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Jim K

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Short 40 min vfr flight today. Nothingburger, right? Turns out my experience bucket isn't full yet.

First, I've come to the conclusion that I'm never talking to indy approach willingly again. They have to be the laziest controllers in the NAS. If you're not going to IND, you're getting sent 15mi away. I would've arrived 10m earlier and been able to stay at my higher, cooler, smoother altitude had i just squawked 1200 and gone over the top of their airspace. Meanwhile, I was never within 10 miles of another plane. Only two planes came off remotely in my direction, and I would've been a couple thousand feet over them on my original course/ altitude.

Second, I fiddled with my seat during the flight. Thought I had it locked. During the flare I discovered it wasn't when it flopped back taking me and the yoke with it. In the second it took me to collect myself, I had gained 15' and airspeed was dropping like a (rock, brick, Lance...). I crammed in some power and she still dropped in pretty hard, but not so much that the kids noticed anything. That might say more about my average landings though :biggrin:. Probably should've gone around but I was on the ground before I thought of it. Won't be doing that again, either.

Thirdly, I found a new fuel pump arrangement i hadn't seen. Below the gallon counter was another box that turned off the pump mechanically after a pre-selected number of gallons. The switches below each number program that number. When it reaches zero, it moves a lever that must be manually reset to get fuel to flow again. I thought it was the counter, so I had reset to zero when I started lol. I hadn't seen the actual counter because it's kind of up inside the top of the box. Took me a few minutes to figure that one out.

IMG_20250920_113542790.jpg

Wow.. that plastic looks like **** from this angle.

IMG_20250920_094100613_HDR.jpg
 
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every passenger does the "butt wiggle" to make sure the seat is locked in place (including me). for that fuel pump, how did you pay? I thought most pumps where you put in the # of gallons or $$ amount, it shuts off when it gets to that #.....
 
every passenger does the "butt wiggle" to make sure the seat is locked in place (including me). for that fuel pump, how did you pay? I thought most pumps where you put in the # of gallons or $$ amount, it shuts off when it gets to that #.....
There was a qtpod. This shutoff doohickey seems to be a holdover from ye olden days.
 
Anecdotal population of 2 - my hangar neighbor last week had 2 reroutes and then forgotten about while flying FLIB into IND.
 
I would like the programmable gallon counter to stop the pump. There are times when I want to put X gallons in one tank and the rest of my order in the other tank, but I can’t see the gallon counter to be able to stop at X.

But I would not particularly enjoy learning about this feature by trial and error.
 
I got to talk to Indy Center and Approach today :) Cirrus trip to UMP. No complaints :cheers:
 
I would like the programmable gallon counter to stop the pump. There are times when I want to put X gallons in one tank and the rest of my order in the other tank, but I can’t see the gallon counter to be able to stop at X.

But I would not particularly enjoy learning about this feature by trial and error.
There were even instructions on the side of the box... that didn't mention the shut-off counter in any way....

I got to talk to Indy Center and Approach today :) Cirrus trip to UMP. No complaints :cheers:

Center i have no beef with, but the half dozen times I've been on with approach, they've done this to me. Worse than Chicago, imo. Even Atlanta is more accommodating, and IND isn't even a bravo.
 
I agree with you about Indie approach. They're rude! I was with them twice, once just going through their airspace (they didn't give me a weird routing but were just rude) and once landing in KIND where they just gave a super weird routing and literally kept me in the air at a low altitude over the city and at night for an extra 10 minutes. It wasn't busy or anything, I have ADS-B in so I see all the traffic - it was just weird. I even asked the controller what's the issue and she just ignored my question giving me another vector that got me further away from the airport.
 
Indy center had to call me up one (after approach didn't hand me off) to ask if i was still IFR. They had forgotten about me...and wanted to cover their tracks.....I wrote it off to they're having a bad day....but maybe no....

I disagree in a minor way with Jim- C90 is the rock bottom worst if "you're not in a turbine what are you doing in my airspace" still prevails.
 
Appreciate the heads up on IND, good to know if I ever go that far west, and glad you got in OK! I've read too many seat stories to adjust in the air. I set it before I get in it, and wiggle and listen for the lock. Then do a wiggle test and make sure I'm good on the pedals before taxi. Again, though, I kinda set the bar on being a baby about some things.
 
C90 is the rock bottom worst if "you're not in a turbine what are you doing in my airspace" still prevails.
100% true, but they also have the traffic to justify it. Every time I'm up there I see (as in with my eyeballs) several jets, and they're close. The Lakefront corridor works well on vfr days, and my experience has been that if you're going IFR to an airport close in, they'll work you through in a reasonable manner. I've done a number of Lifeline flights to UGN and felt that they treated me fairly. I'm sure id feel differently if I was based under the Bravo.
 
C90 is the rock bottom worst if "you're not in a turbine what are you doing in my airspace" still prevails.
Yes.

100% true, but they also have the traffic to justify it.
NY Bravo also has the traffic, but I've only been told to stay out less than 10% of the times I asked. Most of the time they tried to work with me, I have plenty of pictures of EWR or JFK overflys at 5k or so.
The Lakefront corridor works well on vfr days,
Except it's a mid-air collision waiting to happen. There are no guidelines on altitude selection (to the best of my knowledge), and in some portions you only have (when you apply some safety margins) 1000 feet it or so of altitude to work with.
There's no clear or easy way to apply lateral separation for N/S traffic, either.

ORD Could have two NY Skyline-like corridors, to account for any traffic flow issues, and funnel VFR traffic there, with clearly defined N/S altitudes and lateral separation. Instead, we get this mess.
 
for that fuel pump, how did you pay? I thought most pumps where you put in the # of gallons or $$ amount, it shuts off when it gets to that #.....
Pretty sure I’ve seen both types - those that you preset a max and those that let you pump forever. But I think these are more prevalent, at least when they are newer.
 
I still maintain that St. Louis is the worst. Never had a problem with Indy except last time they dunked me into EYE. In fact, I've been getting lots of dunks the past year and the Seneca can't handle it like the Lance. Ive been getting more aggressive asking for my descents now.
 
Short 40 min vfr flight today. Nothingburger, right? Turns out my experience bucket isn't full yet.

First, I've come to the conclusion that I'm never talking to indy approach willingly again. They have to be the laziest controllers in the NAS. If you're not going to IND, you're getting sent 15mi away. I would've arrived 10m earlier and been able to stay at my higher, cooler, smoother altitude had i just squawked 1200 and gone over the top of their airspace. Meanwhile, I was never within 10 miles of another plane. Only two planes came off remotely in my direction, and I would've been a couple thousand feet over them on my original course/ altitude.

Second, I fiddled with my seat during the flight. Thought I had it locked. During the flare I discovered it wasn't when it flopped back taking me and the yoke with it. In the second it took me to collect myself, I had gained 15' and airspeed was dropping like a (rock, brick, Lance...). I crammed in some power and she still dropped in pretty hard, but not so much that the kids noticed anything. That might say more about my average landings though :biggrin:. Probably should've gone around but I was on the ground before I thought of it. Won't be doing that again, either.

Thirdly, I found a new fuel pump arrangement i hadn't seen. Below the gallon counter was another box that turned off the pump mechanically after a pre-selected number of gallons. The switches below each number program that number. When it reaches zero, it moves a lever that must be manually reset to get fuel to flow again. I thought it was the counter, so I had reset to zero when I started lol. I hadn't seen the actual counter because it's kind of up inside the top of the box. Took me a few minutes to figure that one out.

View attachment 145315

Wow.. that plastic looks like **** from this angle.

View attachment 145316
Yes that's a old mechanical pre set for a LC meter. All of the push knobs are broke on that pre set making it hard on your thumps . We used them on all of our fuel delivery trucks back in the 80-90s. I they shut down in 2 stages and must be adjusted according to shut down smooth without shocking the pump. Our have been electronic shut down for 25 years I bet.

My buddy and I experienced the same deal trying to get to 2R2. Said next time we are not going FF.
 
Agree.
Approach definitely doesn't live up to their airport identifier.
Last time I was there I would have sworn it was KDIX instead.
 
I still maintain that St. Louis is the worst. Never had a problem with Indy except last time they dunked me into EYE. In fact, I've been getting lots of dunks the past year and the Seneca can't handle it like the Lance. Ive been getting more aggressive asking for my descents now.
Really? I've never been denied a Bravo clearance from STL. Pretty rare for them to even assign a different altitude/ heading in my experience.
 
I would like the programmable gallon counter to stop the pump. There are times when I want to put X gallons in one tank and the rest of my order in the other tank, but I can’t see the gallon counter to be able to stop at X.

But I would not particularly enjoy learning about this feature by trial and error.
local pumps are ~5gpm, so count to 60 and you have 5 gallons...
 
The way the pre set works is you punch in those broken knobs until it reads the gallons you want delivered. Make sure the shutoff lever is cocked open and it counts down as the gallons flow through the meter. When it's down to last few gallons it trips the first stage and slows down and stops when it's get's to zero.
Set it for 9999 gallons and it will dispense until you get to 9999 and will shut off and will need to be re cocked.
 
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