How do you file and why? (direct vs airways)
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tsts4
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My belief is filing has a regional aspect to it based upon the complexity of the airspace. Departing from my home airport I add in some intermediate fixes that I know I’m going to get no matter what but generally I file direct, fly what I get and try to work shortcuts if needed along the way. Most of my flying is in the Southeast and some in the Midwest and I tend to get direct for the most part. My understanding is that in the Northeast you’ll never get direct.
MooneyDriver78
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There’s almost no chance of getting direct on the east coast if you fly below 10k: military airspace and large airports cover much of the areas.
In Florida they will push you west, far away from east coast and bring you back when at same latitude, even on short flights, significantly increasing your flight time.
In Florida they will push you west, far away from east coast and bring you back when at same latitude, even on short flights, significantly increasing your flight time.
midlifeflyer
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It depends where. You begin to learn what works in the areas where you fly. In less busy areas, direct will work. In SOCAL, might as well file the applicable TEC since that's what you will get. File almost anything other than a common or preferred route in the northeast (mostly airways) and, even if the Center computer says OK, get ready to hear, "I have a full route clearance for you. Advise ready to copy," like me yesterday and especially like this guy (I wish I knew what he filed)...
EFBs can make it easier. Many include commonly cleared routes. When you see that a route was cleared 117 times in the past whatever, it's a clue.
EFBs can make it easier. Many include commonly cleared routes. When you see that a route was cleared 117 times in the past whatever, it's a clue.
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4RNB
Maybe be more specific on "East Coast" as that is where I fly and always direct.
PaulS
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It depends, I filed direct many times, but end up with an in air reroute about 70 % of the time. Foreflight's routes are usually pretty good, so I use those a lot too.
PaulS
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I had one time, I forget where it was, I think it was coming out of Winston-Salem heading north. I got cleared as filed, then about 10 minutes into the flight the controller asked me where I was headed, I told him my destination, he said "did you file direct?" I said, "yup", he went "hmmm, that shouldn't have happened, stand by for a new route." He came back with about a 10 waypoint clearance for me.
eman1200
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Bro do you even lift
I’m kinda thinking the same thing.
Most EFB’s have some sort of ‘routing’ option where you can see what to possibly expect.
Country Flier
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I had a similar thing happen over eastern New York/Vermont…but in my case it had something to do with mountains/moca.
MooneyDriver78
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By coast, I actually mean coast, ie within 10nm of the water. From Miami Florida to NYC. There might be some spots in GA-SC that are open for direct. Florida has Orlando, cape airspace, Jax/Mayport military area, NC has a couple of restricted areas, and then DC/Philly/NYC areas of course.
In Florida I filed from KSUA to KFXE, a distance of about 70nm, I was vectored a good 20 nm west, then due south, then back eastward, adding 40nm or more to a 70nm direct route.
I file direct unless flying through NYC airspace. If I'm going into a Bravo airport I look for STARs and file one if they have one for bugsmashers.
I think WAAS makes a difference (it's been so long since I've flown non-WAAS that I honestly don't remember).
midlifeflyer
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Remember that WAAS adds vertical capabilities. It's not particularly relevant to enroute routing.
Mahneuvers
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My IFR DPE told me he always flies airways over mountainous terrain but otherwise files direct. Seemed like good advice which I've followed.
Pinecone
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A lot depends on the altitude. I have turbo and fly in the teens. I file and mostly get direct. If not direct on my clearance, shortly after getting enroute, I get cleared direct.
They other day I flew Denver (KBJC) to home in NE MD (0W3). I filed direct, I got a departure (probably due to busy DEN airspace) then direct. 1333 miles, pretty much direct.
There are some local knowledge things, like they will likely route you around the DC SFRA, not through it.
They other day I flew Denver (KBJC) to home in NE MD (0W3). I filed direct, I got a departure (probably due to busy DEN airspace) then direct. 1333 miles, pretty much direct.
There are some local knowledge things, like they will likely route you around the DC SFRA, not through it.
midlifeflyer
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I have a feeling that's what the Phenom in my video did. .
Unless things have changed a lot since I moved away, Denver invariably assigns a SID, even it it's just the DENVERx radar SID.
I'm guessing you got the PLAINS? Funny story. A friend of mine was one of those who would put NO SIDS NO STARS on his flight plans. ATC saw it and gave it to him the long way. He was very upset. I just laughed. Even before we could load them into a GPS, I never quite understood why some people preferred copying a long routing to reading it off a chart.
chemgeek
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In the NE US you can often get direct or something approximating it unless you are traversing class B airspace. In my neck of the woods (KVGC) I get cleared to a nearby VOR (or former VOR waypoint) and then often get turned loose direct at some point. If you file direct, you will get what ATC wants anyway. I used to know all the actual preferred airway routings for routine trips to various destinations, but there are many fewer airways now, and if flying by GPS anyway, direct is just as easy as T-routes, and a lot shorter.
Down the very eastern coast, you have a series of clogged and nearly overlapping class Bs (Boston, New York, Phillie, Baltimore, Washington) that will make direct routings impossible.
Down the very eastern coast, you have a series of clogged and nearly overlapping class Bs (Boston, New York, Phillie, Baltimore, Washington) that will make direct routings impossible.
Pinecone
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Yeap, clearance with PLAINS 1 Akron Transition, Direct home. Not bad for a 1333 nm straight line flight.
Pinecone
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sarangan
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Andrew, CFI-I
I think this misconception originates from the poorly worded statement in AIM Chapter 5 - "Pilots not desiring a SID or STAR should so indicate in the remarks section of the flight plan as "no SID" or "no STAR."" The written exam has (or atleast had) a question on this. Many flight instructors also propagate this misinformation. Instead, the AIM should really state "pilot who do not have a SID or STAR publication on hand should indicate that in the flight plan so that they can be given a verbal description of the SID or STAR" .
midlifeflyer
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I just looked at it and
I just looked at the route and I can absolutely see that happening even at lower altitudes. Once past Denver there's nothing in the way until you get to to DC!
midlifeflyer
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I agree with you with one small difference. If I recall correctly, "no SID/STAR" originated when they were in a different volumes from IAPs. You might have just not bought them. I don't know when the the change came, but by the time I got my rating in 1992, they were in the same book. If you don't have a SID/STAR publication, you don't have approach charts either. (No, I'm not making allowances for those who print out only the charts they think they need and fly IFR otherwise naked.)
It's a complete anachronism and any reference to "no SID/STAR" should just be removed. Either that or, using your proposed change, add, "pilot who do not have an approach plate publication on hand should indicate that in the flight plan so that they can be given a verbal description of the procedure.
masloki
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luvflyin
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FWIW, that is a thing. Controllers have actual rules about how to do it. I have never seen it used. I can’t copy and paste right now. Maybe you or someone else can. 7110.65AA 4-8-10.
midlifeflyer
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I know it's a thing. I wouldn't be surprised to learn of it's being in situations like VFR flight into IMC or lost charts, although with ubiquitous GPS we often at least have most of that information in multiple forms. Sometimes I'm lucky enough to have someone's iPad overheat during an IPC
so I can simulate it and talk about it. 
luvflyin
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It goes on to include all the notes on the Chart. Some of them could could get very verbose.I know it's a thing. I wouldn't be surprised to learn of it's being in situations like VFR flight into IMC or lost charts, although with ubiquitous GPS we often at least have most of that information in multiple forms. Sometimes I'm lucky enough to have someone's iPad overheat during an IPC
View attachment 118613
midlifeflyer
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Not "all the notes on the Chart."
Applicable notations on instrument approach charts which levy on the pilot the responsibility to comply with or act on an instruction; for example, “Straight-in minima not authorized at night,” “Procedure not authorized when glideslope/glidepath not used,” “Use of procedure limited to aircraft authorized to use airport,” “Procedure not authorized at night,” or a Snowflake icon indicating mandatory cold temperature compensation.
So many notes aren't applicable. I don't see them, advising a pilot that an approach or type of landing is NA at night during the day or of the snowflake correction at Kalispel. MT right now (or for that matter, that it has nonstandard takeoff and alternate minimums).
Rgbeard
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good for you. Some of us live in areas where airspace makes such a thing impossible.
luvflyin
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Yeah, that narrows t down a little. Hey, I’ve got an idea. We all get together on this and other Forums and have a National I don’t have the Chart day and watch ATC’s collective head explode.
Pinecone
En-Route
Fore Flight Route Advisor gives some bizarre routes. The keep showing routes through the SFRA, I mean right through, not just clipping it. And that almost never happens. You get routed around it.
schmookeeg
En-Route
I trained /A so generally file airways. More and more, though, I'm grabbing what the last 10 jamokes got out of fltplan.com and copying their route, figuring there is some ATC imperative that will get me "that clearance" eventually anyway, so why fight it
Yep, anywhere between Maine and Florida you're going to get some circuitous route that ATC wants you on. Elsewhere, not so much. I loved heading home from the Midwest. I'm getting VFR FF and navigating direct. I call ATC and ask if I can get IFR at 6000. "Cleared to Culpeper via direct maintain 6000."
Clip4
Final Approach
If the FAA still wanted the flight plan remark to mean the pilot doesn’t have the information, they would have not changed the AIM section.
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