Recreational Pilot Certificate after MOSAIC?

[DMD3.]

The Recreational certificate was a step below the Private but allowed more flexibility than Sport (before MOSAIC) in that you were allowed to fly aircraft with 4 seats and a maximum of 180 hp, though only allowed one passenger, whereas you were restricted to only 2-seat aircraft with Sport, 120 kts, etc.

The requirements are:
-30 hours total flight time
-15 hours of flight with an instructor
-3 hours solo
-2 hours of x/c at an airport more than 25 nm away
-3rd class medical & must take the written and practical test (checkride)

Less stringent than the Private requirements. No night or controlled airspace work required, but no flight is allowed in those scenarios unless you’ve received instruction in those areas. You’d be restricted to 50 nm from your home airport. So I’m curious, with MOSAIC, if someone with a Recreational certificate wanted to fly under Sport privileges now that MOSAIC is in effect, would they need to do another checkride, or could they complete additional training? One thing required for Sport is a solo x/c of 75+ nm, so perhaps they’d simply need to be signed off to do that. I already have my PPL, but at one point as a Student I contemplated settling for a Recreational due to the lesser requirements. I’m curious as to how this would work.

Edit: A Recreational pilot may act as PIC on flights that exceed 50 nm if they’ve done the same x/c training required for Private certification. But again the question remains, if a Rec pilot were to ‘downgrade’ to Sport, would they automatically be eligible for flight beyond 50 nm?

 

[ColinD]

Federal Register :: Request Access

www.ecfr.gov

14 CFR 61.303 contains a table that should help answer these types of questions.

 

[dmspilot]

61.303 (a) states in part, "If you hold a recreational pilot certificate, but not a medical certificate, you must comply with cross country requirements in § 61.101(c), even if your flight does not exceed 50 nautical miles from your departure airport."

Your intuition is correct, flying as a recreational pilot under sport rules basically requires PPL-level XC training, with an instructor endorsement to certify XC proficiency.

 

[WDD]

There were probably 2 rec licenses issued in last year. Seems ripe for a “clean up”, remove.

 

[ColinD]

Yeah. I suspect 54 guys suddenly being converted into Sport Pilots would not have much of an effect on safety.

https://www.faa.gov/data_research/aviation_data_statistics/civil_airmen_statistics

 

[asicer]

There were probably 2 rec licenses issued in last year. Seems ripe for a “clean up”, remove.

At the rate the numbers are dwindling, perhaps the "clean up" will naturally happen before the FAA takes action.

 

[DMD3.]

61.303 (a) states in part, "If you hold a recreational pilot certificate, but not a medical certificate, you must comply with cross country requirements in § 61.101(c), even if your flight does not exceed 50 nautical miles from your departure airport."

Your intuition is correct, flying as a recreational pilot under sport rules basically requires PPL-level XC training, with an instructor endorsement to certify XC proficiency.

When I checked back in 2010, there were a grand total of 89 Rec pilots in the U.S.

 

[asicer]

When I checked back in 2010, there were a grand total of 89 Rec pilots in the U.S.

So the number went up between 2010-2016? I wonder what made it reverse course?

 

[Warmi]

The thing with sport pilot numbers is that these are underreported due to number of older pilots with private pilot certificate and elapsed medical flying under sport pilot rules … in fact, most of the owners of Light Sport airplanes I met were private pilots ….and that will only increase with Mosaic …

 

[Dana]

With MOSAIC, it's unlikely that another Rec Pilot certificate will ever be issued. Most likely the FAA will discontinue it at some point.

 

[midlifeflyer]

The thing with sport pilot numbers is that these are underreported due to number of older pilots with private pilot certificate and elapsed medical flying under sport pilot rules …

That's true for all certificate levels. For example, there are probably lots of commercial pilots and ATPs flying under private pilot rules. Unless someone does a scientifically representative survey, all they can do is count certificates. It's not like there's an "I'm only flying operations below my certificate level" announcement or report.

 

[DaleB]

One of the co-owners of our plane is an ATP. He's going to let his medical and SI expire and fly under Sport Pilot rules. I hold a Private cert, and that's what I did.

 

[N918KT]

That's true for all certificate levels. For example, there are probably lots of commercial pilots and ATPs flying under private pilot rules. Unless someone does a scientifically representative survey, all they can do is count certificates. It's not like there's an "I'm only flying operations below my certificate level" announcement or report.

Question - The FAA considers an active airman who has both a pilot and current medical. The nearly 7,500 sport pilots in the FAA's database, do all those sport pilot certificate holders hold a valid 3rd class medical rather than using a driver's license?

 

[midlifeflyer]

One of the co-owners of our plane is an ATP. He's going to let his medical and SI expire and fly under Sport Pilot rules. I hold a Private cert, and that's what I did.

Any reason not to do BasicMed? I figure that, unless I do something like get sport privileges in an aircraft I'm not already rated for, I'm not sure why I would take the extra step down and limit what I fly.

 

[Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe]

Question - The FAA considers an active airman who has both a pilot and current medical. The nearly 7,500 sport pilots in the FAA's database, do all those sport pilot certificate holders hold a valid 3rd class medical rather than using a driver's license?

At one time, there was a note that said they count "sport pilot certificates".

 

[midlifeflyer]

Question - The FAA considers an active airman who has both a pilot and current medical. The nearly 7,500 sport pilots in the FAA's database, do all those sport pilot certificate holders hold a valid 3rd class medical rather than using a driver's license?

I read that on the "home page" too. It even says they don't count glider pilots as active unless they have a medical certificate. But that's not accurate since the file itself contains a footnote that "Glider (only)" pilots are counted if their only aircraft rating is glider.

Limiting it to those with valid medicals would not only exclude sport pilots, but BasicMed pilots since they don't hold FAa medical certificates ... although BasicMed is reported, so they might count them.

Might be worth an email to find out what that office is actually counting. OTOPH, it does say "estimated."

 

[Warmi]

Any reason not to do BasicMed? I figure that, unless I do something like get sport privileges in an aircraft I'm not already rated for, I'm not sure why I would take the extra step down and limit what I fly.

The thing is that with Mosaic there just isn’t that much difference anymore in terms of privileges for somebody who does recreational flying ( which is imho most of GA flying )

 

[midlifeflyer]

The thing is that with Mosaic there just isn’t that much difference anymore in terms of privileges for somebody who does recreational flying ( which is imho most of GA flying )

Maybe. Once we get past training, I do see a lot of Bonanza, Mooney, Cirus, Diamond etc models out on the ramp that don’t qualify.

 

[DaleB]

Any reason not to do BasicMed? I figure that, unless I do something like get sport privileges in an aircraft I'm not already rated for, I'm not sure why I would take the extra step down and limit what I fly.

I don't know, not my business. He was flying for an airline before retiring, then did some corporate and/or charter stuff, and I'm guessing is done with that. The RV-12 is the only thing he flies now, and with the changes under MOSAIC he can fly most of what's available to rent around here if he ever needs something bigger (just can't fill the seats).