Get your NOTAMS!

A

ATCSSCT

Filing Flight Plan
Joined
Aug 29, 2014
Messages
28
Display Name
Display name:
Kev
Can anyone tell me why the majority of pilots do NOT get their NOTAMS applicable to their flight before flying?
 
Yes. Laziness and complacency. One of many things that is a "formality of training" and forgotten about once the checkride is done. Until it comes back to bite you.
 
Thank you! An honest pilot and person of integrity! I agree. Hopefully pilots that are simply too lazy realize that FAR 91.103 mandates they get them! As a controller, its a bit annoying to be honest!
 
If we don't get notams and don't talk to controllers that OK?:D
 
if you can show me where 91.103 does not apply if you dont talk to controllers, then yupper! :)
 
whats even more amazing is how easy it is to get notams in this age of computers!
 
Strict reading of 91.103 is impossible to comply with. In my unpowered ultralights I am exempt from everything except the first impossible to comply with sentence.
 
i would have to disagree Greg. Are you implying that since you think its impossible to comply with an FAR then you might as well not even try? Hmmm...interesting concept.
 
Part of the problem is the NOTAM system is still largely disfuctional based on it's rooting in the ancient teletype driven FSS system. L notams, D notams, give me a freaking break.
In addition, most pilots are woefully ignorant of how the system works. 90% of them don't have a clue what the Class II publication is.

Second problem is that when using the real FSS briefing, my experience tells me that you have less than a 50% chance of being infrormed of relevant NOTAMS even if you specifically ask for them.

Third problem is most briefing presentations SUCK badly for online presentation of NOTAMS.

The you get down to the underlying apathy where pilots don't do anymore weather investigation than looking out the window and the FAA hasn't taken to delivering NOTAMs to the doorstep that way.
 
Define "Get your NOTAMS". I get a briefing. I get lots of NOTAMs. 99.9% of the pages and pages of NOTAMS are totally irrelevant and a waste of time to read. So I skim. Might I miss something on occasion? Probably. The signal to noise rate is ridiculous. Why would I care about 137 unlighted towers for a day VFR flight? Why would I care about anything to do with Huntsville Alabama or Toronto Ontario when I am getting a 25 nm radius briefing for a local flight from an airport in Michigan? I ignore every NOTAM that starts with DTW (and there are LOTS) because I don't have any reason to go into the class B much less land there.

Do you have a source for NOTAMS that are actually relevant to any particular flight?
 
Flying Ron...I think I need to refer you back to FAR 91.103. You are MANDATED to get your NOTAMS applicable to every single flight. Sounds almost like you too are trying to justify not complying with an FAR. Be careful, someone might be reading!
 
1979, I took a flight from Sandy Eggo CA to San Jose CA. I got a good briefing, in person, from a FSS specialist who was great. I can't tell you the total number of notams for my flight, including fuel stop and alternates, but surely it was around 15 or maybe a bit more. Nothing like today. I just checked on the same routing I took, and I stopped counting at 167.

When the notam system was changed from a tool for the safety of pilots, to a tool to regulate and promulgate policy, I stopped paying attention to most of it.

Too bad, so sad, I'm the problem - blame me.
 
Light and Sporty Guy...my goodness. All i ask is pilots, at a minimum, get the notams applicable to the airports they are flying from, and flying to. Is that too much to ask? type into the google bar "notams", then click on the first site that comes up! your there! pilotweb.nas.faa.gov simply type in the airport ID's! and sure, go ahead and skip over the ones with the lights that are out on the obstruction antennas!
 
Cowboy...you dont have to memorize them, but there might be one or two that are important to the safety of your flight!
 
ATCSSCT said:
Cowboy...you dont have to memorize them, but there might be one or two that are important to the safety of your flight!
Click to expand...

Actually, you just got the FAR wrong. I do have to memorize them, and I'm responsible for adhering to each and every one of them. That's the law.
 
What if I divert to your airport? Occasionally that happens.
 
ah nope, doesnt say you have to memorize them Cowboy.
 
Brad if you have to divert and didnt have your notams for an unplanned stop or have an emergency, I am sure the FAA would forgive you!
 
ATCSSCT said:
ah nope, doesnt say you have to memorize them Cowboy.
Click to expand...

Oh, so downloading them and discarding them without reference is ok? C'mon hotshot, get off the fence. Either you have to "get your NOTAMS!" and be diligent or are you saying all we need to do is have legal proof that we 'got' them and then we can fuggeddabbouuddit?
 
ATCSSCT said:
i would have to disagree Greg. Are you implying that since you think its impossible to comply with an FAR then you might as well not even try? Hmmm...interesting concept.
Click to expand...
Might as well go off saying fly safe 91.13 demands that you fly safe. Why can't pilots just comply with 91.13 and fly safe. It would make the ems/med examiner/body scrapers jobs so much easier. And it is the law dammit.
 
I'm confused... if you call FSS and ask for a standard briefing there's a 50% chance you won't get all the correct NOTAMs?
 
wow...i sense a bit of hostility Cowboy. i am no hot shot, but receiving (not just downloading them) your notams and memorizing them are two different things, surely you can agree.
 
Okie...my subject is reference to getting NOTAMS...but since you brought it up, if you dont, and its considered wreckless by the FAA, then yes, FAR 91.13 would also apply!
 
No, you came here to give a lecture to us pilots on how we are supposed to act when in the NAS. Finish the lesson ATC. Cuz, it's all about the fed ATC system right? Pilots are just an extension of the NAS, so lets have it all. Full download, and all the rules, regs, and interpretations.

We're listening.
 
lecturer? prolly not, lol...if i brought to light what i intended to, I'm done. Fly Safe. :) As a side note, I'm also a pilot.
 
ARCSSCT - what prompted this thread anyway? Obviously someone peed in your wheaties when you were on duty? Tell us what happened.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
ATCSSCT said:
Can anyone tell me why the majority of pilots do NOT get their NOTAMS applicable to their flight before flying?
Click to expand...

Not that I disagree with you, but where did you come up with that factoid?
 
Kev,

It is true that with all the unlit towers, now working approaches (assuming vfr flight), etc. that don't affect the safety of the flight, it is easy to skim through and perhaps miss something.

Let's make this educational and give us some real world examples that can cause a controller problems or compromise the safety of the flight. What specific notams should we look out for most.

Thanks,

Jim
 
He's not here to help pilots, he's here to vent on some poor schlub that got lost in the notam maze, and it got his panties in a twist.
 
ATCSSCT said:
Flying Ron...I think I need to refer you back to FAR 91.103. You are MANDATED to get your NOTAMS applicable to every single flight. Sounds almost like you too are trying to justify not complying with an FAR. Be careful, someone might be reading!
Click to expand...

Where did I advocate not trying to obtain the NOTAMS (or suggesting that I didn't do so), Eh?

I listed several reason why current system SUCKS which could keep NOTAMS from getting to people who are interested in getting them and why some people might not even try.
 
docmirror said:
He's not here to help pilots, he's here to vent on some poor schlub that got lost in the notam maze, and it got his panties in a twist.
Click to expand...

Well said!
Another archaic system from the faa, so far out of date it's a joke. Kind of like a lot of their work.... :yesnod:
 
Oh, and let us all not disclaim what we get when we go to the very own FAA notam website:

This site is informational in nature and is designed to assist pilots and aircrews for flight planning and familiarization. It may be used in conjunction with other pre-flight information sources needed to satisfy all the requirements of 14 CFR 91.103 and is not to be considered as a sole source of information to meet all pre-flight action.

So, let me translate. you are supposed to use this site, but if you do, it's not for reference, but only for info. And - if you use it, you'll be held liable for things that aren't even in here! To which you must click "I agree" just like a six year old with note pinned to his shirt.
 
Doesn't everyone use a highlighter on the sectional to mark every unlit tower?
 
bnt83 said:
Doesn't everyone use a highlighter on the sectional to mark every unlit tower?
Click to expand...
Nah I predrive my route, climb and duct tape glowsticks to all the unlit towers along the way. Takes a bunch of time but what price safety and complying with 91.13?:D
 
and why did i start this thread? Because at the airport tower i work at, our ATIS equipment went out, and wasnt fixed, for about a month. It was NOTAM'd out from day 1. 99% of pilots, no exaggeration, on initial call would say "i'm not able to pick up the ATIS, is it out of service?" (or some facsimile thereof). This INCLUDES the corporate pilots. I just thought it was noteworthy. Sorry if I upset anyone.
 
peed in my wheaties, lol...i like that one
 
If 99% of a population is failing at a system, we would call that pandemic. If ~49% were failing it would be endemic.

Who can solve endemic system failures which relate to human or cultural norms?

Now - bonus question: Who can solve pandemic system failures?

You got a big problem with the notams system. The solution is staring you right in the face every morning when you brush your teeth. Look not at my nom-de-plume, look at my user ID, and know.
 
Why use NOTAMS? Just come here and get expert direction...
 
I certainly understand your frustration. And it really sucks that the system in place (ATIS) that typically will notify pilots of issues for the particular airport is the one thing that's broke. Ironic! I guess we pilots should make more of an effort to find and read the NOTAMS concerning the destination airport. I know I'm guilty of not doing it on occasion. Head down, walk of shame....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top