Tie down knot

Discussion in 'Flight Following' started by brien23, Nov 26, 2017.

  1. Norman

    Norman En-Route Gone West

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    Mark,

    Back in 1970 I was described as a dirty old man by my future in laws. It was because I was thirty and my bride to be was eighteen. Was I any different than John Delorean or any other man who preferred younger women? In retrospect I don't think so. My intentions were honorable and Vicki and I had thirty good years together.

    OTOH, I wouldn't have dared the things the politicians are accused of.
     
  2. mscard88

    mscard88 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    These were HS girls, one I think as young as 14, he was in his mid 30s. And a District Attorney at the time. 30 and 18 to me a little different.

    Me, I always like older women. :D
    But, my wife of 45+ years is 3 years younger than me hehe.
     
  3. wrbix

    wrbix Cleared for Takeoff

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    Dirty politics perhaps, but not election fraud. That term should be reserved for fraudulent vote casting and counting sort of improprieties.
     
  4. 455 Bravo Uniform

    455 Bravo Uniform Pattern Altitude

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    Back on topic somewhat: what minimum weight rating should the rope be? How long for high wing, 10 ft? What material?
     
  5. wrbix

    wrbix Cleared for Takeoff

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    ......which remind me: whatever dimbulb recently replaced the ropes at KCDK has never seen a highwing - these are barely long enough for my Grumman Tiger. Suggest carrying your own
     
  6. GeorgeC

    GeorgeC Pattern Altitude

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    Yeah, 10' per tiedown. I just bought 30' of the 3/8" tiedown rope from Spruce.

    This knot seems a lot better than the one I've been using to date:
    [​IMG]
     
  7. Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe

    Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe Final Approach

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    7/16 is a nice size to tie. I like 3 strand nylon - some stretch to avoid any jerk on the tiedowns.
     
  8. coloradobluesky

    coloradobluesky En-Route

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    Don't use slip knots! As for rope, go to a rock climbing store and buy some climbing rope and learn how to tie a knot that won't slip! As for chain, if thats what is available, I use a carabiner. If I don't have a carabiner, just tie a knot (yes you can tie a knot with chain and yes it is hard to get undone. Just use your rope and leave the chain where it is.
     
  9. asicer

    asicer Pattern Altitude

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    "Little brown eel comes out of the cave, swims into the hole, comes out of the hole, goes back into the cave again."
     
  10. Scott@KTYR

    Scott@KTYR Pattern Altitude

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    It is called Tautline hitch.
     
  11. Fearless Tower

    Fearless Tower Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Midshipmen’s hitch? What kind of crap is that? Ain’t no midshipman ever used that. When I was a middie, they taught us the trucker’s hitch for lashing stuff down. That’s my preferred method:

    https://www.netknots.com/rope_knots/truckers-hitch


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
     
  12. denverpilot

    denverpilot Taxi to Parking

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    Below. He’s my first CFI long long ago, still flies anything he can get his hands on including his own 182, and a 787 for a day job.

    He grew up learning to fly in Wyoming. For those who aren’t aware, they just use log chains for windsocks up there.

    I learned what’s in the video in 1991 and haven’t had any airplanes go anywhere in high winds yet...

    Video below.

    Climbing rope would be good for practice, but the wrong kind of rope attached to tie downs is exceedingly annoying. Places get cheap and use nylon and it both has no friction to create a proper locking knot with, and the stupid stuff stretches. I complain loudly when an airport uses the wrong stuff. And, on long trips, carry my own ropes... sigh. It’s ridiculous that airports don’t know what kind of rope to use.

    Anyway, his video... after too many airplanes were damaged in Phoenix and it bugged him. He pressed his daughter into videographer and editing service.



    Works good.
     
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  13. Hank S

    Hank S En-Route

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    ^^^^^^ Yeah, that! But what's it called?
    Slip knots all slip, even the tautline hitch shown previously.

    Never seen or heard of the Midshipmen's hitch, and I learned my knots in the Boy Scouts from a Marine Master Sergeant.
     
  14. denverpilot

    denverpilot Taxi to Parking

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    I also noticed my friend said nylon rope. Arrrrgh. LOL. I’m going to give him crap about that.

    But he’s in AZ and the heat is awful on ropes, and everything else. Sigh.
     
  15. 455 Bravo Uniform

    455 Bravo Uniform Pattern Altitude

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    So if pilots use a midshipman's knot, and you used a truckers knot when you were on a ship, then truck drivers must use some sort of aviation knot (just to keep the universe functioning as it should).

    Actually a lot of the posted knots have a lot in common.
     
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  16. Fearless Tower

    Fearless Tower Touchdown! Greaser!

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    They always told us in school: if you can’t tie a knot, tie a lot!
     
  17. oilburner

    oilburner Pre-takeoff checklist

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    The POH for my C-182 says to use 700 lb test line for tie down.
    Perhaps after 700 lbf is applied to the tiedown rings something else will be the main problem?
     
  18. coloradobluesky

    coloradobluesky En-Route

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    Rope that stretches a bit when a force is applied is actually a good thing. The stretching cushions the shock and protects the plane from breaking. Climbing ropes hold just fine with a figure 8. Climbers trust their lives to it. They are also incredibly strong.
     
  19. denverpilot

    denverpilot Taxi to Parking

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    They come off, usually.

    Some, agreed. I’m talking about that nasty stuff that’ll stretch a whole lot that I hate. There’s rope made for every purpose so climbing rope is usually not needed, but if it’s rated for the pull strength it’s a decent backup.
     
  20. 455 Bravo Uniform

    455 Bravo Uniform Pattern Altitude

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    Figure 8 is very versatile, my favorite knot, learned it 2 decades ago as an emergency responder, but I think you'd need to tie a "figure 8 follow through" and doing so is not possible without slack (at least I don't know how).
     
  21. coloradobluesky

    coloradobluesky En-Route

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    Chain hooks can come undone. Slip knots can slip. If it can slip, it will.

    Get strong rope, 3/8 or 7/16, and learn to tie knots that aren't SLIP KNOTS.

    If you dont like nylon (which does stretch, think of a bungee), get Dacron (sail rigging rope). It is very strong also. Either will work. I prefer nylon and I use THIS knot.
    https://cdn.instructables.com/FFZ/61ZX/IH2BORSN/FFZ61ZXIH2BORSN.LARGE.jpg
    Properly tied will never come undone. And is easy to untie after it has been stressed.
     
  22. coloradobluesky

    coloradobluesky En-Route

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    Tie the knot, then push the plane back to tighten it.
     
  23. denverpilot

    denverpilot Taxi to Parking

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    I think you’re missing that the slip knots are backed by non-slip knots.

    Hitches (slip knots) are used to get all of the slack out of the rope easily. Slack rope will lead to the aircraft bouncing and it’s the bouncing that becomes a problem.

    In areas with high winds like we see, chains should be used. And they should be chains attached to a proper cable system on the ground. And the cable should be pre-tensioned by lifting it with your foot.

    Or a hangar.

    I’ve seen an entire row of airplanes flying and not touching the ground at KBJC in their properly anchored cable/chain system, even when all of them were pre-tensioned properly. That’s steady-state wind, of course, but they clock winds up there over 60 knots every spring, and push 80 at times.

    My favorite video of Colorado winds is still the Air Force Academy glider tow pilots from the tower. Wild ride for a couple of them that day.
     
  24. tinerj

    tinerj Cleared for Takeoff

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    in Alabama it's hard to find underage girls -- age of consent is 14.
     
  25. OkieFlyer

    OkieFlyer En-Route

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    I have been flying for 6 years, owned my own plane for 3 years, and I've only tied down with rope twice that I can think of. Last time, I was a bit embarrassed when @masloki walked up on me at Gaston's trying to replicate what I think is a hurricane knot that I had seen done before. I had never tied one before and was not figuring it out. Now, I'm a handy country boy type who knows quite a few good knots, but I didn't want to be the only guy there tied down with a hay knot, or what some people call a trucker's hitch . He showed me some kind of airplane knot and we went about our business, but I felt kind of un-piloty. On the few occasions I've needed to tie down, I have just used ratchet straps. I forgot them this time.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2017
  26. asicer

    asicer Pattern Altitude

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    The only knots that matter are on the airspeed indicator, right? ;)
     
  27. OkieFlyer

    OkieFlyer En-Route

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    I would agree, but my AI reads in MPH. :)
     
  28. FlySince9

    FlySince9 Pattern Altitude

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    I'm convinced some guys carry knitting needles in their flight bags... a couple more hoops and they'll have a sweater...
     
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  29. Clark1961

    Clark1961 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    I mostly use ratchet straps and they have done fine in Wyoming winds. The hooks do have keepers so no way they will unhook themselves. I have found tiedown anchors which were too large for the hooks. Ropes are okay. Chains are okay. Don't depend on any particular airport to provide satisfactory tiedown ropes or chains. I've found rotted ropes and chains with links too small to pass a link through.
     
  30. mscard88

    mscard88 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    :rofl::rofl::rofl: must be the coffee but that cracked me up Nate!
     
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  31. FORANE

    FORANE Pattern Altitude

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    Just get a plane with greater wing loading and you won't need to worry about such knotiness.
     
  32. timwinters

    timwinters Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    And, just like Arkansas, not even that if she's your sister.
     
  33. tinerj

    tinerj Cleared for Takeoff

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    No, that's Mississippi. Residents of Arkansas are thankful for MississippI because in every ranking, Arkansas would be last if it were not for Mississippi.

    Back to knits, uh I mean knots. The last knot that secures everything is ehe hurricane knot, so simplify things by only using that.
     
  34. FlySince9

    FlySince9 Pattern Altitude

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    I don't know if its been mentioned yet... But I see another video in Bryan's future...
     
  35. denverpilot

    denverpilot Taxi to Parking

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    This. And nobody made ratchet straps for anything but maybe flatbed semis back when I was learning to fly. LOL. ;) But airports definitely run the gamut from great gear to tie down with, to crap I wouldn’t tie up my dog with.
     
  36. Zeldman

    Zeldman Final Approach

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    I understand this is a hard one to untie....

    [​IMG]
     
  37. timwinters

    timwinters Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Well, except for the title of pearly-white racist redneck state. On that front, we in Missouri are glad that Indiana exists.:cool:
     
  38. Dave Theisen

    Dave Theisen Pattern Altitude

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    I was thinking the same thing.