FAA WINGS and BFR

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Blueangel

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So I wanted to find out if anyone has done the FAA WINGS program for their BFR and how it saved time and money? I just completed the basic WINGS course and exams. Now just need to complete the flight activities with my CFI.
 
Nope.

It's a hour ground and a hour air, find a good CFI and enjoy it, I actually liked doing BFFs with different CFIs when I was flying pt91.

If you need more time, you need more time.
 
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I have done several phases of the Wings program instead of flight reviews. The Wings program isn't intended to save you money, it is intended to make you a better pilot.
 
Did many wings programs ,always enjoyed them. The flying part is the easy part.
 
I really like the Wings program. The program offers many different and interesting topics that are not typically covered in a normal flight review. Next to getting an additional rating or endorsement, it is perhaps the best continuing education that a pilot can do.
 
Flying for 32 years and have yet to do a BFR, or a Wings program in lieu of.
 
WINGS isn't cheaper. That's not the point. It is definitely more exhaustive and some of the activities are interesting.

The point is to make you a better pilot. That will almost certainly involve more flying, and thus it's more expensive.
 
Kritchlow said:
Flying for 32 years and have yet to do a BFR, or a Wings program in lieu of.
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:confused:

I just get a new rating every couple of years... Kritchlow, I would have guessed that's what you do, but I don't think there are that many ratings??
 
ahkahn said:
:confused:

I just get a new rating every couple of years... Kritchlow, I would have guessed that's what you do, but I don't think there are that many ratings??
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Indeed you are correct, but then I started flying for a living. All the 91k/135/121 periodic checks count.

Not to mention the type rating checkrides...
 
Kritchlow said:
Flying for 32 years and have yet to do a BFR, or a Wings program in lieu of.
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I have a lot less experience than you but I've also never had to do a BFR as all my check rides fell within 2 years. I don't think I'll ever do a flight review. My last check ride was a few weeks ago and my next ride will hopefully be a type rating/ATP within a year.
 
I loved the old WINGS format. The new one not so much. They seem to have screwed up a good thing.
 
Blueangel said:
So I wanted to find out if anyone has done the FAA WINGS program for their BFR and how it saved time and money? I just completed the basic WINGS course and exams. Now just need to complete the flight activities with my CFI.
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I have done at least one of my own FR via WINGS.

As someone else already noted, it is not intended to save you time and money, except in one respect.

The program is intended to reward recurrent training you choose do over an extended period by not also requiring you to spend time and money on a flight review.
 
Mr

Blueangel said:
So I wanted to find out if anyone has done the FAA WINGS program for their BFR and how it saved time and money? I just completed the basic WINGS course and exams. Now just need to complete the flight activities with my CFI.
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WINGS credits do not replace or eliminate the BFR requirement but it does push the date back a bit.
 
Re: Mr

SkyDog58 said:
Please explain.
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the FAA FSDO rep explained it to me this way...

Credit for completing/attending FAAST safety programs (on-line, webinars and in-person) pushes the date for the BFR back a bit but does not totally eliminate it.

In my case I received my Sport Pilot certificate in August of 2013 which meant that my first BFR was due before the end of August 2015.
I created my WINGS account and began going to FAAST programs for which I received WINGS credit. After a while I noticed that my BFR due date had been pushed back from August 31, 2015 to October 31, 2015. Now, due to my personal schedule I actually ended up taking the BFR ride/ground in July of this year which means my next BFR is due by July 31, 2017.
 
The way WINGS works is you have a year to finish a "phase." Activities short of phase completion expire after a year. Once you have finished a phase, your BFR or next phase is not due for TWO years (well, the end of the 24th month after your completion; it's FAA). In this sense, it does count as ONE BFR. If you wade through the website, you'll find a certificate and logbook endorsement (that you can paste in) with the date your next BFR is due; this will document it in case you need it, such as for a checkout at a new FBO, insurance, etc.

There are "levels" if you want (I'm Advanced), but that doesn't affect the BFR requirement; you can do it with Basic Phase 1. It might affect your insurance.
 
midlifeflyer said:
The program is intended to reward recurrent training you choose do over an extended period by not also requiring you to spend time and money on a flight review.
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That is one of the better descriptions I've read on how it works.
 
I did a "wings" thing once. I didn't need a BFR but the flight school I was at recommended going. I was not impressed by how the people leading the program seemed to be in on some private joke that the rest of us were not privy to.

And yes, I have never had a BFR in my 22 years of flying. But I do a checkride every 6 months that take care of that.
 
It will take you longer than a regulatory BFR just to figure out how the *#@$% FAAST BFR site works. Nothing like a government bureaucracy to take a simple and effective program and ruin it with complexity while making some contractor rich in the process.
 
Thanks guys,

I completed phase one of basic WINGS just need to do the flying part with my CFI to renew the BFR.
 
Blueangel said:
Thanks guys,

I completed phase one of basic WINGS just need to do the flying part with my CFI to renew the BFR.
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If you plan the flight portion carefully with your CFI, you can probably do it in less than 2 hours, but that depends on what flight elements *you* want to do.
 
If you need to fly with a CFI to complete the Wings program, than what's the point?
 
Jeff Oslick said:
If you plan the flight portion carefully with your CFI, you can probably do it in less than 2 hours, but that depends on what flight elements *you* want to do.
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If you are proficient in the private pilot tasks you can complete 3 flight wings credits in an 1 to 1.2 hours pretty easily. If you need some practice or recurrent training it will take longer. The flight portion of a my flight reviews pretty much includes these 3 flight credits.

A100125-07 Airport Operations
A070405-07 TOL's and Go-Arounds
A070405-08 Slow Flight, Stalls, Basic Instr or A070405-14 slow flight, stall, emer proc.


Brian
CFIIG/ASEL
 
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brcase said:
If you are proficient in the private pilot tasks you can complete 3 flight wings credits in an 1 to 1.2 hours pretty easily. If you need some practice or recurrent training it will take longer. The flight portion of a my flight reviews pretty much includes these 3 flight credits.

A100125-07 Airport Operations
A070405-07 TOL's and Go-Arounds
A070405-08 Slow Flight, Stalls, Basic Instr or A070405-14 slow flight, stall, emer proc.


Brian
CFIIG/ASEL
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Depends what you want to do. I hold commercial and instrument, so there is more of a range of stuff to drill on. I have my CFI work me extensively on emergency procedures, plus I usually do an Instrument Proficiency Check, which usually takes a good 45 minutes.
 
Kritchlow said:
If you need to fly with a CFI to complete the Wings program, than what's the point?
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Just the proficiency that comes from recurrent training that focuses on multiple tasks over the course of a year. If that's not important to a pilot, the pilot doesn't bother.
 
Kritchlow said:
If you need to fly with a CFI to complete the Wings program, than what's the point?
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Maybe learning something beyond just the minimum required?

:rolleyes:

As stated earlier, it is done in lieu of a separate flight review.
 
midlifeflyer said:
Just the proficiency that comes from recurrent training that focuses on multiple tasks over the course of a year. If that's not important to a pilot, the pilot doesn't bother.
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Perhaps I don't understand the process. How does the flying portion of the BFR differ from the flying portion of the Wings program?
 
Kritchlow said:
Perhaps I don't understand the process. How does the flying portion of the BFR differ from the flying portion of the Wings program?
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It doesn't have to be done all at once.

It's really worth it if you have another reason to get credits. I have to do a CAP Form 5 every year and a Form 91 every other year, and that covers all the flying and most of the knowledge for Basic and a big hunk of Advanced as well. It would be stupid not to use that.

It's shouldn't be too hard to make a Form 5 into a flight review (they are REALLY similar), but I don't hear about that happening much. Maybe because WINGS is so easy.
 
Jeff Oslick said:
Depends what you want to do. I hold commercial and instrument, so there is more of a range of stuff to drill on. I have my CFI work me extensively on emergency procedures, plus I usually do an Instrument Proficiency Check, which usually takes a good 45 minutes.
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Good for you, You could probably easily check off more than 3 Credits then.
The Advantages of doing so are if you ever have to discuss your flight proficiency with the FAA one of the 1st things the will ask is if you participate in WINGS. 2nd is insurance companies often give discounts to pilots that participate as well.

Brian
CFIIG/ASEL
 
brcase said:
The Advantages of doing so are if you ever have to discuss your flight proficiency with the FAA one of the 1st things the will ask is if you participate in WINGS. 2nd is insurance companies often give discounts to pilots that participate as well.
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There are some stats (link below) showing active participants in the WINGS program have significantly lower accident rates, though the means of deriving the numbers are imperfect. I've heard some anecdotal info from the Long Beach FSDO that the accident rate for our region among pilots who are active WINGS participants is very low.

https://www.faasafety.gov/files/gsl...11/Sep/57618/WINGS Accident Report-Edited.pdf
 
I do all my Flight Reviews using the WINGS Program. I have the Clients complete the 3 FREE online courses which eliminates the need for sitting at a table being interrogated for an hour +, then paying for it.

Saves the cost of the ground portion of the Flight Review.

Can be done on your schedule and most courses take less than 45 minutes to complete and can be used for up to a year for FR credit.

Also almost all my clients tell me that they get interested in the online courses and actually finish more than are required.

When I do tailwheel checkouts I recommend that we complete these 3 Flight Activities;

A070405-07
A070405-08
A100125-08

Completing these will add about 30 minutes to the checkout.

If doing these as a stand alone for a Flight Review all 3 can be completed in less than 1.5 flight time if the Client has spent some time reviewing the maneuvers on his own prior to flying.

So, the WINGS program does indeed save money as the ground portion of the Flight Review free online.

It is more convenient as the Client does the online courses at his convenience and he chooses the topics that he feels he needs.

The flight portion does not require more time than a normal Flight Review.

I highly recommend the WINGS program to all my clients.

As an added bonus I can use the Flight Activities that I complete with the Client to renew my CFI Certificate.

A win, win.
 
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Kritchlow said:
Perhaps I don't understand the process. How does the flying portion of the BFR differ from the flying portion of the Wings program?
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While one certainly can "pile up" Wings flight credits to do it all at once, that just makes it a FR with added courses and what you say would be correct.

But as I said before, the goal of the program is to reward pilots who do periodic recurrent training with a flight review. The theory is simple - if I call up my local CFI on a strong xwind day to go up and work on takeoffs and landings, and a few months later go do some of the hood work I haven't done since getting my private, and on another day do some other set of tasks, the net result would be an overall better GA safety record without more regulation.

And the idea that if I know I don't have to also take a flight review, I might be more likely to do it.

The first part of the theory - recurrent training enhances safety - is pretty well supported. One problem is the second part of the theory - pilots seeing it as a benefit to themselves.

The other problem is the (perceived or real) complexity of the current version of the program. I mentioned earlier that I've had a Wings flight review. One reason I did it was just to understand how it worked.
 
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Jeff Oslick said:
I have done several phases of the Wings program instead of flight reviews. The Wings program isn't intended to save you money, it is intended to make you a better pilot.
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Something to be said for just getting another rating, too. Not that I had time to do that this last time, but maybe before I need the next one...
 
I like WINGS it has good free information and I have attended seminars in the past. Anything that makes me a better safer pilot and is free is all good!
 
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