What if I don't want straight in?

Discussion in 'Change to my Frequency...' started by Lindberg, Dec 23, 2017.

  1. Lindberg

    Lindberg Pattern Altitude

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    I recently relocated my plane to a not-very-busy towered field. The plane and towered-field ops are still fairly new to me. One issue has been that the tower usually gives a straight in approach on my initial call up, or soon thereafter. Today I was offset from the runway a bit and just as I started to square up a base leg, tower instructed me to proceed directly to the numbers because of faster traffic behind me. I know the controllers are trying to let everyone get in quickly since the pattern isn't busy, and I am sure most prefer it. Butt being new to the field and the plane, I'd rather at least fly a partial downwind and base. So, other than flying around upwind before I call tower, is there a polite way to let them know I'd rather fly the pattern, assuming it doesn't cause a traffic issue?
     
  2. Greg Bockelman

    Greg Bockelman Administrator Management Council Member

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    Just tell them what you want.
     
  3. Cooter

    Cooter Pattern Altitude

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    Just tell them what you want to do, and tell them you’ll follow the other traffic if you need to. I doubt they care, they’re just trying be efficient.
     
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  4. AggieMike88

    AggieMike88 Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Now offering reverse discounts.
    Just ask.

    “Tower, Bugmasher 123 would prefer a normal pattern and can be #2 behind the fast mover.”

    Every tower controller I have encountered has been friendly and will do their best to accommodate requests once they know what you want.
     
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  5. Timbeck2

    Timbeck2 En-Route

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    Nien!! You proceed as told to do and ven you land, ve vud like to see your papers plez!
     
  6. Zeldman

    Zeldman Final Approach

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    As others have said, ask for what you want.

    And then send pizza to the tower.....:yesnod:
     
  7. midlifeflyer

    midlifeflyer Final Approach

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    ...and then practice landing straight in. And from base starting miles away. And from both directions. And from close in. And from double wide. And from a short approach. And from an extended downwind. And from... :D
     
  8. pmanton

    pmanton Line Up and Wait

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    Suck it up and proceed directly to the runwayo_O
     
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  9. Ryanb

    Ryanb En-Route PoA Supporter

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    This. In reality, you should be proficient in whatever the tower throws your way. Push yourself to land the airplane in different scenarios other than the basic downwind, base, final etc., it’s not always going to be that easy.
     
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  10. mscard88

    mscard88 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    You get no pattern, you get straight in and like it!

    Naw, just request it with tower. Most likely they'll approve it but they may also disapprove it. Here's what you ought to do though. Go visit the boys and girls in the tower. Discuss you're concerns/questions with them. But, you really ought to be able to enter the pattern from any direction.
     
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  11. luvflyin

    luvflyin En-Route PoA Supporter

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    Add me to the list of those quoting @midlifeflyer 's post #7. In the meantime, like others have said, just tell the Tower what you want. Go visit the Tower.
     
  12. FORANE

    FORANE Pattern Altitude

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    Reminds me of this:
     
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  13. AggieMike88

    AggieMike88 Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Now offering reverse discounts.
    As Cooter said, their instructions to make for the numbers is their way of trying to help you land sooner than later
    you would really enjoy the Pattern Drills that the KAFW tower has devised.
     
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2017
  14. ChrisK

    ChrisK En-Route

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    Oh man. Do tell. I'll get a copy to KMFD :)
     
  15. Larry in TN

    Larry in TN Line Up and Wait

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    "Request left-base entry, [callsign]"

    "Request downwind entry, [callsign]"
     
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  16. Ravioli

    Ravioli En-Route PoA Supporter

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    If this was at TKI they probably gave you the CSA (Cirrus Standard Approach). You can watch a @SixPapaCharlie video on it.

    Soon you'll be lamenting the times you DON'T get the straight-in. Meanwhile, as others have said, ask for what you want.
     
  17. Morgan3820

    Morgan3820 Line Up and Wait

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    As an American with some German ancestry, I must object in the strongest of terms to your offensive parody of a German accent.(Sarcasm)

    I actually (although better) did something like this to a traffic cop once. He failed to see the humor.
     
  18. luvflyin

    luvflyin En-Route PoA Supporter

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    Hmm. Did he increase from 'haulin butt' to 'smokin' or is that a reduction
     
  19. Velocity173

    Velocity173 Final Approach PoA Supporter

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    I’d be willing to bet they’re over 200 indicated within 4 miles of the airport there. ;)
     
  20. Timbeck2

    Timbeck2 En-Route

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    ;) My last name is Becker.
     
  21. Lindberg

    Lindberg Pattern Altitude

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    I really do appreciate the variety of responses. Next time I will try "Request base entry." And I will, and do, work on all sorts of approaches. To clarify my original question, I didn't ask because I feel like I always have to fly a standard stabilized pattern. I don't do that. But I have fewer than 10 hours in this airplane, so I'm still thinking through what I am doing each time I fly and learning its likes/dislikes, and at no time did I feel I was being asked to do something I was incapable of, just less comfortable with. And almost all of my time to date has been at little non-towered fields, so I'm also extremely uncomfortable with the radio work.

    Going up to the tower to meet the controllers was actually the first thing I did when relocating to this field, and they were extremely friendly. But I still don't want to look or sound like an idiot at my home field, even if I am one.;) So I was just wondering what's the best way to let them know I'd prefer to putter through a chill pattern when able.:)

    I think I will try that next time I have a few hours.
     
  22. tawood

    tawood Cleared for Takeoff

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    But if you are capable...

    I would say try to do the straight ins, and you could always go around if you don’t like what you’re seeing on short final.

    I’m a big believer in avoiding a constant “comfort zone”. That seems like a good way to stagnate to me.
     
  23. FORANE

    FORANE Pattern Altitude

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    This helped me tremendously:
    http://www.comm1.com/home.html
    I recommend getting the IFR simulator also even if you are not instrument rated as it will increase your understanding of what others are saying on the radio as well as knowledge of how to make requests from ATC.
     
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  24. steingar

    steingar Touchdown! Greaser!

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    This is going to sound harsh, so apologies in advance. Try being a pilot. You should be able to land your airplane from a landing pattern, a base leg, or straight in. You could be able to land your aircraft in a number of conditions and a number of configurations. If all you know how to do is land your aircraft one way in one configuration then you aren't a pilot, you're a passenger with attitude. You should understand the energy of your aircraft well enough to do any of these with confidence. If you can't it's time to engage a CFI. You MUST do this. Some day the chips could be down and you won't be able to do whatever you're used to. If you don't know what you're doing lives could be lost.
     
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  25. midlifeflyer

    midlifeflyer Final Approach

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    Probably nothing that I didn't see over the course of 20 years at KAPA. I still recall there was one incomprehensible instruction (not to me) which touched off a round of tower visits to all the flight schools on the airport. Basically, someone was coming from the east and Tower wanted the pilot to enter right downwind for Runway 35R about 2 miles south of the airport. Weird enough if it was understood (picture it), but it wasn't.
     
  26. Ravioli

    Ravioli En-Route PoA Supporter

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    You don't have to get engaged to the CFI. Not there's anything wrong with that.

    But flying with one for a few might well be good advice.
     
  27. midlifeflyer

    midlifeflyer Final Approach

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    The multiple ways one can enter a traffic pattern really doesn't have anything to do with being "stabilized." That's really the point of instruction and training at a towered airport. What you are trying to do is unfold your normal traffic pattern. If you stretch out your normal pattern, for many it's about 2 miles long from midfield downwind to the numbers. So, if it's a straight in, you want to be at your downwind speed 2 miles from touchdown, just like normal. And final speed at the same point. Same for any other leg. It's weird when you are not used to it but it's is much more complicated to explain than to do.

    The radio is definitely a distraction if you are not comfortable with it, but that will come too. You'll get used to it more quickly than you will realize.They really are "just people" in that tower. Pretty nice people, in fact.

    And I think you heard them. Biggest issue is too much deference to ATC. We are required to follow accepted instructions absent an emergency, but "unable" and asking for what you need are the two most important ATC communications skills. And don't worry; they've heard plenty of idiots :D

    True story: I was checking out a retired airline pilot with about 20 gazillion hours in a 172. When we came back KAPA (two N-S parallels and a shorter E-W runway) we were given 35R for landing. There was a pretty strong wind blowing from the west and he said to me, "I think I'll need your help for this landing. It's been a long time since I landed a light airplane in this much wind." I replied, "Or you could ask for Runway 28." He look at me like I had three heads. The idea of asking for something different had never crossed his mind.

    So, you are not alone.
     
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  28. denverpilot

    denverpilot Taxi to Parking

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    Was thinking the same thing. Bombing on in at an illegal speed.


    With the controller hinting at him to slow up the whole time, no less.

    He makes it clear he knew the controller was talking about him later.

    AND THEN he babbles for an extra two sentences of unnecessary crap about how he’s been waiting to get a word in edgewise — when he knew HE was the one crowding the existing aircraft in the pattern?

    Sigh. Our own worst enemies, I swear. That’s some serious stupid, right there.

    But wait! There’s more! He posts it on YouTube like he’s proud of it. “Lookie how fast my airplane will go...”

    For effffs sake. Seriously? What a jack-wagon.
     
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  29. Volitation

    Volitation Pre-Flight

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    Second this! Great learning experience, you can get mixed in to an interesting bunch of aircraft.
     
  30. Timbeck2

    Timbeck2 En-Route

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    And don't visit the tower. We don't want you interrupting our card game or YouTube video. ;)
     
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  31. denverpilot

    denverpilot Taxi to Parking

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    Exploding Kittens, or Cards Against Humanity? :)
     
  32. Timbeck2

    Timbeck2 En-Route

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    Played the latter, never heard of the former. Usually spades or euchre. ;)
     
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  33. mscard88

    mscard88 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    We always played crazy 8s at CBM tower when I was there. Hey did they still have the coke machine when you worked there Tim? Old type, where you slid the coke bottle out. We used to bet on the bottler on the bottom, whatever bottler was closer lost.
     
  34. Timbeck2

    Timbeck2 En-Route

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    I was in maintenance at Columbus.
     
  35. mscard88

    mscard88 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Oh that's right. :(
     
  36. CC268

    CC268 En-Route

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    That’s weird I had a professor at NAU named Tim Becker. He was my Materials Engineering professor. Nice guy. He still teaches there.
     
  37. Timbeck2

    Timbeck2 En-Route

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    That's my twin brother. Our parents weren't all that bright in picking out names for their children but both of us Tims are wicked smaht. ;)
     
  38. abqtj

    abqtj Pre-takeoff checklist

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    I’m the opposite, I’m uncomfortable at non-towered fields since 99% of my time is at towered ones. I miss position calls too often when others aren’t in the pattern at non-towered, something I’m working on improving.
     
  39. bradg33

    bradg33 Cleared for Takeoff

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    It's a fine line, but if you're EXTREMELY uncomfortable with radio work, you really need to get with a CFI until you're at least only a little uncomfortable with it.
     
  40. Timbeck2

    Timbeck2 En-Route

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    ...or a controller...just sayin.