You are flying along and your engine dies

SixPapaCharlie

SixPapaCharlie

May the force be with you
Joined
Aug 8, 2013
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First Officer 6PC
You are not gliding distance to a field, you have no tundra tires and no God forsaken parachute.

You have to land this off field and lets say you are 2000 AGL

I believe most are taught the ABC (Airspeed, Best field, Cookies) or something.

Do you pop the door?

I don't recall hearing that on any emergency checklist.
If you know you are making an off field landing, do you pop the door no matter what?
 
Maybe not immediately but why not at some point? Metal can bend, fires can happen.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
You are not gliding distance to a field, you have no tundra tires and no God forsaken parachute.

You have to land this off field and lets say you are 2000 AGL

I believe most are taught the ABC (Airspeed, Best field, Cookies) or something.

Do you pop the door?

I don't recall hearing that on any emergency checklist.
If you know you are making an off field landing, do you pop the door no matter what?
Click to expand...


What if you don't have doors? Do you eject that high dollar canopy?
 
In the cherokee I was taught you always pop the door, In the DA40 I was taught to leave the canopy closed and latched.
 
This is one of my biggest fears.

You are supposed to always open the door in the stated situation. It is on the checklists! But you are supposed to do it just before "landing."

But it always seems to me like the door would provide some extra strength to the whole frame when we hit the ground. However, opening the door could also allow us to exit upon hitting the ground, assuming we are still alive.

These are the things that really keep me from enjoying flying at all.
 
Hmmm....letseeherenow....engine quits...landing imminent...emergency checklist...memory items....master off, fuel off, door unlatched....yup, that's about it if the darn thing won't re-start
 
I wonder if it varies from aircraft to aircraft and area to area?

Engine out over Edwards AFB pretty much a normal landing.
 
I seem to always remember it on simulated engine-outs. I hope I remember it during a real one.

Also, I plan on using the baggage door if I forget and the main door(s) jam(s).
 
Becky said:
This is one of my biggest fears.

You are supposed to always open the door in the stated situation. It is on the checklists! But you are supposed to do it just before "landing."

But it always seems to me like the door would provide some extra strength to the whole frame when we hit the ground. However, opening the door could also allow us to exit upon hitting the ground, assuming we are still alive.

These are the things that really keep me from enjoying flying at all.
Click to expand...

If you worry about what might happen...an asteroid might hit the Earth and we all die...a well maintained engine isn't likely to quit without announcing itself...
 
I've had two engine stoppages. One, I had several airports within gliding distance so just took the runway that was handiest and landed. Coasted on to ramp. Other one was at fl250. After several minutes and 2000 ft I got a restart. Both pretty nonevents.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
You are not gliding distance to a field, you have no tundra tires and no God forsaken parachute.

You have to land this off field and lets say you are 2000 AGL

I believe most are taught the ABC (Airspeed, Best field, Cookies) or something.

Do you pop the door?

I don't recall hearing that on any emergency checklist.
If you know you are making an off field landing, do you pop the door no matter what?
Click to expand...
Simply follow the shut down procedures in the NATOPs manual, and set power on the other three, and continue the mission, while com calls for relief on station. :)
 
MotoFlier said:
In the cherokee I was taught you always pop the door, In the DA40 I was taught to leave the canopy closed and latched.
Click to expand...

The DA-20 canopy pivots at the rear. I recall reading on story about that canopy opening in-flight, with a predictably bad outcome. The canopy on the DA40 pivots at the front. I can't see that being as much of a problem. The Diamonds also have a rescue hammer in the cockpit.
 
DJTorrente said:
The Diamonds also have a rescue hammer in the cockpit.
Click to expand...

Do they now? I guess I need to locate it in the one I'm flying.

Becky said:
But it always seems to me like the door would provide some extra strength to the whole frame when we hit the ground.
Click to expand...

Fear not. I don't know what you're flying but my 182 is legal to fly with the doors removed. The hinge pins are the size of a standard hairpin cotter...and if you look around at 152s, 172s, 182s, you'll see that many people have actually replaced the stock hinge pins with hairpin cotters...not much strength to be had there.
 
timwinters said:
Do they now? I guess I need to locate it in the one I'm flying.



Fear not. I don't know what you're flying but my 182 is legal to fly with the doors removed. The hinge pins are the size of a standard hairpin cotter...and if you look around at 152s, 172s, 182s, you'll see that many people have actually replaced the stock hinge pins with hairpin cotters...not much strength to be had there.
Click to expand...

I've looked around and seen some with rusty finishing nails acting as hinge pins . . . :yes:
 
DJTorrente said:
The DA-20 canopy pivots at the rear. I recall reading on story about that canopy opening in-flight, with a predictably bad outcome. The canopy on the DA40 pivots at the front. I can't see that being as much of a problem. The Diamonds also have a rescue hammer in the cockpit.
Click to expand...

So does the Tecnam Sierra.

What I always found a bit odd is that the Sierra has a sliding canopy that can be opened in-flight up to a certain airspeed (I think it's 70 kts), but the forced landing procedures and checklists call for the canopy being closed and locked for emergency landings. That never made a hell of a lot of sense to me.

Rich
 
Depends on the plane. In a 162 the doors are hinged at the top, so that would not be a good idea. In my 172 I would if I had the time and presence of mind.
 
Door? The Navion the Canopy is staying closed. The only way it's going to jam is if it comes to rest inverted. In which case I'm going out the baggage door.
 
Why you guys so set on crashing? Just climb in a thermal till you have glide to an airport. Y'all know how to do that right?:lol:
 
open or left closed, I guess, would depend on how you anticipate your outcome. if you are sure you'll be on a runway or flat, accommodating, spot leave it closed... If not, pop it open (and get your passenger to do the same... I just hope I'm not too busy flying the plane to remember that last minute item...
 
Was taught from very early on (maybe 2nd or 3rd flight) that one is to pop the door(s) before any off field landing.
 
Tom-D said:
I wonder if it varies from aircraft to aircraft and area to area?

Engine out over Edwards AFB pretty much a normal landing.
Click to expand...

Not in winter, it isn't. Edwards has paved runways because that lakebed turns to muck when it rains. And it can be hard to tell if it's wet or not, especially a few days after a rain.

Now, there are a TON of good emergency landing spots in the AV, including lots of straight roads. But watch out for the biggest ones, as they have power lines.
 
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DJTorrente said:
The DA-20 canopy pivots at the rear. I recall reading on story about that canopy opening in-flight, with a predictably bad outcome. The canopy on the DA40 pivots at the front. I can't see that being as much of a problem. The Diamonds also have a rescue hammer in the cockpit.
Click to expand...
My '10 pivots at the top and if it opens in flight it will hit and damage the tail. That front pivot is a winner.

I met a woman who was a survivalist/prepper. I gave her a ride and she gave me an extra glass breaker flashlight she happened to have in her purse. It has stayed in the plane.
Phoenix said:
Why you guys so set on crashing? Just climb in a thermal till you have glide to an airport. Y'all know how to do that right?:lol:
Click to expand...
Tell it Brother! Or at least get to a better field.
FlySince9 said:
open or left closed, I guess, would depend on how you anticipate your outcome. if you are sure you'll be on a runway or flat, accommodating, spot leave it closed... If not, pop it open (and get your passenger to do the same... I just hope I'm not too busy flying the plane to remember that last minute item...
Click to expand...
I don't worry about the doors for a land based land-out but I've been thinking about what to do if ditching. I'm definitely getting both doors unlatched before putting it in the water. I figure whether upright or flipped, I want to be able to get out.... then there's the glass hammer.
 
Autorotate. Maintain airspeed (55-80 kts) with cyclic, 85-107 % NR with collective. Attempt restart if altitude permits. Decel with cyclic (100-150 ft). Cushion with collective (10 ft). Try and get as close to 0 ground speed as possible if landing in rough terrain or trees.:(

No, I wouldn't set door ajar.
 
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Keep flying to a suitable airport and land.
 
Stingray Don said:
Depends on the plane. In a 162 the doors are hinged at the top, so that would not be a good idea.
Click to expand...
It can come off if opened in flight. (No, it wasn't me.)

But in my ride, (also hinged at the top) an unlatched door makes a big bang when it hits the wing (yes, there is a small dent there), but then it is fine. (I often open them before takeoff on a nice day.)
 
I'm pretty sure I could kick the door open even if both latches are locked.
 
Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe said:
It can come off if opened in flight. (No, it wasn't me.)

But in my ride, (also hinged at the top) an unlatched door makes a big bang when it hits the wing (yes, there is a small dent there), but then it is fine. (I often open them before takeoff on a nice day.)
Click to expand...

My home airport has a couple of 162s for training or rental, and I completed my training in those planes. During the year of my training, twice someone had the door pop in flight (not me) and it slammed the bottom of the wing. They even added a secondary latch to prevent such incidences. I saw the aftermath of one such incident and was surprised how much damage was done.
 
On my airplane the doors provide structural rigidity to the designed in "safety cell" of the cabin. So I will leave them closed, except possibly over water. If there is a post crash fire and the door is jammed, I will kick a door open or kick out a window. I would be highly motivated.
 
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The answer depends upon what is in the Emergency Section of the aircraft I'm flying....yeah, I know - I'm no fun today.
 
Stingray Don said:
My home airport has a couple of 162s for training or rental, and I completed my training in those planes. During the year of my training, twice someone had the door pop in flight (not me) and it slammed the bottom of the wing. They even added a secondary latch to prevent such incidences. I saw the aftermath of one such incident and was surprised how much damage was done.
Click to expand...

Don, that happened on my home field to a C162 a flight school rented out to someone. I think the guy was an ATP but hadn't flown in a while. He didn't latch the door and it came open and OFF in flight. Goodness knows where the door actually landed. They had to replace it.

I've taken off in a C172 with the window open, which is perfectly normal, but my wife was for some reason super scared to reach out and close it.

In my Cherokee I've had one occasion where someone forgot to close the door all the way and it had this awful "hiss" in flight, until we closed it.

Getting back to the original topic though, best glide, restart procedures. Failing restart, mayday on the frequency I'm on, 7700, keep transmitting until landing is assured then: master off, mixture idle, fuel selector to off, ignition off (flaps are manual so they go down when landing assured). And lastly, unlatch door :).
 
Tom-D said:
Simply follow the shut down procedures in the NATOPs manual, and set power on the other three, and continue the mission, while com calls for relief on station. :)
Click to expand...
Then stroll back and pop a burrito in the convection oven while you wait. ;)

Nauga,
who says, "MADMAN"
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
You are not gliding distance to a field, you have no tundra tires and no God forsaken parachute.

You have to land this off field and lets say you are 2000 AGL

I believe most are taught the ABC (Airspeed, Best field, Cookies) or something.

Do you pop the door?

I don't recall hearing that on any emergency checklist.
If you know you are making an off field landing, do you pop the door no matter what?
Click to expand...

Secure the dead engine and find an airport, preferably with maintenance facilities.
 
Gonna depend on the aircraft I'm flying and what type of "field" I'm landing in.
 
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