$199 ADSB In from ForeFlight

Discussion in 'Avionics and Upgrades' started by X3 Skier, Jul 17, 2017.

  1. X3 Skier

    X3 Skier En-Route PoA Supporter

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  2. Scrabo

    Scrabo Pattern Altitude

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    No GPS for the Wifi only crowd
     
  3. arkvet

    arkvet Line Up and Wait

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    Sweet! Twice the cost of a Stratux without a GPS!
     
  4. murphey

    murphey Final Approach PoA Supporter

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    How do software upgrades get done?

    I use velcro on my stratux. works great.
     
  5. arnoha

    arnoha Cleared for Takeoff

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    Website says directly through ForeFlight just like a Stratus.
     
  6. arnoha

    arnoha Cleared for Takeoff

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    Same price. Compare apples to apples. A pre-built Stratux costs between $200 and $300, depending on options. Yeah, you can build it for a little less, but it's less than an hour of flight worth of difference.
     
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  7. Scrabo

    Scrabo Pattern Altitude

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    Yeah but you get a GPS and in some cases AHRS for the pre-built Stratux cost.
     
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  8. TigerGene

    TigerGene Pre-takeoff checklist

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    I built a Stratux and it is not without it's problems.

    First of all it's very sesnsitive to low voltage, you must have the right battery and the right cable of the right length or you will have problems. I can't seem to find the right combination that allows me to run both bands of ADS-B and the GPS at the same time. The power required by the device is too high, after all you are powering an entire computer motherboard with 3 USB receivers attached.

    Second, recently I was flying IFR in VFR conditions and upon frequency change I lost communications on the new frequency due to severe static on both radios. After several minutes of troubleshooting I pulled the plug on the Stratux and the problem went away. I'm somewhat gun shy about using it in IFR conditions.

    Third, Stratux is bulky! I have the Stratux box, the 10,500 ma battery, and 2 high gain antennas along with a "rats nest of wires" connecting it all together. Not very elegant if you ask me.

    Stratux is a wonderful system but it is still very primitive. It does work, but not at the level I like to see from my equipment. I will be buying a Scout and putting the Stratux up for sale.
     
  9. arkvet

    arkvet Line Up and Wait

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    I agree it isn't a fair comparison. The stratux has GPS +\- AHRS.

    I'm not really being overly critical. hell I own a status 2s.

    I guess the point is that this offering not including GPS or AHRS is for one reason and it's because it would kill another product that that mfg. What would it cost in parts and development to include at minimum gps? $10, $20?
     
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  10. X3 Skier

    X3 Skier En-Route PoA Supporter

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    Since I need a separate GPS to make my version of ForeFlight useful anyway and I actually have two already, it wouldn't be a big deal to me that the Scout doesn't have one. While I'm building my airplane, I tend to leave avionics to avionics firms. OTOH, the $100 homebuilt EFIS in another thread looks interesting.

    Cheers
     
  11. GLMS_NC

    GLMS_NC Line Up and Wait

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    Suggestion - Use a USB power supply and cable directly to this. Cigarette lighter works great and I get no static issues. My antennas are right into the box - no cable rats nest. One USB cable to the cigarette lighter.

    Just say'n.....
     
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  12. ktup-flyer

    ktup-flyer En-Route

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    Apparently they read the POA classifieds
    pen.jpg
     
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  13. TigerGene

    TigerGene Pre-takeoff checklist

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    GLMS:

    Thanks for the advice. I appreciate the tips, I really do. But I'm tired of fiddling with the thing and I'm tired of buying stuff to make it work better.

    I've tried several USB cigarette lighter power supplies, several cause interference, although I did find one that worked OK. I have tried several batteries and am still having voltage issues. I bought a 6 inch high power USB cable that has seemed to improve things, but I still haven't connected the GPS module as that darn low voltage light on the motherboard is still blinking.

    I tried mounting to a side window but it kept falling down, tried it on a seat but then got poor reception, bought high gain antennas with suction cup mounts. Success! But there still remains the interference problems and the rats nest of wires in the back seat.

    And that is the essence of the problem with Stratux. Build the thing, then go online and research how to make it work well. Try this, try that. This cable, that battery, that antenna. Where to mount it, how to mount it? Lay it on the dash? No, it bounces around and obscures the view. Suction cup to the window? How? Lay it on the seat? OK, but now you need cables to run the antenna to a window. Poor reception? Try the high gain antennas. How the heck do you update the software? I don't know.

    It just is not a refined bit of equipment. Stratux does work, and as a $150 alternative to a $600 or $900 Stratus, it's awesome. But is it better than a $200 device, 1/10th the size, with no antenna, one wire to the battery and that easily attaches to a window, draws minimal power and updates software straight from Foreflight? Not in my book.

    I've already ordered the Scout and the Stratux will soon be on Ebay.
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2017
  14. arnoha

    arnoha Cleared for Takeoff

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    This. I'm not knocking the Stratux. I am extremely pleased that it exists. For the right person in the right situation, it's exactly the right solution. It's inexpensive, it's hackable, it's great.

    But not everyone is ready to or wants to handle all the layers needed to be guaranteed to be successful at deploying a Stratux. At that point, previously, you were stuck. Spend the money on the tested and proven solutions, the Stratus or the GDL, was the only option if you wanted that functionality. Now there's a great intermediate option. $200 for ADS-B. Add $50-$100 for external GPS (like a Garmin GLO), if you want that. No AHRS just yet, but the reality is that AHRS in the Stratux have tended to be marginal last I checked, and nothing like the quality you got from a Stratus. That may have changed recently...I haven't checked. Half the cost, all the functionality and reliability. (Well, I'm assuming this new device is well-tested and refined. If it's not, everything I'm saying goes out the window.)
     
  15. murphey

    murphey Final Approach PoA Supporter

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    Nope, not all the functionality of the Stratus. The scout doesn't have GPS, or AHRS, as per the website specs. Still not sure what chip it's using. Nothing that I can find on the specification page. Only works with FF. The StratuX works with just about everything.
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2017
  16. arnoha

    arnoha Cleared for Takeoff

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    No to what? Not sure what question you're answering.
     
  17. murphey

    murphey Final Approach PoA Supporter

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    updated the response
     
  18. arnoha

    arnoha Cleared for Takeoff

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    Yes, it's FF only, so that is a caveat. That one is basically black and white: you're either a ForeFlight user, so it doesn't matter, or you're not, and it's a non-starter.

    Yeah, it doesn't have everything. GPS is easy to add on with another proven box like the Garmin GLO or just depend on the internal one. AHRS is the hard one, but Stratux boxes haven't traditional had AHRS and when they do, they've been sketchy. May have changed at this point, so I'd call this a feature half met by Stratux.

    My point is only that pointing at Stratux and claiming that, due to it, this product has no value, is inaccurate. This product has value. It's not Stratux. It overlaps, sure, but it's not aimed at the same market.
     
  19. JimNtexas

    JimNtexas Pattern Altitude

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    I'll probably replace my Stratux with this, but I'm going to wait for version 1.1.
     
  20. asicer

    asicer En-Route

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    Before you do, can you please post side-by-side pictures of the two? Perhaps put them each on a kitchen scale if you have one?
     
  21. denverpilot

    denverpilot Taxi to Parking

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    No Bluetooth either. But only Dual and Garmin do that.
     
  22. Ravioli

    Ravioli Final Approach PoA Supporter

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    <--- here he goes again

    This advertising is such complete horse ****. Want safety? Look out the ****ing windows for a change.

    upload_2017-7-19_7-19-58.png
     
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  23. denverpilot

    denverpilot Taxi to Parking

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    I'd love to know how a device that can't fully participate in FAA's "safety" system (no Out, so you naughty people get less safety because "hockey pucks"... in the FAA's world of "better safety via ADS-B"), adds real safety.

    It adds some safety, but if you aren't in one of the cool kid's hockey pucks, the FAA deems you a lower class of citizen and cuts off your ADS-B "safety".

    Can't be transmitting ALL of that traffic now, just like they will have to post-2020...

    Wouldn't want folks who haven't obeyed yet, to get all the "safety".
     
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  24. TigerGene

    TigerGene Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Scout draws only 125 ma, my Stratux draws nearly 2 amps (2000 ma). The 10,500 ma battery I use to power my Stratux for about 5 hours will now power my Scout for 84 hours. Cool!
     
  25. denverpilot

    denverpilot Taxi to Parking

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    I'd love to see the antenna gain plot vs the expected range and power output of known tower signals and airborne transponders and UAT transmitters, for the receive end of this thing.

    I suspect you're going to see significantly reduced range over a proper dual band 978/1080 co-linear or even quarter wave ground plane antennas, and a huge null in the antenna pattern toward the knife edge side of the printed circuit board.

    Granted, you really care the most about close targets on the 1080 band, but at 978, you want to hear the towers as far out as you can at low altitude before you fly out of the coverage of one into the next.

    I bet you run this thing side by side with anything that has a better antenna with some real gain toward the horizon at 978, and data log it, you're likely to see it missing a LOT of stuff at low angles to the 978 MHz tower sites.
     
  26. Ryan F.

    Ryan F. Line Up and Wait

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    It's a nice looking gadget - I think it's a re-branded Pingbuddy.

    I love the Stratux project. Built two of them. Had a ball. But please, be realistic... this Scout is essentially a Stratux replacement with no muss, no fuss, zero effort, and a VERY clean cockpit footprint.

    I, too, would have liked to have seen a GPS included, but for most people it won't matter due to iPads with GPS already on-board.

    Stratux has been great for driving the cost of these devices down but I think you're going to see interest in Stratux become very muted. When you can have basically the same thing for the same cost with such a nice design and zero build/installation/troubleshooting issues, people will flock to this and leave Stratux behind.

    It was great while it lasted and a true representation of the best parts of GA... ingenuity and community.
     
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  27. paflyer

    paflyer Final Approach

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    When they produce a $995 ADS-B out (with WAAS source included), then I'll get excited.
     
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  28. Grum.Man

    Grum.Man Pattern Altitude

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    This pretty much just killed the price of used Stratus systems. Not sure why anyone would pay more for a Stratus unless you had a non cellular device and needed the GPS source.
     
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  29. Ryan F.

    Ryan F. Line Up and Wait

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    I wouldn't hold my breath on that one. Garmin just came out with a low cost ($1800) minimal compliance all-in-one box (includes WAAS). I think if the market leader sets the bar there it will be very hard for a mom and pop ADS-B idea-shop to crank out something for less $$.
     
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  30. paflyer

    paflyer Final Approach

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    Like me.

    Besides, the GPS in a pad isn't exactly reliable in flight.
     
  31. CC268

    CC268 Final Approach

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    Pretty cool, although I would still buy a Stratus 2S over this
     
  32. TigerGene

    TigerGene Pre-takeoff checklist

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    My GPS in my Ipad is very reliable and every bit as accurate as my older panel mounted GPS. Maybe reliability is dependant on where and how it is mounted.
     
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  33. Grum.Man

    Grum.Man Pattern Altitude

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    I bought a wifi gps source after reading stories about the iPad reliability. Found the rumor not to be true at least east of the Mississippi. Built in one is just as good as the external one.
     
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  34. TigerGene

    TigerGene Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Boy! A $900 Stratus over a $200 Scout, thats a $700 difference! That's 200 gallons of avgas or 20 hours of flying for me or might even cover the next annual. I'll take the Scout and the fuel.
     
  35. CC268

    CC268 Final Approach

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    Understood but I'd like the additional features of the Stratus. Not saying it justifies the extra $700 by any means though.

    Idk maybe this would be a good option though.

    Do people find that the additional features of the Stratus 2S are gimmicky or not worth it? If so I would probably pick one of these up.
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2017
  36. ZeroPapaGolf

    ZeroPapaGolf Line Up and Wait

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    Having access to datalink weather is absolutely a safety feature if you're doing any kind of cross-country flying.
     
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  37. paflyer

    paflyer Final Approach

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    Yes.
     
  38. paflyer

    paflyer Final Approach

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    That's some cheap gas! And cheap @A&P labor!
     
  39. paflyer

    paflyer Final Approach

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    Your airplanes have a lot of glass, so plenty of clear (non metal) view of sky.
     
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  40. Rcmutz

    Rcmutz Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Agree 1000%. They buffooned it without the GPS. All those wifi only IPADS are useless with this thing. Got to have the cellular to get the GPS chip.