Standalone G5

Discussion in 'Avionics and Upgrades' started by C_Parker, Aug 7, 2019.

  1. C_Parker

    C_Parker Pre-Flight

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    I tried searching for this but couldn't find precisely what I'm looking for. I tried asking the radio shop via email, but they're quite busy and not able to respond promptly.

    I'm considering doing a standalone (not tied to a panel GPS) G5 to replace my attitude indicator. This is going into a VFR only aircraft. I'm attempting to achieve a "4 pack" by losing my DG and turn and slip by combining the functionality into a G5. I want to use the two abandoned panel holes for a CGR-30 combo.

    When I install the G5, can I replace my attitude indicator and turn and slip?

    And, can the G5 use it's own GPS to provide ground speed, track, etc? Will I lose any key features by not being tied to a GTN?

    Thanks
     
  2. dans2992

    dans2992 En-Route

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    No ILS or VOR....

    The DG function is certified. I’m not sure the slip/skid is.

    I know we had to retain our airspeed indicator and altimeter when we installed our G5 pair.
     
  3. NealRomeoGolf

    NealRomeoGolf Cleared for Takeoff

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    The G5 can only replace the attitude indicator OR the turn coordinator. You can't yank both. Mine replaced my TC because I had to keep my AI for the autopilot.
     
  4. Jesse Saint

    Jesse Saint Pre-takeoff checklist

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    If you’re strictly going for VFR, neither the attitude indicator nor the turn coordinator are required equipment, so the G5 can replace one and the other can be removed. However, I would recommend that you keep he turn coordinator in case you ever want to go IFR. You already own it and it’s already installed.

    Airspeed and altimeter are required equipment, and the G5 is not primary for those, so you need to keep them.
     
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  5. denverpilot

    denverpilot Taxi to Parking

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    I believe you can yank both if you use two separate G5s. Could be wrong in that.
     
  6. Jesse Saint

    Jesse Saint Pre-takeoff checklist

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    I don’t believe so. The G5 is not stc’ed to be a backup for a G5, so you need to keep either attitude or t&b if you want to stay IFR capable. The second G5 can be a DG/HSI.
     
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  7. Unit74

    Unit74 Final Approach

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    Would an E5 allow for this?
     
  8. C_Parker

    C_Parker Pre-Flight

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    Thanks guys.

    I guess because I'm VFR it's not that I need legal replacements, but I need practical and safe replacement. I'd actually rather go with the AV-30 but I don't like the fact that the AV-30 doesn't have magnetometer capability. If not for that one single issue I'd much rather go that route for the obvious reasons.

    Basically my required criteria are that the instrument have magnetic indication, ground speed, magnetometer, and reliable slip indicator.
     
  9. asicer

    asicer En-Route

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    Well unless your plane has an "EXPERIMENTAL" sticker, the AV-30 doesn't have any capability whatsoever at the moment.

    But if you are VFR and intend to stay that way, I wouldn't bother with a magnetometer. The AV-30 will supposedly function no differently than your current DG and I don't find periodically syncing to the wet compass to be a bother. Plus, the installation costs go way down as does the likelihood that a flaky connection will spoil the fun.

    Heck, if I intended to stay VFR, the only permanently mounted six pack instruments I would need are airspeed, altitude, something to keep me upright when it's dark and something to keep me on an ATC vector. A vertical card compass could be enough for a vector and the NORSEE AV-20 might be enough to keep you from flipping on to your back at night.
     
  10. Salty

    Salty En-Route PoA Supporter

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    What about the MEL? Seems like you can’t just yank stuff because you’re VFR only.
     
  11. bnt83

    bnt83 Final Approach PoA Supporter

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    When I read "stand alone" my mind say:
    • Will not be replacing ANY existing equipment
    • Will not be interfaced with existing equipment.
    Might help to post a decent picture of your panel if you want some really constructive ideas.
     
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  12. bradg33

    bradg33 Cleared for Takeoff

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    Others have covered the "what can it replace" question, but I can answer this one: yes, when using its own internal GPS antenna a G5 will show ground speed and track; it won't show COURSE information because there's nothing to tell it where you're going (though if one digs into the install manuals (including the verbotten experimental manual) one can figure out how to wire in say an Aera 660 to provide course information).
     
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  13. asicer

    asicer En-Route

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    The OP's signature line says '63 182F. I'm guessing there's a lot of leeway there.
     
  14. Salty

    Salty En-Route PoA Supporter

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    Pretty sure the ‘63 182 came with AI and turn and bank.
     
  15. asicer

    asicer En-Route

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    They weren't optional back then? (Serious question)
     
  16. Ryan Klems

    Ryan Klems Pre-Flight

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    I'd bet they were optional or standard (but not required). They were certainly not required equipment on my '75 T210 according to the original equipment list.
     
  17. C_Parker

    C_Parker Pre-Flight

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    Thanks!
     
  18. WannFly

    WannFly En-Route

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    from the install manual
    For installations in aircraft approved for VFR-only operations;
    • The G5 can be installed as the attitude indicator and rate of turn indicator without
    retention of either the existing attitude indicator or rate of turn indicator.
     
  19. NealRomeoGolf

    NealRomeoGolf Cleared for Takeoff

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    Would that then require you to put a placard in the plane that states you can fly VFR only?

    Even though I am not IFR rated, I have always wanted my plane to be IFR capable so that I can get the rating later. So I never read up on the VFR only option.
     
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  20. C_Parker

    C_Parker Pre-Flight

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    Perfect, thanks!
     
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  21. WannFly

    WannFly En-Route

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    Don’t know. If you go down the IFR route, retain the TC. Also imp to note that G5 can only replace AI for IFR operations if it doesn’t have flight director and/or interfaces with AP.
     
  22. denverpilot

    denverpilot Taxi to Parking

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    Don’t know if there would be a placard required (would have to look that up) but Garmin usually does things by adding an addendum to your AFM/POH at installation time that defines limitations.

    If you do a VFR installation, the system is going to print out the correct limitations for the avionics installer that become part of your official aircraft operating limitations. I suspect it just says you can’t operate with the G5s IFR.

    They’d almost have to do it that way because you could add other things to your panel that would meet IFR requirements and still have the dual G5s in there later on. Most people wouldn’t pull all the IFR stuff and then reinstall it later, just for practicality, but paperwork wise, they could, if you think through the process.

    Even your original POH or AFM says the limitations are “as equipped from the factory”... throw money at it and install things, and the limitations change, and those new devices modify the POH or AFM.
     
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  23. AK737pilot

    AK737pilot Pre-Flight

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    A buddy of mine did a VFR only panel in his 180. At the time the Dynon unit was the only thing out there with an STC. You could easily do the same thing now with a G5.

    [​IMG]


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