Medical was deferred due to felony today

Discussion in 'Medical Topics' started by Tyrease Phillips, May 2, 2018.

  1. Tyrease Phillips

    Tyrease Phillips Pre-Flight

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    I know that must have answered the question about what it takes to get a medical cert when it comes to felonies well today I went in with no real experience and was deferred from a felony from years ago the thing is how does this process work after the deferment if anyone has went through this part of it I really would love some help want to go into pilot school this summer thank you
     
  2. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    Best contact a good aviation attorney. AOPA will have a name for you.
     
  3. Brad Z

    Brad Z Final Approach

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    May I recommend the use of periods?

    They will want more information...arrest record, police report, personal statements, etc. It sounds like you listed something in question 18v or 18w. Here's what the AME guide has to say:

    18.v. History of Arrest(s), Conviction(s), and/or Administrative Action(s). Arrest(s), conviction(s) and/or administrative action(s) affecting driving privileges may raise questions about the applicant's fitness for certification and may be cause for disqualification. A single driving while intoxicated (DWI) arrest, conviction and/or administrative action usually is not cause for denial provided there are no other instances or indications of substance dependence or abuse. See Substances of Dependence/Abuse.

    18.w. History of nontraffic convictions. The applicant must report any other (nontraffic) convictions (e.g., assault, battery, public intoxication, robbery, etc.). The applicant must name the charge for which convicted and the date of the conviction(s), and copies of court documents (if available).
     
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  4. murphey

    murphey Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    For starters, forget about starting flight school this summer. You can take lessons, but you won't solo because the medical is required.

    You need to talk to a lawyer who specializes in aviation law and stop posting under your real name.

    Next, the deferment should contain instructions on the next step you need to take. For example, find a lawyer who specializes in aviation law.
     
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  5. Matthew

    Matthew Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Now that it's in FAA's hands, you should be getting a letter describing what additional info you'll need to gather. Like BradZ said, you can start getting copies of records now, you'll probably need them.
     
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  6. midlifeflyer

    midlifeflyer Touchdown! Greaser!

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    :yeahthat:

    The lawyer should also understand your state's criminal law and procedure. Don't go this one alone. My experience is that most defendants (particularly those with little experience in the system) in criminal cases don't really understand the process very well. The lawyer is not there to do battle, but to advise.

    I'd add "don't post at all," real name or not.
     
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  7. jallen0

    jallen0 Pre-takeoff checklist

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    This is an attorney question for sure but I wonder what is worse, a non-violent, non drug related felony within the last 5 years, or 2-3 non-violent non-drug felonies over 30 years ago. In other words, is it the time limit, or the number of felonies?
     
  8. Stewartb

    Stewartb Final Approach

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    Talking about isn’t a threat, even with your real name. The FAA has published rules they operate by. Learn the rules and figure out whether you can satisfy their requirements, just like with medical issues. You might need a lawyer, you might not. AOPA may be able to help you but a simple call to OKC Aeromedical will help you understand what you’ll need to do. If you want it? Find out how to get it.
     
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  9. SkyDog58

    SkyDog58 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    I don’t know. I do know that I have made it through 60 years of life without committing a felony. It isn’t difficult to do. Very few people break laws not knowing that they are doing so and without knowing there are consequences. This is one of those consequences.

    Now that being said, I do agree that certain felonies are not as bad as others. I would even say that some felonies probably shouldn’t be felonies in the first place. It would also not bother me if someone who committed one of those lesser felonies were to become a pilot and share the same airspace with me. But we don’t decide that.

    I believe the FAA looks harshly on felons as they believe if you have no regard for the big laws then you will have none for their regulations. And I agree that in a large percentage of cases, they are probably right.
     
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  10. FastEddieB

    FastEddieB Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Tyrease, you there? What do you think of the advice you've received so far?
     
  11. James331

    James331 Ejection Handle Pulled

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    Big difference between even the last generation and now, misdemeanors are handed out like candy, and the culture is very robocop.

    Heck I got into a few fights back in school, no biggie, actually ended up ether getting along with the kid after or even becoming quasi friends, try that nowadays and a "school resource officer" aka a cop that patrols and monitors children, will put your kid in handcuffs complete with database entries that might end his future.

    Lest we forget all the crazy laws.

    Remember the woman who had a concealed license, drove through NJ, got pulled over for some minor traffic thing, was upfront and told the cop she had a CCW, ended up in jail facing prision time, if it wasn't for her luckily being a law abiding black woman and catching the public and medias eye and the public outrage which got her a pardon, she'd be locked in a cage right now.

    http://www.philly.com/philly/news/n...rdons_Phila__mom_snagged_by_N_J__gun_law.html



    Yet on the flip side, you can break into someone's house while they sleep, walk out with their TV, and if the homeowner shoots the home invader they'll probably end up in jail or best case a second mortgage to cover all the legal expenses, OR if the burglar gets caught by the police they'll just be out in a day or two because all the beds are filled with people who committed victimless "crimes"

    Welcome to "getting tuff on crime" and "zero tolerance" world, too bad we can't get SMART on crime instead.


    This is what's called a "managerial state".
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Managerial_state
     
  12. mscard88

    mscard88 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Yes! Stopped reading after about ten words...
     
  13. bflynn

    bflynn Final Approach

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    I'm not sure this is a lawyer question at all, partly because I don't know whether this is a new arrest or one that is old, reported and deferred to the FAA for a decision. If the court case is ended, there's no need for a lawyer. If not, then you need a lawyer for the legal case, but not for your medical.

    The bottom line is that the FAA is concerned with future behavior and past actions are the only real indicator they have of that. Rule breaking like this is considered under Item 47, psychiatric conditions. The legal authority traces back to FAR 61.153(c) and the phrase "good moral standing". The nature of the felony is highly relevant too. It is a felony to speed on the George Washington Parkway near DC because it's a federal road. It is also a felony to smuggle heroin into the country. One is forgivable, the other is not.

    We do not need to know what your condition is. It's not impossible, but there are roadblocks. One possible outcome is that you might never fly.

    https://www.faa.gov/about/office_or...m/ame/guide/app_process/app_history/item18/w/

    I presume that you reported this on section 18w and the AME deferred it. What happens next is that you wait for several weeks (months?). The FAA sends you a letter which will tells you exactly what you must do to get your medical. Ok, maybe you need a lawyer to get the court records, but if you're a little diligent, you can actually do that yourself. Whatever the FAA has on the letter, do it cheerfully and comply fully. At some point, you will get another letter which will contain your medical. Or maybe this will turn into a denial, there's no telling until the FAA makes it's decision.

    https://www.pilotsofamerica.com/community/threads/medical-with-felony.58285/
    https://www.pilotsofamerica.com/community/threads/deferment-felony.48144/
    https://www.pilotsofamerica.com/com...uestion-concerning-medical-certificate.33636/
     
  14. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    Yep, I never got caught either.
     
  15. flyingron

    flyingron Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Grand Theft? Idaho?
     
  16. Palmpilot

    Palmpilot Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    How do you know it was his or her real name?
     
  17. Palmpilot

    Palmpilot Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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  18. jbarrass

    jbarrass Line Up and Wait PoA Supporter

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    Maybe. I recommend people read Three Felonies A Day: How the Feds Target the Innocent, by Harvey Silverglate. You may have thrown a light bulb in the trash once (felony disposal of hazardous material).

    I agree that all felonies are not created equally, and most people never find themselves dealing with them. And most, but not all that do, may deserve it. I have no idea about the OP, but I wish him luck.

    Edit: Palmpilot beat me to it....
     
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  19. Dave Theisen

    Dave Theisen En-Route

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    I don’t understand all the “Get a Lawyer “ and “stop posting under your real name” advice. They guys seems to be owning his past and is just asking what to expect from the process.
     
  20. murphey

    murphey Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Unfortunately, when dealing with the FAA, owning up on the medical is not a good idea in a public forum.
     
  21. midlifeflyer

    midlifeflyer Touchdown! Greaser!

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    the reason is the reason I posted. Fun fact (as an example): all of the cases that have come to the NTSB for certificate revocation for falsification involving an expunged record were cases in which the record had not been expunged. In most it appears the applicant thought it had been.

    I do a legal ethics seminar on social media with some funny (not to the folks involved) examples of where innocent social media posting had a very bad result on a legal matter. Some states have gone as far as to require lawyers to advise clients not to do it.
     
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  22. Palmpilot

    Palmpilot Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    I do know of at least one recent Twitter posting that ended up in a legal filing within hours of being written!
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2018
  23. LoneAspen

    LoneAspen Line Up and Wait

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    Social media - something I have no use for, and never will. I've never had, and never will have, a Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Snapchat, or any other social media account. The closest thing I have is LinkedIn, and if it weren't helpful for the interviewing process, I wouldn't even have that.
     
  24. midlifeflyer

    midlifeflyer Touchdown! Greaser!

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    This forum is social media.
     
  25. SkyDog58

    SkyDog58 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Yeah, I probably should have qualified my statement by saying "I have made it through 60 years of life without knowingly or intentionally committing a felony". I'm sure we all occasionally break some obscure to us federal or state law or regulation. This would especially be true of EPA regs and others within the CFR. It's highly likely that many of us have unintentionally violated a FAR or two during our aviation career. The modern world is a complicated one. However, I would venture to guess that only a very small percentage of convicted felons fall into this category. Most of those sort of violations are not felonies and those that are rarely end in felony convictions. I would also venture a guess that most felons knowingly violated a law that anyone with a functioning brain cell knew was illegal.
     
  26. SkyDog58

    SkyDog58 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    I guess boasting about getting away with violating the law makes you feel like a big man.
     
  27. FastEddieB

    FastEddieB Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Right now, I think at the very least the OP is guilty of hit-and-run.

    Maybe we should put this on hold until he returns to the scene of the crime.
     
  28. denverpilot

    denverpilot Tied Down PoA Supporter

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    You'd be partially right. Most felons did one thing they knew was wrong, and had a laundry list of additional charges they didn't know they did, tossed at them.

    All it takes is two things nowadays to put most people in jail...

    1. Drawing negative law enforcement attention to oneself. (Doesn't have to be a felony.)
    2. Speaking in ANY form about the event that drew the attention to oneself to law enforcement. (Including anything you've said about it online or anywhere else.)

    ANYTHING you say, can and will be used... Remember, the things you say don't have to be used to prove anything, just to *insinuate* things to a jury...

     
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  29. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    If you have a problem with my sarcasm, you can pack sand.
     
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  30. Ravioli

    Ravioli Final Approach PoA Supporter

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    Your deferral was for "a felony today." That's some swift justice.

    I guess timing is everything. Or is it that punctuation is everything?
     
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  31. bflynn

    bflynn Final Approach

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    Why not? Everything is out in the open. As long as what is in public matches what is on the medical form, no worries
     
  32. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    I really don't believe that the FAA puts much stock in Social media.
     
  33. Everskyward

    Everskyward Experimenter

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    Maybe the OP took the good advice to post no more.
     
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  34. murphey

    murphey Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Guess what....you'r participating in social media right now, right here.
     
  35. Tarheelpilot

    Tarheelpilot En-Route

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    I would think that after a felon has payed their debt to society they should not be punished for the rest of their lives.
     
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  36. SkyDog58

    SkyDog58 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Wrong!


    We are antisocial media! :p
     
  37. SkyDog58

    SkyDog58 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    I guess that would depend on your definition of the terms “paid their debt” and “punished”.
     
  38. Salty

    Salty Final Approach

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    Sounds good on the surface. Would you want a child molester babysitting your kids as long as they’d served their time?
     
  39. flyingron

    flyingron Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    The problem with criminal records is the FAA views that they might indicate an underlying mental condition (or at best a tendency to want to follow the rules). A single event, not tied also with some mental health condition, shouldn't be a problem (and I'm surprised resulted in a deferral, apparently not a proactive AME). Then again, separate from the medical, there's a list of "security" offenses that are going to bother other parts of the FAA and DHS.
     
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  40. BrianNC

    BrianNC En-Route

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    No. But then again that crime and the activity are directly related in your example. There are many felonies if not most of them that are totally unrelated to flying. At the same time I can understand their being deferred until at least it's researched. But I don't agree with denying a medical just because they had a felony.
     
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