Congress Slams Boeing and the FAA to the Max

Discussion in 'Flight Following' started by steingar, Sep 16, 2020.

  1. steingar

    steingar Taxi to Parking

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    The House Transportation Committee released it's report today concerning the 737 Max crashes. They cite "a disturbing pattern of technical miscalculations and troubling management misjudgments" by Boeing and "numerous oversight lapses and accountability gaps by the FAA". Story here.
     
  2. UngaWunga

    UngaWunga Pattern Altitude

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    congress should slam congress for reducing FAA funding and allowing the industry to "regulate" itself.
     
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  3. Cap'n Jack

    Cap'n Jack Final Approach PoA Supporter

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    I saw what you did in the thread title...
     
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  4. midwestpa24

    midwestpa24 Pattern Altitude

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    Pot meet kettle:stirpot:
     
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  5. bnt83

    bnt83 Final Approach PoA Supporter

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    The industry doesn't really regulate itself. The ODA programs allowing certain individuals to approve data, has been around over 15 years. The majority of recorded aviation fatalities occurred long before its existence and FAA employees were certifying the products themselves. Its up to other counties and their regulators to accept any FAA certified product. Its up to other counties and their regulators to create and surveillance commercial operations.
     
  6. hindsight2020

    hindsight2020 En-Route

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    lol, you mean pot calling kettle? To the regulatory capture apparatchik, that's not the bug, that's the feature my friend. They're all in on it. That town is a turn-style of grift, and I digress...
    [​IMG]
     
  7. WillFly4Food

    WillFly4Food Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Probably not worth two cents, but: Boeing should move its headquarters back to Seattle and get its technical staff more involved in strategic decision making again. The C suites seem to me to be too far away from the production floor and the engineers that really understand the product and it’s systems.

    I used to be a solid - If it’s not Boeing, I’m not going, kind of person. Now, not so much.
     
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  8. 35 AoA

    35 AoA Pattern Altitude

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    Well you can at least buy the t-shirt at the company store still :)
     
  9. Tantalum

    Tantalum Final Approach

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    What's the saying, McDonnell Douglas bought Boeing with Boeing's money?

    After the 777 and the mid/late 90's they lost their way.. too bad
     
  10. 35 AoA

    35 AoA Pattern Altitude

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    My personal impression has been that MDC is alive and well in STL. But that is probably what needed to happen. Boeing didn't have any real experience with building fighter aircraft prior to the merger, and MacAir built pretty much all of them (save the Tomcat and Vought products) up until the cancellation of A-12 and the ATF award to LM (though Boeing subcontracted). It is interesting to talk to the 30+ yr guys who have seen it all from MDC through the merger through today. They kept them because they were industry experts in their field and already on the payroll (and didn't want to lose them to LM or NG of course). At the end of the day, investing in their defense business and keeping the SMEs that they inherited through the merger makes a lot of sense in my mind. In hard times like this, this is the only part of the company that is sort of guaranteed to make money still. You can argue if that fact is wrong or right, but it is what it is.
     
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  11. Kristin

    Kristin Cleared for Takeoff

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    Boeing was better when engineers ran the company.

    I haven't read Congresses report, but it doesn't sound like they gave much credence to the fact that Lion Air was incompetent to be flying anything more complex than a box kite and Ethiopia's crew forgot to fly the plane which was a significant causal fact there. Boeing certainly screwed up, but to be honest, had these happened to American air carriers, they would not have crashed, and Boeing's fault would have come to light without the body count. Perhaps Boeing's biggest "sin" was not taking Airbus' approach and try to design their planes so any idiot can fly them. Though the Pakistani's are testing that theory.
     
  12. nauga

    nauga Pattern Altitude PoA Supporter

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    Boeing Commercial headquarters is still in Seattle. Strategic decision making for Boeing happens across all business units, most of which are not located in WA. It would probably make more sense to have Boeing corporate headquarters for strategy in Washington (district of) rather than Washington (state of).

    Nauga,
    and the bidness of bidness
     
  13. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    Kind of like the fox watching the hen house. Or the FAA was asleep at the switch.
     
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  14. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    not much more, gradually changing the company to "Right to work" states

    NC is the best example.
     
  15. Crashnburn

    Crashnburn Line Up and Wait

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    I slam Boeing for not providing dual AOAs as standard equipment, and when the plane had dual AOA's not using them both at the same time to double check each other, instead of ping-ponging them as they did.
    I fault the FAA for not catching that, but it shouldn't have been there to catch!
    As far as I know, and it's only something I remember reading on the internet, but the MCAS S/W fiasco was only the tip of the iceberg as far as 737 Max S/W problems went.
     
  16. benyflyguy

    benyflyguy En-Route

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    So big question is what’s it going to take to get those birds in the air again??!!
     
  17. Larry in TN

    Larry in TN Pattern Altitude

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    All 737s have two AoA vanes. Always have. No different from any of the transport jets that I have flown.

    The lack of the "AOA DISAGREE" warning on airplanes that didn't have the optional AoA display was a software bug that wasn't discovered until after the accidents. The "AOA DISAGREE" warning wouldn't have made any difference at all on the accident flights.
     
  18. hindsight2020

    hindsight2020 En-Route

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    Right, but having the borg not implement MCAS logic when the damn AOA vanes started spitting out FUBAR data that didn't agree with the other, sure would have made a difference. Of course, this is barely the surface of the extent to which Boeing effed up, with that whole playing I've got a secret stunt, and the at-large corruption of trying to keep Frankensteining the guppy for the convenience of the OEM and airline cost ledgers alike. PLenty of horses to sit on in this grifty regulatory captured merry go round.
     
  19. nauga

    nauga Pattern Altitude PoA Supporter

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    Google translate has failed me.

    Nauga,
    colloquially
     
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  20. brien23

    brien23 Cleared for Takeoff

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    I Can't believe Boeing stock is still as high as it is with all the 737 sitting on the ground, when do people stop believing the fix is real close. Only good news the airlines don't need the planes right now.
     
  21. SneakyGrouse

    SneakyGrouse Pre-Flight

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    Has anyone in the FAA so much as had their pay docked, or lost a single vacation day over this?

    Watching much of the FAAs testimony I keep seeing hazardous attitudes, macho, anti authority and invulnerability mostly

    Lest we even get into their medical branch who doesn’t follow modern evidence based medicine, has violated privacy laws with zero repercussions, and doesn’t even follow their own experts on more than a few occasions.

    Rules are needed and good,I don’t think anyone doubts that, just wish we had a authority that was a little more worthy of our respect and trust, sadly most politicians don’t speak airplane, and the level of change the FAA needs is extensive, “embrace the suck”