are doable (except LAX). You do have to watch the weather a bit more, past the mountains. I flew into SNA once for a wedding down there, Whiteman for a meeting in downtown L.A., Riverside for a Wedding and to pick up my Dad, Big Bear (winter) to visit my Dad and Santa Barbara a bunch to visit and transport my son. Anything short of the Bravo is easy. Transitioning isn't too bad, you just have to follow the published procedures. I have been stopped short a few times, due to the marine layer (I am VFR only), so you need a plan B.
 
John221us said:
Where exactly are you going. There is a big difference between Bakersfield and Fullerton and a lot of airports in between. All of them are doable (except LAX). You do have to watch the weather a bit more, past the mountains. I flew into SNA once for a wedding down there, Whiteman for a meeting in downtown L.A., Riverside for a Wedding and to pick up my Dad, Big Bear (winter) to visit my Dad and Santa Barbara a bunch to visit and transport my son. Anything short of the Bravo is easy. Transitioning isn't too bad, you just have to follow the published procedures. I have been stopped short a few times, due to the marine layer (I am VFR only), so you need a plan B.
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Thanks john
Bakersfield was my home base until last year. I am seeking advice to Fullerton. I am trying to expand my wings.
 
rhvpilot said:
Thanks john
Bakersfield was my home base until last year. I am seeking advice to Fullerton. I am trying to expand my wings.
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For Fullerton, I think you basically have a two choices. Either go with a bravo transition via the coliseum route or fly under the bravo out toward El Monte.

The one thing I noticed while operating in bravo as a new pilot was that the controllers expect you to adhere to certain climb and descent guidelines (see AIM 4-4-10) but these are not really highlighted in the ppl curriculum.
 
As a general rule, 500 FPM climbs and descents should be used in an unpressurized aircraft when performance allows (you won't make 500 FPM climbs at high altitude). That's consistent with IFR expectations and minimizes passenger discomfort. When an instruction is given "immediately," zoom-climb and lose airspeed down to Vy. You can get a few hundred feet that way in seconds, often enough to avoid the midair ATC thinks is coming.
 
rhvpilot said:
Anybody any suggestions for flight to KFUL from KRHV.
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I do Nor Cal to So Cal now quite a bit and it was nerve racking my first trip through LAX Bravo. Study the transition routes and know your options. Once you do it, it is a piece of cake but be on your game on the radio. I have all the routes mapped out and saved in Foreflight.

Now that I am more comfortable and familiar with it, I will now take flying THROUGH the LAX Bravo any day over trying to fly under it and around it...especially on weekends...there is always seems to be a TON of other traffic zooming around down there...but then again, I actually prefer and enjoy being on Flight Following unless I am just zipping around locally.

I personally prefer flying via KSBA then direct LAX to KFUL rather than over the Grapevine if weather permits. Only adds a few minutes but seems to make for a much easier trip and set up for LAX Bravo and less turbulent if it is windy over the pass.

Going to KFUL, I take the LAX Coastal Route transition at 5500' south (or 6500' northbound). Always seems to be less traffic there than the other transitions. From SBA it is an easy set up to the coastal route and you can get to 5500' at any time and be ready for the LAX ATC radio show (controller nearly lost it on my last trip he was so busy...it was kinda funny) rather than dropping in after crossing the grapevine. Outta LAX they will turn ya left over KLGB which will pretty much set ya up on downwind leg for KFUL.
 
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...oh, and Harrris Ranch sounds like a GREAT idea. I am hoping I can join you guys one of these weekends when my schedule will let me!
 
Shawn said:
Going to KFUL, I take the LAX Coastal Route Bravo transition at 5500' south (or 6500' northbound). Always seems to be less traffic there than the other transitions.
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I flew LA-SFR last time I wan in Socal. So easy, both ways north and south on my trip I was the only plane flying it. Great view of Lax too.
 
JBrown243 said:
I flew LA-SFR last time I wan in Socal. So easy, both ways north and south on my trip I was the only plane flying it. Great view of Lax too.
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The SFRA route is also great, but if you are already on flight following and WANT flight following to your destination, they will dump ya and tell ya to squawk 1201 when you hit the LAX SFRA transition...then you are on your own to reestablish FF.
 
Shawn said:
...oh, and Harrris Ranch sounds like a GREAT idea. I am hoping I can join you guys one of these weekends when my schedule will let me!
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It sounds like we have our next lunch spot picked out.

Harris Ranch is always good food, just make sure all the vents are closed before 10nm north.
 
Shawn said:
I do Nor Cal to So Cal now quite a bit and it was nerve racking my first trip through LAX Bravo. Study the transition routes and know your options. Once you do it, it is a piece of cake but be on your game on the radio. I have all the routes mapped out and saved in Foreflight.

Now that I am more comfortable and familiar with it, I will now take flying THROUGH the LAX Bravo any day over trying to fly under it and around it...especially on weekends...there is always seems to be a TON of other traffic zooming around down there...but then again, I actually prefer and enjoy being on Flight Following unless I am just zipping around locally.

I personally prefer flying via KSBA then direct LAX to KFUL rather than over the Grapevine if weather permits. Only adds a few minutes but seems to make for a much easier trip and set up for LAX Bravo and less turbulent if it is windy over the pass.

Going to KFUL, I take the LAX Coastal Route transition at 5500' south (or 6500' northbound). Always seems to be less traffic there than the other transitions. From SBA it is an easy set up to the coastal route and you can get to 5500' at any time and be ready for the LAX ATC radio show (controller nearly lost it on my last trip he was so busy...it was kinda funny) rather than dropping in after crossing the grapevine. Outta LAX they will turn ya left over KLGB which will pretty much set ya up on downwind leg for KFUL.
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I did some skyvector search and could come up with the following two options. If you have some time please click on the link and give some feedback.
http://skyvector.com/?ll=34.1752475....87704753920641,-118.14394702094837:A.K2.KFUL



http://skyvector.com/?ll=33.92330489302806,-118.26848146994921&chart=114&zoom=2&plan=A.K2.KRHV:V.K2.RZS:A.K2.KOXR:A.K2.CL10:G.34.01017748813422,-118.49037605491853:V.K2.LAX:F.K2.VPLVT:A.K2.KFUL


Please bear with my redundancy, I am trying to picture in my mind.
It seems like, I request a flight follwing from RHV to FUL along with request for LAX bravo transition via coastal (if I fly along the coast to SBA )or Colliseum route (if I fly inland to gorman VOR and then over the grapewine) . When they hand me off to LAX, I request Bravo transition get on the route using LAX (for coastal) or Van nuys (for colliseum) VOR . After transition they will ask me to get off the route for turn to FUL coz I will still be in Bravo?

I greatly appreciate the feedback.
 
You can also easily do Grapevine to Coastal Route as well. That is what I do when the winds are calm and I want to get there quick as possible and don't care about the scenic route.

Both routes work, but with the Coliseum Route it is a transition at 9500' technically until you are clear of Bravo...they *may* allow you to descend early, but otherwise it would be a dive bomb to get down to Fullerton from 9500'.

On the Coastal route...yes, they will let you know when you can turn left to KFUL. Technically, once you exit Bravo at VPLVT, you can turn left and get under the 5000' Bravo shelf and stay above the 2600' KLGB Delta and go wherever you want to KFUL, but I let them vector me where they need me to stay outta the KLGB traffic. They typically have you cross KLGB mid field then hand you off to KFUL Tower.

If you go Coastal Route, you have to enter the Bravo at the intersection of the LAX 323 Radial and the Bravo at Sepulveda Pass (your route has you cutting across to Santa Monica Pier.) Fly the straight lines of the routes all the way in and out of the Bravo airspace.

Once you get on FF outta KRHV and eventually get handed off to Oakland Center as you get outta Nor Cal Approach's airspace, they typically will ask for your "route of flight"...if you tell them "via Gorman to LAX" or "via Santa Barbra to LAX" they will know that you want a LAX Bravo transition once you get down there.

Every time they have asked me how I would like to transition LAX Bravo several handoffs before I even get to the LAX Approach handoff. Once I tell them my route they usually responded with "expect Coastal Route". Only once (when the controller almost lost it) did I have to request clearance as I got closer...and started to think about my alternate that I had planned if I was denied...all but that time, they gave me clearance before I had to specifically request it. Remeber that you need explicit "Cleared Into Bravo" before you can cross that blue line.

Keep sharp on the radio and your ears open...you may get quite a few handoffs once you hit the LA basin on FF.
 
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Shawn said:
You can also easily do Grapevine to Coastal Route as well. That is what I do when the winds are calm and I want to get there quick as possible and don't care about the scenic route.

Both routes work, but with the Coliseum Route it is a transition at 9500' technically until you are clear of Bravo...they *may* allow you to descend early, but otherwise it would be a dive bomb to get down to Fullerton from 9500'.

On the Coastal route...yes, they will let you know when you can turn left to KFUL. Technically, once you exit Bravo at VPLVT, you can turn left and get under the 5000' Bravo shelf and stay above the 2600' KLGB Delta and go wherever you want to KFUL, but I let them vector me where they need me to stay outta the KLGB traffic. They typically have you cross KLGB mid field then hand you off to KFUL Tower.

If you go Coastal Route, you have to enter the Bravo at the intersection of the LAX 323 Radial and the Bravo at Sepulveda Pass (your route has you cutting across to Santa Monica Pier.) Fly the straight lines of the routes all the way in and out of the Bravo airspace.

Once you get on FF outta KRHV and eventually get handed off to Oakland Center as you get outta Nor Cal Approach's airspace, they typically will ask for your "route of flight"...if you tell them "via Gorman to LAX" or "via Santa Barbra to LAX" they will know that you want a LAX Bravo transition once you get down there.

Every time they have asked me how I would like to transition LAX Bravo several handoffs before I even get to the LAX Approach handoff. Once I tell them my route they usually responded with "expect Coastal Route". Only once (when the controller almost lost it) did I have to request clearance as I got closer...and started to think about my alternate that I had planned if I was denied...all but that time, they gave me clearance before I had to specifically request it. Remeber that you need explicit "Cleared Into Bravo" before you can cross that blue line.

Keep sharp on the radio and your ears open...you may get quite a few handoffs once you hit the LA basin on FF.
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Shawn,
This is awesome, I greatly appreciate the help.

What altitudes would you recomend over the grapewine (following FWY5) and via SBA.

Incase transition is denied (worst case scenario) can you suggest a plan B? I was thinking either I can fly SFRA or fly east past BUR and and then fly North east of 210 FWY to El Monte and descend 3500 turn West to FUL under Bravo? Also, incase of denial can I ask Socal again for FF under Bravo?

When FF dumps me at transition, what is the best way to re establish FF, (it is probably gonna be pretty scary busy in LA basin).

Once again thank you very much.
 
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rhvpilot said:
What altitudes would you recomend over the grapewine (following FWY5) and via SBA.
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Over Grapevine, southbound I am usually at 7500' with plenty of comfort in the pass, 8500' northbound. You may loose radio contact for a while over Gorman through the pass when you get handed off to LA Center.

Over SBA, I fly at 3500' down the coastline if I have newbies and wanna add in some sight seeing (although your emegency landing options are limited in areas), 5500' feet if I wanna enjoy the scenery, 7500' or 9500' if I just wanna get there.

rhvpilot said:
In case transition is denied (worst case scenario) can you suggest a plan B? I was thinking either I can fly SFRA or fly east past BUR and and then fly North east of 210 FWY to El Monte and descend 3500 turn West to FUL under Bravo? Also, incase of denial can I ask Socal again for FF under Bravo?
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I plan for the SRFA as the backup going into Orange County area...there is not ATC communication required other than CTAF radio position calls, so there is no denial into Bravo and is easier than trying to navigate around and under the Bravo if you are unfamiliar with it. For the locals, it is probably every day flying.

In Foreflight, I have ALL the routes through LAX mapped out from the entry to exit points and saved as a favorite so I can recall any of them at any time in case I need to punt.

rhvpilot said:
When FF dumps me at transition, what is the best way to re establish FF, (it is probably gonna be pretty scary busy in LA basin).
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Just have the So Cal Approach frequency handy for the south side of LAX and call them up once you are through the SRFA if they dump ya off...but in reality, I haven't heard of very many denials though LAX Bravo...they would rather have control of the planes in the airspace than a bunch of VFR flights on their own screwing up all the IFR traffic at all the So Cal airports!

It can defiantly be scary and intimating the first time down, but once you do it it is a piece of cake. Use the term "unfamiliar" when you need help and with going into Fullerton and ATC will point ya in the right direction. I always take the approach on the radio that FF is something that I want and know that they can boot me any time, so I am willing to do whatever ATC needs me to do to make their lives easier and keep me on. Have gotten many "thanks for your cooperation" from ATC which makes me all warm and fuzzy inside!
 
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Shawn said:
Over Grapevine, southbound I am usually at 7500' with plenty of comfort in the pass, 8500' northbound. You may loose radio contact for a while over Gorman through the pass when you get handed off to LA Center.

Over SBA, I fly at 3500' down the coastline if I have newbies and wanna add in some sight seeing (although your emegency landing options are limited in areas), 5500' feet if I wanna enjoy the scenery, 7500' or 9500' if I just wanna get there.



I plan for the SRFA as the backup going into Orange County area...there is not ATC communication required other than CTAF radio position calls, so there is no denial into Bravo and is easier than trying to navigate around and under the Bravo if you are unfamiliar with it. For the locals, it is probably every day flying.

In Foreflight, I have ALL the routes through LAX mapped out from the entry to exit points and saved as a favorite so I can recall any of them at any time in case I need to punt.



Just have the So Cal Approach frequency handy for the south side of LAX and call them up once you are through the SRFA if they dump ya off...but in reality, I haven't heard of very many denials though LAX Bravo...they would rather have control of the planes in the airspace than a bunch of VFR flights on their own screwing up all the IFR traffic at all the So Cal airports!

It can defiantly be scary and intimating the first time down, but once you do it it is a piece of cake. Use the term "unfamiliar" when you need help and with going into Fullerton and ATC will point ya in the right direction. I always take the approach on the radio that FF is something that I want and know that they can boot me any time, so I am willing to do whatever ATC needs me to do to make their lives easier and keep me on. Have gotten many "thanks for your cooperation" from ATC which makes me all warm and fuzzy inside!
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Thanks for the help, this is great. your next fly in lunch is on me:yes:
 
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