Fight review question

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evapilotaz

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Can flight review be in any airplane? Say you want to get your high-performance endorsement and get your flight review done at the same time? How about tailwheel training and flight review done at the same time ?
 
No it can't be in any airplane. It must be in one for which you are rated.

I presume single engine land.

You can't get an hour in a 747 sim and pass that off unless you have a type rating and multi cert.
 
Ok single engine land is what I have. So getting a glider rating and getting my flight review count towards my flight review for single engine land?
 
As MAKG1 stated, per 61.56, it has to be in an aircraft for which you are rated, but in answer to your other questions the answer is yes to both as those are endorsements not ratings.
 
But yes, you can certainly combine your flight review with getting endorsements. You pay more than for a review or for an endorsement alone, but cheaper than if you did them separately (and usually a lot more enjoyable imho)
 
evapilotaz said:
Ok single engine land is what I have. So getting a glider rating and getting my flight review count towards my flight review for single engine land?
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I believe the answer is yes as a practical test checkride with a DPE counts as a flight review.
 
evapilotaz said:
Can flight review be in any airplane? Say you want to get your high-performance endorsement and get your flight review done at the same time? How about tailwheel training and flight review done at the same time ?
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If you are an ASEL you may combine the HP or tailwheel with theBFR.
 
evapilotaz said:
Ok single engine land is what I have. So getting a glider rating and getting my flight review count towards my flight review for single engine land?
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Getting a rating resets the clock on the flight review.
 
evapilotaz said:
Ok single engine land is what I have. So getting a glider rating and getting my flight review count towards my flight review for single engine land?
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Yes, any FAA check ride towards a new rating or certificate rehacks the Flight Review clock.
 
evapilotaz said:
Can flight review be in any airplane? Say you want to get your high-performance endorsement and get your flight review done at the same time? How about tailwheel training and flight review done at the same time ?
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Those two options are doable. Just make sure the CFI providing the endorsement also signs of the Flight Review. Which means an hour of ground training covering some items not related to the additional endorsement.
 
All new ratings count as a flight review and resets the clock,so long as you get the rating. Endorsements can be linked to a flight review,but usually require extra time.
 
Thank you every. I just don't want to do a flight review in the same ole Cessna 172 I have been renting. Thinking about mixing it up with something new.
 
Cool. Also look into the Wings program as an alternative to the flight review.
 
frfly172 said:
All new ratings count as a flight review and resets the clock,so long as you get the rating. Endorsements can be linked to a flight review,but usually require extra time.
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^ this. Yes you can get a new endorsement, (TD or HP or complex, or all three) concurrent with a flight review.
 
The question has already been answered numerous times, but I wanted to add that making an endorsement into a flight review doesn't necessarily need to require any more time than just an endorsement.

As a pilot, I almost always combine a flight review with some kind of new training - whether it be endorsements, new ratings, or just learning a new airplane. Make it fun! I believe I've only had about two "regular" flight reviews in over 20 years.

As an instructor, any time I'm doing an endorsement or new aircraft checkout for someone, I ask if they want it to count as a flight review. It usually doesn't take any additional time at all. Remember, the main requirement for the ground part of a flight review is review of Part 91 operating rules.

As an example, last week I gave a checkout to someone in a turbocharged airplane. Well, a reasonable part of a checkout in a turbo is a review of oxygen rules, high-altitude operations, VFR cloud clearances above 10,000, speed limits, etc. That's all Part 91 stuff that I would be covering anyway, flight review or not. So to make it count as a flight review required no additional time at all.

If we go to another airport during the checkout/endorsement, I get to see their navigation skills and flight planning anyway, a normal part of a flight review ground and flight portion. We're going to do maneuvers and emergencies anyway as well, also standard flight review stuff.

Any thorough endorsement or checkout is going to have at least an hour on the ground and is usually going to at least touch on something in Part 91. So it's a simple matter of making it a flight review, as long as the CFI knows ahead of time!
 
Palmpilot said:
What changed to ruin it?
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Views differ on that one. There have been a number of changes to the program that made it far more complicated than before and much more complicated than necessary. You'll even find FAA people who think so.

Unlike a lot of others, I still like the program overall if one limits oneself to basic Wings but it took quite a bit of time to get over the "huh?" hump.
 
evapilotaz said:
So is the wings program still viable option for the flight review alternative? We are slightly off topic buts that's ok.
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Yes it is. Boiling down the complexity, what it comes down to is

  • 3 credits for ground instruction, which can be by way of approved courses that are either live or online.
  • 3 credits for flight instruction in specific areas.
It's the flight instruction piece that has gotten a bit too complicated. To a lot of folks, they don't like the idea that you can do 1 hour of flight training and get a flight review but it's typically going to take more like 2-3 to do it via Wings. But the idea of the Wings thing is for pilots to get recurrent training more often.

Where it gets a bit complicated is that the credits are based on flight activities that are grouped together. So you (and your CFI) have to do a bit more planning to make sure things are covered. For example, one of the typical flight activities is "ASEL-Other Takeoffs and Landings and Air Work" which includes:

  • Area of Operation IV, Task C: Soft-Field Takeoff and Climb
  • Area of Operation IV, Task D: Soft-Field Approach and Landing
  • Area of Operation IV, Task E: Short-Field Takeoff and Maximum Performance Climb
  • Area of Operation V, Task A: Steep Turns
  • Area of Operation V, Task B: Steep Spiral
You might not even think of doing a steep spiral but without it you are not entitled to credit for the activity.
 
midlifeflyer said:
There have been a number of changes to the program that made it far more complicated than before and much more complicated than necessary. You'll even find FAA people who think so.
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I've only ever known of the "new" wings program but this is what's stopping me from doing it. Every time I look at the website I cannot seem to figure out what EXACTLY I have to to do.
 
I've given aircraft checkouts that have been combined with flight reviews in the past. Maybe that's something you could do to spice it up if you don't want to do an entire add on rating process.
 
GCA319 said:
I've given aircraft checkouts that have been combined with flight reviews in the past. Maybe that's something you could do to spice it up if you don't want to do an entire add on rating process.
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Yea thinking about getting checked out in a warrior combined with flight review. I have an interest in gliders as well.
 
gms5002 said:
I've only ever known of the "new" wings program but this is what's stopping me from doing it. Every time I look at the website I cannot seem to figure out what EXACTLY I have to to do.
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Same here. I used to get the "credits expiring soon" emails, but they don't tell me what to do with them. I don't think I have logged in there in a year, and don't know if I ever will again.
 
midlifeflyer said:
It's the flight instruction piece that has gotten a bit too complicated. To a lot of folks, they don't like the idea that you can do 1 hour of flight training and get a flight review but it's typically going to take more like 2-3 to do it via Wings. But the idea of the Wings thing is for pilots to get recurrent training more often.
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See, to me that's one of things that make it hard to sell people on the Wings program. Basically, the first thing anybody tells anybody about Wings is that "it can be used in lieu of a flight review!" Which sounds great, like you're getting out of doing something - that it's an easier way, or quicker, or something. But then they find out you actually have to do MORE work than a FR, and they figure "why bother?"

That's the wrong approach to take. Rather, it's important to stress WHY it's beneficial to get ongoing training - safety, possible insurance savings, new skills, have some fun, etc. THEN once they think it sounds like a decent program but aren't completely convinced, let them know that "oh by the way, it also counts as a flight review". Sold!

It's all in the presentation.
 
All the ragging on the WINGS program not withstanding...

For my last BFR we did the required ground chit chat time and then for all the flight time I sat in the RIGHT seat. I fly safety pilot quite frequently but I had never landed from the other side.


So, as I think mentioned previously, use the BFR time as you'd like to gain or practice skills. Endorsements are easy, and as many have said, a new certification is an automatic BFR.
 
Another option I don't remember seeing discussed is getting an OpenAirplane checkout.
 
All the ragging on the WINGS program, I don't know anyone who understands how it works. The system spits out a list of "suggested" things to study, says you can study anything, but provides no help in finding an "anything" beyond their suggested list. The colors and levels just make it more confusing, and the 39-page Help book is unintelligible to native English speakers.

So I take a few classes now and then, go to seminars for credit and other than that I ignore the whole WINGS program. Just had two credits expire on 9/30 because I couldn't figure out how to turn them into a set of WINGS. I do have the Bronze set, got them at a weekend event along with a Flight Review and IPC.

Only made it to one older WINGS event as a student pilot, it was very well attended and simple to understand. The new program is more esoteric than the aircraft certification regulations. Some genius at the FAA, his committee members and their boss should be fired for foisting this cockamamie mess off as a "safety improvement."
 
I found WINGS OK, but a large part of that is that a CAP Form 5 counts as 5 of the 6 activities. Not surprising; it really is a lot like a flight review.

If you've never had a flight review before, don't do anything fancy. You'll discover some of your skills need polishing, and that will keep you busy. Remember the point. It's a refresher.
 
Before I worked 135 I used to enjoy the whole BFR experience, not sure why folks rather sit infront of a computer.

Just seek out a good and different CFI and do the whole thing. Last BFR I had was a old time airline guy I found on craigslist of all places, we got into detail on a few things for our ground time, ended up going way over 1hr even though he only charged me for 1hr ground, and 1hr air. Learned some new stuff had a great conversation, a great time and reset my clock.
 
James, only the "ground" part of WINGS can be behind a computer. It can also be an in-person seminar. Three of the six activities are flights.
 
MAKG1 said:
James, only the "ground" part of WINGS can be behind a computer. It can also be an in-person seminar. Three of the six activities are flights.
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Correct.

Just IMHO I'd rather spend that time face to face with a new to me CFI, personally I used to get more out of it and it was much more fun.
 
evapilotaz said:
I haven't practice stalls since my last flight review. So I want to do the flight portion of the flight review just to practice stalls.
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Why not just go practice stalls?
 
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