Structural Failure

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Therookguy

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Therookguy
I purchased a 182RG several months ago and often take 5-7 hour cross-country trips. Once I get everything set up in cruise, autopilot on, etc my mind will wander. One unpleasant thought I commonly run into is "gee that would really suck if the wing snapped off right now". This thought ruins the magic of flight for me a little bit. If the engine quits you have a chance, but if the airframe fails it's over right?

Here's my question. How hard is it to fail the airframe on a 182 from the 80's? I had it inspected for corrosion in the pre-buy and it recently just passed annual, but I'd like to squash this thought from my head so I can enjoy flying a little more.
 
Strut-braced Cessna wing failures are almost unheard of. I flew 207s in Alaska with 40,000 hours on them with probably considerably more time over gross than under gross on the airframe.

I’d be a lot more worried about keeping the gear system tip-top on that RG than the wing falling off.
 
Others will chime in with more detailed responses, but my first thought is that it was built to standards that considered design load limits. If it’s corrosion free, inspected properly, and flown within limits, it’s fine. Fly within the limits.
 
Buy a cirrus or make like Trevor Jacob and wear a parachute to make it go away But seriously though, you'll have a gear failure before the wings fall off.
 
Eh if the gear fails I'll likely be there to see an insurance pay out or I can use the hand pump. I just don't like that metal expanding or pop/crack noise when the plane goes through temperature changes in climb. i.e the sound you car makes in the am when the temp changes after backing it out of the garage. Or maybe I have a water bottle in the back that's doing it...
 
The airframe does have like 8k+ hours. Guess I won't really have to worry about it then
 
Even among experimental aircraft structural failure is not very high on the list for aircraft accidents. IIRC the two major things troubling experimental aircraft were engine failure and loss of control in flight (usually after mishandling the engine failure).

That 182 is built like tank so the odds of the wings falling off should be the least of your worries. Keep a highly skilled & dedicated mechanic working on it and learn to listen to the wonderful sounds it makes when it's happy along with practicing your emergency landing skills.

If you want something to be really concerned about you'll find it at the fuel pump ...
 
Therookguy said:
I purchased a 182RG several months ago and often take 5-7 hour cross-country trips. Once I get everything set up in cruise, autopilot on, etc my mind will wander. One unpleasant thought I commonly run into is "gee that would really suck if the wing snapped off right now". This thought ruins the magic of flight for me a little bit. If the engine quits you have a chance, but if the airframe fails it's over right?

Here's my question. How hard is it to fail the airframe on a 182 from the 80's? I had it inspected for corrosion in the pre-buy and it recently just passed annual, but I'd like to squash this thought from my head so I can enjoy flying a little more.
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Funny. I have the same anxiety sometimes.

To be honest I’m never really 100% at ease when flying my plane. Just waiting for something bad to happen. I don’t know if this is unusual or not.

Recently I flew a trip over the mountains at 16,000’ on oxygen and it was about as at ease as I’ve ever felt. I was so at ease that I noticed it, which is odd. I was possibly hypoxic, lol. But I actually don’t think so - I think it was because at that altitude, there are tons of “outs” compared to the altitudes I normally fly at in the mountains, and because when I get hypoxic, my reaction is always paranoia, not euphoria.

Anyway, I can relate to the feeling. Maybe to contribute to the thread more specifically - how high are you flying? Like I mentioned, you might be getting paranoid from hypoxia which is, in fact, a “thing”, in which case O2 might help.
 
I've been at 12k in my hang glider and once in a while, I'll think of some stupid "what if" scenario. Goes away after a bit. Never have it in my Cherokee.
 
Outside of a non-strutted wing failure of a Centurion in Australia I can't think of any wing failures across the what, 80,000 or so 172/182 built?
 
Therookguy said:
How hard is it to fail the airframe on a 182 from the 80's?
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Just as hard as it would take to fail a 182 built in 2022. But I'm sure if you really tried like flying into a supercell t-storm or tornado you might get it to fail. Plenty of other things involved in flying that will bite you before a wing breaks off.;)
 
Tantalum said:
Outside of a non-strutted wing failure of a Centurion in Australia I can't think of any wing failures across the what, 80,000 or so 172/182 built?
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There have been a few.
Strut bolt fallen out. Aerobatics. A couple 172's "Pilot over speed for unknown reason". Loss of control in IMC.
But not many.
Therookguy said:
yep
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No worries then.
 
Therookguy said:
Eh if the gear fails I'll likely be there to see an insurance pay out or I can use the hand pump.
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Or you can catch on fire and almost burn to death like a couple of boys in oklahoma. One had third degree burns over 70% of his body. First degree burns on your right hand from trying to pump the gear down after a smoke in the cockpit/fire situation when the hydraulic pump never quit running like I had. (and I’m real lucky)

Don’t kid yourself, thats the real worry with your plane.
 
Your perception of risk needs redirection.
Go to ASF or other sites which list the top 10 reasons for you to have a bad aviation day.
Just checked: nope, wing falling off of 182 is not even on the list!

When you are flying along FD&H on your next 4 hour leg - instead ponder fuel exhaustion, vfr into imc, loss of control, CFIT, low-altitude ops, and other fun stuff that is much more likely!
 
The wing on your 182 won’t fall off, the fuselage will.

Seriously though, there is a structural inspection now required by AD for the lower strut mount. Very few failures globally, but enough for FAA to issue an AD. That’s the bad news. The good news is that the failure point is now identified and there is an inspection for prevention.

Just keep the wing loading within limits and you’ll be fine. Worry about the engine or a fire, and practice for something you can react to. Don’t worry about that which you can’t control.
 
During inspections I used to get up so I could sight down the wing. If it has been overstressed you should see some ripples in the skin, from the top spar cap compressing and shortening the top of the wing. Same with the stabilizer, though taking the fin/stab fairings off and getting a look inside is wise, too. It's not just the wing that can fail.

The Bonanzas and 210s that lose wings after loss of control in IMC commonly get well beyond Vne, pop out of the cloud base, and the pilot sees the ground coming and pulls back hard, failing the stab. The airplane then flops forward over onto its back and the wing fails downward; it's not as strong in negative G loading. Lesson? Don't be stupid and fly VFR into IMC if you're not instrument rated.

Cessna's SID program mentions inspections of several critical areas for corrosion. In the strutted airplanes, the main spar is in two sections, and are joined by doubler plates at the strut attachment. There has been corrosion found between those plates, swelling them and weakening the whole thing. Make sure your mechanic is paying attention to this stuff at annuals. Nobody wants to be the first to experience a failure.

Check it out: https://leggataviation.com/Cessna Single Engine Safety Initiative.pdf
 
DavidWhite said:
I flew 207s in Alaska with 40,000 hours on them with probably considerably more time over gross than under gross on the airframe.
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And David flew those planes after I got finished with them...:lol::lol: and more folks are flying those planes after David and they stay in the air.
 
I'd dedicate more fear points to "what happens if that constant-speed prop comes unglued" than I would a cessna strutted wing spontaneously failing.

If you had a wing-walker suit-up, strolled out to the wing at 12,000ft and started sawzall'ing the wing to pieces, I would bet the tail would statistically fail first, from you dropping the tool, than the butchered wing prevent a landing.
 
When I bought my airplane, a 1947 Cessna 140 I’ve flown all over the country, I went to the NTSB database and you can search accident reports. I read every single one involving a Cessna 120/140 to see if I could spot anything to be extra aware of. That way I could focus any fears of the machine itself in a logical direction. What I learned besides to really watch for carb ice is there’s very little to worry about in regards to the machine itself for my bird.

my guess is a read through the accident reports would put that fear to rest. May make you aware of other things to be mindful of but then you know based on stats and can focus your attention where deserves it.

Pilots demolish far more planes than planes kill pilots.
 
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I am the same.
I got this really old Comanche, and There is this flap I can lift up and look at the spar.

I know it has held together for 61 years but I can tell it's going to be any day now.
 
You have to try real hard to break a Cessna. If you manage to do it, you deserve it.
Bryan, on the other hand, is counting down the seconds on that Comanche.
 
Be glad your are not in a helicopter. Just think, there is just this ONE big nut up there. :p
 
thito01 said:
Be glad your are not in a helicopter. Just think, there is just this ONE big nut up there. :p
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Ha. Except I'd rather have one big nut than the 3 teeny, tiny nuts that hold your wing on......:eek::)
 
Really surprised no one has told the OP his airplane is about to fall apart and that he should immediately hand it over for re-purposing or evaluation. Disappointing, POA.

Or:
Funny. I have the same anxiety sometimes.
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"I get that feeling sometimes, but I just take another swig of Jack."
 
I fly a 182H that’s got at least 15 more years on her and that’s the last thing going through my mind in straight and level flight. Maybe when getting kicked around in the clouds. Long flights you start to hear all kinds of gremlins when it’s quiet. Get some music playing.
 
Bell206 said:
Ha. Except I'd rather have one big nut than the 3 teeny, tiny nuts that hold your wing on......:eek::)
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Isn't your one big nut loaded in tension?

I think most wing attach bolts are a shear load? ie the nut is needed - but not like the Jesus Nut of helos.
 
I've never looked at 182 accidents, but I do have a database of Cessna 172 accidents. From 1998 through 2015, I see only one accident involving in-flight structural failure. FTW03FA053, where the plane was missing a nut for a bolt holding the wing strut.

Ron Wanttaja
 
Tantalum said:
Outside of a non-strutted wing failure of a Centurion in Australia I can't think of any wing failures across the what, 80,000 or so 172/182 built?
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There have been quite a few, but like almost all planes, occurred when the design limits of the aircraft were exceeded.

Here is one. One thing to note is how low the Va is on these aircraft. Doesn't take much to get them out of the envelope if you lose control. Note to self. Don't lose control. Reality is that when most pilots lose control, the outcome is the same whether the plane hits the ground in one place or several places.

http://www.aero-news.net/index.cfm?do=main.textpost&id=3d02cc76-ceec-4a87-9eef-1edd7fc472aa
 
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Therookguy said:
Eh if the gear fails I'll likely be there to see an insurance pay out or I can use the hand pump. I just don't like that metal expanding or pop/crack noise when the plane goes through temperature changes in climb. i.e the sound you car makes in the am when the temp changes after backing it out of the garage. Or maybe I have a water bottle in the back that's doing it...
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Noise cancelling head set. Also, I don't recall this happening in any plane I've flown.
 
As others have said, the wing just isn’t going to come off.

BUT, here’s a chance to put yourself in the head of a nervous passenger, whose unreasonable fear is, “what if this dude has a stroke and it’s just me alive in this contraption?” You can’t reason that passenger out of that fear. And no one is going to reason you out of the fear of spontaneous de-winging.

Fly more and you’ll get over it. Maybe get some aerobatic instruction!
 
Let'sgoflying! said:
Isn't your one big nut loaded in tension? I think most wing attach bolts are a shear load? ie the nut is needed - but not like the Jesus Nut of helos.
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Shear or not it appears per Rons post above that nut is still needed. Plus there has never been a failure of a Jesus nut that I’ve heard of but do know of a few bolt failures caused by the lack of a nut. So I guess it depends on your viewpoint.

But as a bit of trivia, the Jesus nut terminology actually started as the Jesus bolt back in the days of the WWII PBY Catalina. Seems there are only 2 bolts that held the Catalina wing assembly to the fuselage and someone coined the Jesus Bolt term. Fast forward to the early 60s and the formation of the 11th Air Assault to prove the “new” air mobility doctrine. As legend has it, a number of previous PBY pilots switched to helicopters and once it was noticed there was one nut holding the M/R hub on, they resurrected the Jesus bolt slang but changed it to Jesus nut. So I guess historically, its really all you plank-wing guys that have been flying around with Jesus bolts all this time. As the rotor turns….;)

upload_2022-3-7_7-45-4.png
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/air-space-magazine/legends-of-an-ocean-crossing-seaplane-180971743/
 
I think if the OP stays out of thunderstorms the airplane should hold together just fine. Way more likely he kills the airplane that the other way around.
 
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