TOP 10 THINGS THAT WORRY A PPL CANDIDATE

What worries a PPL candidate most?

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madriverman

madriverman

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madriverman
Helllloooo Aviators!

I am taking my CFI Checkride in a few weeks. My DPE told me to focus on what PPL candidates (and all new pilots) worry about the most. Of course, a few things come to mind, like crosswind landings, practicing stalls for the first time, etc but I wanted to gather some quant data from the aether. So...have at it. And if you don't see something in here, feel free to add it in the comments. Of course, I didn't add things like, "my CFI's breath, or $$$"...but those are welcome as well. Thanks for your help!
 
Departure stalls, stall in a turn, lost/nordo/divert come to mind, as do operations at an unfamiliar airfield and night operations.
 
Radio Calls, power-on stalls, and the infamous base to final incipient stall potential were all the bugaboos for me.
 
Gilbert Buettner said:
The examiner we often use makes it a point that the object is not touch down as gently as possible, but to do so as slow as possible.
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That sounds dumb. A low-airspeed slam that buries the gear into the ground and strikes the prop beats a higher airspeed that gently kisses the turf? A slow touchdown will matter on a short field landing, since it reduces the distance covered, but for a soft field it doesn't make much sense to me.
 
@madriverman , nothing on your list really worried me. The oral was a bigger worry.

In the air, the only thing I worried a bit about was the engine-out emergency, since it would be uncertain when it would occur. As it panned out, the DPE started screaming "Fire! Fire! The engine's on fire!" I put the plane into a fast circling descent, ran the checklist, then set it down on a small runway that happened to be handy. He gave me credit for both the emergency and for a slip to landing.
 
When I was doing my PPL it was power on stalls that made me the most nervous followed by crosswind landings in heavy wind…. but a good instructor beat the last one out of me.
 
StraightnLevel said:
Why the concern over power-on stalls?
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My guess, and based on my experience, was the seemingly excessively high nose attitude to induce the stall.

The other thing that scared me as a PPL Candidate was cross country navigation. Most of the places I have flown are hilly or on the coast so navigations fairly easy. Going inland with flat terrain and not a lot of landmarks scared me, so much I got lost on my initial cross country solo (and subsequently yelled at by ATC for not being where I thought I was) and then disoriented on my checkride. Still passed though.

Once I got instrument rated I wouldn’t fly to anywhere inland without the assistance of radio Navaids
 
I would say the maneuvers that were somewhat ambiguous, meaning more than one way to do them. Couple that with the merry go round of instructors, students become less than confident in their ability to please a stranger… ie the examiner.

Stalls being about the highest on the list.
 
Tools said:
I would say the maneuvers that were somewhat ambiguous, meaning more than one way to do them. Couple that with the merry go round of instructors, students become less than confident in their ability to please a stranger… ie the examiner.
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I would turn that around and make it a positive…there are different techniques available to accomplish most flight operations, and often changing techniques can give students a more balanced perspective, allowing them to choose the technique that works best and/or makes the most sense to them.

Unfortunately in order for this to be a positive thing, the instructors need to understand it and be willing to allow students to use techniques other than what the instructor prefers.

As a young instructor in an operation where students flew with the instructor that was available when they showed up, I tried to make that clear to my students. I also knew at least one thing that each instructor taught differently than I did, and often could take advantage of that. If I saw that Chris had trained them on one of those maneuvers, we’d review the maneuver. Usually they’d do it the way they were taught last. I’d ask why they did it that way, and they’d answer, “because that’s what Chris told me to do.”
I’d have them explain how I had taught them previously, and followed up with, “I don’t care which technique you use, but I want you to explain to me why you choose the technique that you do. “Because I or another instructor taught it that way isn’t an acceptable reason.”
 
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MauleSkinner said:
Unfortunately in order for this to be a positive thing, the instructors need to understand it and be willing to allow students to use techniques other than what the instructor prefers.
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Yes. I cringe whenever I hear the justification for a technique to be, "I was always taught to . . . "
 
I would suggest stalls are high on the list for student for the following reason:
1) The aircraft is very slow, it doesn't feel right
2) The nose high attitude which, again, doesn't feel right
3) The (slightly exaggerated) knowledge of "If you screw up the stall, you'll spin, if you spin YOU'LL DIE!!!"
4) Coupled with no actual knowledge of what a spin looks like, feels like, how hard it is to actually get into one (in typical trainer aircraft), or easy to get out of (again, typical trainer aircraft)
5) The lack of comfort with that regime of flight. Kinda like a "Here's where slow flight lives, lets do a stall, NEVER SPIN!!!, and now lets go back to the airport and do some T&Gs."
 
dbahn said:
Yes. I cringe whenever I hear the justification for a technique to be, "I was always taught to . . . "
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LOL...

Funny you should say this. During a flight with a CFI Sunday, he asked me why I did something and called it out (I'm assuming he thought a different CFI had instructed me that way). I told him that nobody taught me, it just made sense and was something that I feel makes the takeoff and climb process safer. Nothing more was said.......

He's been very clear that there isn't necessarily one "right" way to do everything. Better to use the techniques that you're most comfortable with and execute the procedure/maneuver/technique safely than to try to emulate someone else's preferred approach.
 
StraightnLevel said:
LOL...

Funny you should say this. During a flight with a CFI Sunday, he asked me why I did something and called it out (I'm assuming he thought a different CFI had instructed me that way). I told him that nobody taught me, it just made sense and was something that I feel makes the takeoff and climb process safer. Nothing more was said.......

He's been very clear that there isn't necessarily one "right" way to do everything. Better to use the techniques that you're most comfortable with and execute the procedure/maneuver/technique safely than to try to emulate someone else's preferred approach.
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That's the key. Whatever you do has to make sense, and often what you figure out makes more sense than what you were taught.
 
StraightnLevel said:
LOL...

Funny you should say this. During a flight with a CFI Sunday, he asked me why I did something and called it out. I told him that nobody taught me, it just made sense and was something that I feel makes the takeoff and climb process safer. Nothing more was said.......
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Oh, they love it when you go off script! :biggrin:

During my PPL oral, the DPE asked me about a certain airport on the sectional and whether we could land and take off on that runway. I glanced at it and instantly told him "Yes," and he said something like, "How do you know that? Did you do the math in your head?"

I'd been flying that particular plane for a while as a SP, and when I started renting it I calculated worst-case take-off and landing distances for the state of Florida using the highest possible elevation and a worst case temperature, so when he showed me a runway that was longer I knew immediately it was okay. I explained that and showed him the worst-case analysis and he was good with it. (I then showed him how I'd done the same thing for the highest elevation east of the Mississippi (Mt Mitchell, 6700').)
 
StraightnLevel said:
Why the concern over power-on stalls?
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Deck angle, right rudder, and poor teaching technique.

When I first learned power on stalls, it was from cruise. Pitch to a VY climb, bleed airspeed to VY, then pull more elevator until stall. Crazy 25*+ pitch.

Later, I would configure for a departure stall. Pull throttle to slow at level attitude to VX, then pitch to departure attitude before adding power back…incidentally this is how the Airplane Flying Handbook describes the maneuver be set up, precisely to “avoid an excessively steep nose-up attitude for a long period of time before the the airplane stalls.” Then add pitch and hold until stall. That setup helped me with mechanics and understanding how you end up stalling on departure over a 50-ft obstacle.
 
If you’re trying for specific fears just list everything in the ACS. Someone, somewhere is worried about everything on the list.

If you are looking for more broad concerns that apply to a larger percentage of the applicant pool look at anything related to judgement, ADM and emergency/non normal event management.

Most people confident enough to fly at all are generally ok with maneuver proficiency. Practice makes perfect and all that …

Fears are rooted in the abstract

I would do a lesson on ADM and risk management
 
StraightnLevel said:
Funny you should say this. During a flight with a CFI Sunday, he asked me why I did something and called it out (I'm assuming he thought a different CFI had instructed me that way). I told him that nobody taught me, it just made sense and was something that I feel makes the takeoff and climb process safer. Nothing more was said.....
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I would take it a step further and ask why you “feel” it makes the takeoff safer, I’m more data-driven. :)
 
Half Fast said:
That sounds dumb. A low-airspeed slam that buries the gear into the ground and strikes the prop beats a higher airspeed that gently kisses the turf? A slow touchdown will matter on a short field landing, since it reduces the distance covered, but for a soft field it doesn't make much sense to me.
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Not if you think about it a bit.

This is probably the reason the DPE says this as pilots mistake the soft field landing to mean touching down soft vs landing on soft material. You can do a soft landing and easily still not meet the ACS requirement for a soft field landing.

The main point of a soft field landing is to avoid nosing over is the soft landing material. Or to keep the nose up as much as possible. if you carry the amount of power you should, this should be at least enough power to keep the nose wheel off the ground after landing on pavement (and of course a tri-cycle gear airplane). As slow of touchdown as possible means the highest angle of attack possible, with the highest amount of drag possible. The power should be set to just fly above the runway in this configuration and gently set fly the wheels onto the ground. So you also have the most amount of power you can carry and still land at a slow speed. On touch down the elevator will have the most propwash available to hold the nose up after touch down. In a real soft field landing you may even add power to keep the nose up and the plane moving.

Brian
CFIIG/ASEL
 
brcase said:
Not if you think about it a bit.

This is probably the reason the DPE says this as pilots mistake the soft field landing to mean touching down soft vs landing on soft material. You can do a soft landing and easily still not meet the ACS requirement for a soft field landing.

The main point of a soft field landing is to avoid nosing over is the soft landing material. Or to keep the nose up as much as possible. if you carry the amount of power you should, this should be at least enough power to keep the nose wheel off the ground after landing on pavement (and of course a tri-cycle gear airplane). As slow of touchdown as possible means the highest angle of attack possible, with the highest amount of drag possible. The power should be set to just fly above the runway in this configuration and gently set fly the wheels onto the ground. So you also have the most amount of power you can carry and still land at a slow speed. On touch down the elevator will have the most propwash available to hold the nose up after touch down. In a real soft field landing you may even add power to keep the nose up and the plane moving.

Brian
CFIIG/ASEL
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The AFH specifies both. If either a smooth landing or minimum speed doesn’t exist, it can turn an otherwise safe soft field landing into a crash.

I suspect that the examiner’s experience is that most applicants can land smoothly, but can’t do it at minimum speed, so that’s the portion that he emphasizes.
 
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Not in the list, but my DPE started with," you did read in the PTS that the DPE can request the power on stall with 20* of bank, correct? I'd like you to set that up and execute it." Did tons of power on stalls, but my first at 20* bank was during the checkride:po_O
 
ac1989 said:
Radio Calls, power-on stalls, and the infamous base to final incipient stall potential were all the bugaboos for me.
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Re: the base to final stall. I recall a conversation with an old timer that had run a CPT school during WW2. In one of the Carolinas. He said that the school had all Luscombe 8 Charlies. Lots of them. He told me that almost all the schools' accidents were on the base to final turn. I later dug around and found a photo of the 8C's panel. No turn & bank instrument. Not even an inclinometer. (The "ball" in the T&B)
I found that ball to be the most looked at instrument in my run-of-the-mill flying career.
 
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Hard to say what people worry about most, but as an instructor, what I see many pilots (PPL and up) struggle with is task saturation and prioritizing. And that applies globally to many of the listed maneuvers where the student has to manage a lot of moving parts at the same time (configuration changes, airspeed changes, keeping eyes outside, etc.).

One thing I also see a lot of students and pilots obviously fear is talking on the radio. Probably in part because of all the online nonsense they read about "standard" radio phraseology, etc. They all forget that they're just communicating with another person, and get so wrapped up in how they supposedly "should" say something that they forget to actually convey the damn message.
 
Baked Potato said:
Motion sickness
Radio calls
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Motion sickness seems to be the secret worry nobody likes to discuss (understandable given the potential impact on someone's medical cert). But at the same time it must be pretty widespread since a lot of pilots seem to have their own preferred methods for warding it off.
 
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