F35 down and missing in SC

Half Fast said:
True, but a Congress and a public demanding answers carry weight as the bill-payers. Not holding my breath, though.
Click to expand...

Considering Congress established laws on what the service SIBs and and AIBs can release and when, that’s a good idea.

The public is likely to never see the SIB, for good reason and AIB results, if publicly released, aren’t going rushed.
 
"How far did he fall?" "2000 Feet". Next question.
 
Interesting script that the dispatcher has to ask. Apparently not allowed to use some common sense
 
Bob Noel said:
Interesting script that the dispatcher has to ask. Apparently not allowed to use some common sense
Click to expand...

She had no common sense to use. She was befuddled right off the bat and had no idea what to do so she fell back to the script.

Not unlike every Verizon trouble call I’ve ever made…
 
tobnpr said:
Relieved of command, after the final Command Investigation was completed last October.
"2 out of 3 ain't bad" didn't hold true for Col. Del Pizzo...

www.twz.com

Sacked Marine Pilot Whose F-35B Flew Without Him After Ejecting Gives His Side Of The Story

Charles Del Pizzo has finally given his version of the bizarre 2023 incident that resulted in his jet flying for dozens of miles without him in it before crashing.
www.twz.com www.twz.com
Click to expand...
He made the plane look bad, sounds like a valid reason to be dismissed.
 
Interesting double standard that the F35 crash on the Carl Vinson resulted in the pilot keeping his job in the Navy. Overwhelmed with tasks with a perfectly good plane. But this guy pulled the nope handle with everything going out and gets canned.
 
The Pentagon Princess, desk flying, General that made the decision to terminate Del Pizzo’s command is a coward, period.

After Del Pizzo had already taken command of VMX-1 in Yuma, that General, Eric Smith, flew to Yuma to personally visit the Unit and to tell Del Pizzo that he was doing an excellent job.

Then 3 months later, Smith removes Del Pizzo from the command and refuses to even talk to him about it. Smith had one of his flunkies do the dirty work of telling Del Pizzo the bad news.

What’s worse is that Smith, a ground-pounder with no aviation experience, passed judgment on an aviators’s actions despite two separate investigations, led by actual aviators, that exonerated Del Pizzo.

As AV8R_87 pointed out, Del Pizzo was unfortunate enough to make the airplane look bad- so, he’s gotta go.

That ain’t leadership.
 
"Pentagon Princess" lol I'm going to steal that...

now back to bashing some folks...
 
Lost of assumptions here that he got fired because of his actions during the crash. Maybe he did but maybe he didn"t. This is a very one sided story. It wouldn't be the first time someone's attitude or perspective changed after a major incident to the point where they were no longer fit to lead. How do you know it wasn't his actions since the crash that led to his dismissal?
 
kmacht said:
Lost of assumptions here that he got fired because of his actions during the crash. Maybe he did but maybe he didn"t. This is a very one sided story. It wouldn't be the first time someone's attitude or perspective changed after a major incident to the point where they were no longer fit to lead. How do you know it wasn't his actions since the crash that led to his dismissal?
Click to expand...
Because the CMC relieved him based on his review of the accident.

www.marinecorpstimes.com

Marine pilot loses command after ejecting from F-35B that kept flying

Col. Charles "Tre" Del Pizzo said the commandant of the Marine Corps ordered his removal from command after reviewing the crash investigation.
www.marinecorpstimes.com www.marinecorpstimes.com
 
Oh, Del Pizzo was a Mustang. Explains a lot if some ring knockers were jealous of him.
 
Velocity173 said:
Because the CMC relieved him based on his review of the accident.

www.marinecorpstimes.com

Marine pilot loses command after ejecting from F-35B that kept flying

Col. Charles "Tre" Del Pizzo said the commandant of the Marine Corps ordered his removal from command after reviewing the crash investigation.
www.marinecorpstimes.com www.marinecorpstimes.com
Click to expand...
No. Thar is what the pilot is claiming. He was let go for "loss of trust and confidence in his ability to execute the responsibilities of his command,”. That is far different than being fired for what he did during the flight. To me it sounds more like there was some other problem after the investigation was over that made him no longer fit to lead. Neither you or I know what he said or did in the subsequent year after the crash and you are only getting the one side of the story coming from the person who was let go.
 
kmacht said:
No. Thar is what the pilot is claiming. He was let go for "loss of trust and confidence in his ability to execute the responsibilities of his command,”. That is far different than being fired for what he did during the flight. To me it sounds more like there was some other problem after the investigation was over that made him no longer fit to lead. Neither you or I know what he said or did in the subsequent year after the crash and you are only getting the one side of the story coming from the person who was let go.
Click to expand...
No, it’s states in the article why the CMC made the decision to relieve him.

“The commandant of the Marine Corps continually assesses matters associated with commanders and their units,” Marine Corps spokesman Lt. Col. Joshua Benson said “Following his detailed review [in September] of the command investigation into the 17 September 2023 F-35 mishap, he made the decision to relieve the commanding officer of [VMX-1], due to the unique mission of VMX-1.”
 
kmacht said:
No. Thar is what the pilot is claiming. He was let go for "loss of trust and confidence in his ability to execute the responsibilities of his command,”. That is far different than being fired for what he did during the flight. To me it sounds more like there was some other problem after the investigation was over that made him no longer fit to lead. Neither you or I know what he said or did in the subsequent year after the crash and you are only getting the one side of the story coming from the person who was let go.
Click to expand...
"Loss of trust and confidence" is the standard verbiage for the firing of any commanding officer, irrespective of reason.
 
It’s obvious why CMC relieved him. In the CMC’s eyes, he embarrassed the Corps. They lost a jet and CMC had to answer a lot of uncomfortable questions from the media about how this happened.

I’ve always told people, the comparisons to the Army and Marines are very similar but the difference is in attention to detail. They have a lack of empathy or tolerance for screw ups. In the Army I saw a lot of mediocre officers. Some outstanding ones as well but in the Marines, they’re pretty squared away across the board. They don’t like weak links and they put intense pressure on their officers and enlisted for that matter, to perform. The Army has the type of philosophy of “we learn from our mistakes.” The Marine Corps is more like “don’t make mistakes to begin with.” The Col got fired because of an old school CMC that doesn’t care about the “human element” that the Col speaks of.
 
Keeping the focus on the incident where everything was flashing/going out in dark conditions and no visibility and low altitude.

Was the commandant's expectation that the pilot try and save the F35 and possibly die in the process? It was a test and evaluation flight. Things happen. Going by the GO's reasoning, Chuck Yeager should have been fired for the Starfighter crash. The pilot did the right thing, granted, no others were sitting in that seat at that moment.

Hypothetically, if the plane crashed and he died, the report would be "he should have ejected. Pilot error".
 
Velocity173 said:
It’s obvious why CMC relieved him. In the CMC’s eyes, he embarrassed the Corps. They lost a jet and CMC had to answer a lot of uncomfortable questions from the media about how this happened.

I’ve always told people, the comparisons to the Army and Marines are very similar but the difference is in attention to detail. They have a lack of empathy or tolerance for screw ups. In the Army I saw a lot of mediocre officers. Some outstanding ones as well but in the Marines, they’re pretty squared away across the board. They don’t like weak links and they put intense pressure on their officers and enlisted for that matter, to perform. The Army has the type of philosophy of “we learn from our mistakes.” The Marine Corps is more like “don’t make mistakes to begin with.” The Col got fired because of an old school CMC that doesn’t care about the “human element” that the Col speaks of.
Click to expand...
Yup.

Thing is, Marine Corps aviation is not exceptional in the least; it's a remora/shadowcopy of USN aviation, who is the heavy hitter in that space and they know it. Their track record operationally is pretty atrocious as well.

I contend it is the distractions of USMC pet project asks what has poison pilled a lot of joint programmes, the F-35 very much included. A lot of elements of expeditionary doctrine are frankly overstated and abused for profiteering, but I'm widening the scope from the focal point, so I'll digress. BL, I agree with you, this was a black shoe equivalent making an example of an aviator he sees as embarassing the command.

As to the incident proper, again, the O-6 did the right thing by punching out of that Congressional pork barrel POS. As to POA, yeah I like to pot stir sometimes and get chuckles at home getting called an idiot/eyeroll-emoji'd by my domestic and cross-platform hate-readers. But between "you and I" on a professional level, I don't put much stock in the gum flapping of the recreational IMC cohort; a demographic already primed to underestimate the gravity of their own imprudence, giving us a TedTalk about "hacking it" in IMC.
 
hindsight2020 said:
Yup.

Thing is, Marine Corps aviation is not exceptional in the least; it's a remora/shadowcopy of USN aviation, who is the heavy hitter in that space and they know it. Their track record operationally is pretty atrocious as well.

I contend it is the distractions of USMC pet project asks what has poison pilled a lot of joint programmes, the F-35 very much included. A lot of elements of expeditionary doctrine are frankly overstated and abused for profiteering, but I'm widening the scope from the focal point, so I'll digress. BL, I agree with you, this was a black shoe equivalent making an example of an aviator he sees as embarassing the command.

As to the incident proper, again, the O-6 did the right thing by punching out of that Congressional pork barrel POS. As to POA, yeah I like to pot stir sometimes and get chuckles at home getting called an idiot/eyeroll-emoji'd by my domestic and cross-platform hate-readers. But between "you and I" on a professional level, I don't put much stock in the gum flapping of the recreational IMC cohort; a demographic already primed to underestimate the gravity of their own imprudence, giving us a TedTalk about "hacking it" in IMC.
Click to expand...
Yeah it’s the type of mindset where the Marines get the bad rap of being “brainwashed.” It’s not that they’re brainwashed or being mindless robots. It’s that they are indoctrinated from day one that they are the “finest fighting force in the world.” That’s great and all for esprit de corps as long as you stay grounded and know better. Problem is, most truly believe it. I used to get in arguments with guys over it. I liked the pride of being a Marine but being the best, has nothing to do with a particular service. It’s more unit specific.

As a whole though, I’ve always said Marine officers stand out from other services as a total package. Hard to beat overall appearance and attention to detail of the Marines. That’s part of the problem though. “Every Marine an infantryman” mentality is essentially Marine first, pilot second. If you were to look at Col Del Pizzio’s records, it will show a well rounded officer that attended a lot of career enhancing billets. But, after 25 yrs as a rated aviator, he only accumulated 2,800 hrs flying? Now, I’m not going to claim to be half the officer that Del Pizzio was, but in the Army, I was at least afforded the opportunity at honing my craft.

All the branches really need to look hard at prioritizing flight proficiency over non flying duties / courses. It’s like when I was in the Army, I was given the option of attending one of two courses prior to my next duty station. Warrant Officer Advanced Course or Instrument Examiner Course. I’m gonna choose the course that makes me the best pilot I can be and not one that improves my PPT & memo writing skills. I also needed something for my resume for employment after retirement. The extra “fluff” so to speak helps for promotion and leadership skills but does nothing to enhance what should be one’s core objective. Know your job like the back of your hand.
 
Velocity173 said:
I’ve always told people, the comparisons to the Army and Marines are very similar but the difference is in attention to detail. They have a lack of empathy or tolerance for screw ups.
Click to expand...
And because they're a cult they'll always have a large group of volunteers to be abused and have their careers destroyed for the slightest deviation from their established dogma.
 
Fearless Tower said:
Military radar. I’ve seen it paint just fine.
Click to expand...
RCS is specific to frequency. So stealth is highly dependent on frequency. So far we haven't figured out how to make something stealthy across the entire radar spectrum. Fighters generally don't like to get shot down so their stealthiness is optimized for the higher frequencies of threat radars such as target trackers. Low frequency early warning radars were bombed early in the Iraq war because they could detect the F117 at long ranges. When someone says that aircraft has the RCS of a bumble bee, that may be true at one frequency but it might have the RCS of a dump truck at another.
 
Witmo said:
RCS is specific to frequency. So stealth is highly dependent on frequency. So far we haven't figured out how to make something stealthy across the entire radar spectrum. Fighters generally don't like to get shot down so their stealthiness is optimized for the higher frequencies of threat radars such as target trackers. Low frequency early warning radars were bombed early in the Iraq war because they could detect the F117 at long ranges. When someone says that aircraft has the RCS of a bumble bee, that may be true at one frequency but it might have the RCS of a dump truck at another.
Click to expand...
Did you hear that in a Signal App Chat? Then it must be unclassified thank goodness.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top