Pax right turning tendency

Discussion in 'Flight Following' started by JonH, Jan 25, 2018.

  1. JonH

    JonH Pre-takeoff checklist

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    I take people flying, and when they have the controls they tend to put us in a slight bank to the right. This has been happening for years, and lately is starting to bug me. I have a few hours in the right seat, and didn't notice anything obvious, but that was after many hours of instruction. Out of the people I've flown with that are willing to take the controls, this accounts for more than half of them. Always to the right a few degrees. Today was a friends 4th hour and 2nd flight and despite my best efforts could not get him to keep us on a heading. I explained the pick a point on the horizon and keep us going there, let the airplane do the work. Light touch on the controls, and everything else I've been taught.

    Is this typical or coincidence?
     
  2. Paulie

    Paulie Line Up and Wait

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    When I lived in St Croix I would often fly to San Juan. My friends 20 year old girlfriend was my autopilot. Once at altitude and cruising I just told her to keep the airplane on the track line on the GPS or pick a cloud to aim for (over water). She held course and altitude like a pro. Never been in a small plane before. Natural.
     
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  3. dmspilot

    dmspilot En-Route

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    Is it the same plane every time? Maybe it is slightly out of rig and wants to turn right.

    I have seen that pilots don't always notice that the airplane is out of rig. They correct for it subconsciously.
     
  4. JonH

    JonH Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Yeah, that's what I want! I thought I'd sit back and kick it while being flown around. I may have to upgrade to something with autopilot.

    Each time it happened was in a different aircraft but they were all C-172.
     
  5. Salty

    Salty Final Approach

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    That’s odd. I don’t relax when I let someone that’s never flown take the controls. Quite the opposite.
     
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  6. Larry in TN

    Larry in TN Pattern Altitude

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    Show them how to pick out a point in the distance and fly towards it.
     
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  7. mscard88

    mscard88 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    It might be because they're sight seeing out the right side so unconsciously lean that way and take the yoke with them.
     
  8. OkieFlyer

    OkieFlyer En-Route

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    Does your plane turn slightly right with the yoke held level? Mine does a little, so when I tell a passenger to keep it straight and level, they just hold the yoke as level as they can, which puts us in a slight turn.
     
  9. Lachlan

    Lachlan En-Route

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    You upgrade to a 20 year old autopilot and it ends up costing you more than the cost of the airplane. Man, aviation is expensive!
     
  10. Shepherd

    Shepherd En-Route

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    I have a tendency to fly with one wing down a little.
    It's a holdover from my days as a Chinese fighter pilot, when I was called Won Wing Lo.
     
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  11. Bonchie

    Bonchie Cleared for Takeoff

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    Are they using their right hand to hold the controls? Probably just the weight of their hand and them not having a feel for correcting it.
     
  12. AndrewX

    AndrewX Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Switch the fuel to the right tank. When the left tank becomes heavier you'll be in alignment. Steer the plane only with the fuel selector knob.
     
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  13. DFH65

    DFH65 Pattern Altitude

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    My experience is they fly where they look.
     
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  14. BigBadLou

    BigBadLou Final Approach

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    Amen to that! I'd rather spend 5 AMU on a certified A/P than 50 AMU on a pretty A/P.
    You know what they say, renting is cheaper in the long run. :D
     
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  15. Zeldman

    Zeldman Touchdown! Greaser!

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    A lot of my friends are racers or former racers. All of them suffer from the same problem. Their right foot is heavier than their left foot.....
     
  16. AKBill

    AKBill En-Route

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    This is the first thing that came to mind for me.

    I know when I fly with my wife and ask her to hold it straight and level, she does a pretty good job. I simply remark "heading" or "altitude" to her when she is a little off the mark. She picks it up quickly and corrects for any deviation.

    I have explained to her to keep her focus out in front, pick a point and fly to that point. Teaching a proper scan of the instruments is important, a quick glance down then eyes back to the target point. Told her "it's like one of those bobble dolls, head/eyes up, down, left, right, center". Works for her..
     
  17. AKBill

    AKBill En-Route

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    Seems like my right foot gets lighter the older I get..:)
     
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  18. JonH

    JonH Pre-takeoff checklist

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    I do explain the pick a point, scanning, and light touch on the controls. The airplanes seem to fly pretty level on their own. I keep them coordinated with rudder, pax are yoke only.

    I do find pax flying relaxing, except this part. It's nice to be able to use both hands with a checklist. If anything it is a nice reminder I can fly, and share the experience with people.

    Giving it some more thought, I think all three times (3 different people 3 different aircraft) there was a lot of haze. It probably makes it harder to get used to. It's just odd because those 3 people were pretty much the only people I've flown with willing to take the controls. I'll have to work on my explaining skills.
     
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  19. RyanB

    RyanB Administrator Management Council Member PoA Supporter

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    I would say this is an accurate assumption of what's happening.
     
  20. Paulie

    Paulie Line Up and Wait

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    Correction: certified aviation is expensive. I have a two Axis in my RV that costs 2k new.
     
  21. Paulie

    Paulie Line Up and Wait

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    What is with this AMU? You post on mooneyspace? Last thing we need is another acronym. That one really bugs me.
     
  22. LongRoadBob

    LongRoadBob Cleared for Takeoff

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    I wonder if they are looking at the cowling, and sub conscious thinking it should be straight?
    It seems like Cessna has more of an off kilter looking front cowling? I don't know what you are flying though.
    Most are used to driving cars where the hood is symmetric and horizontal.

    Just a wild guess. Try bringing someone up and telling them to look at left and right wings vs. horizon and see if they do it too.
     
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  23. wrbix

    wrbix Pattern Altitude

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    As Zeldman intimated, we've all been ingrained over the years to keep some pressure on the accelerator (right pedal) when in driving cruise. I bet if they take their feet off the rudder pedals the right going tendency might disappear.
     
  24. N659HB

    N659HB Pattern Altitude

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    I'd suspect rigging it if were 100% of the time. Probably pressure on the right rudder pedal. My Luscombe flies right wing low when I have a pax, but I don't let them fly, so I stay on course. ;)

    Next time try having them fly with the left hand only on the yoke.
     
  25. WannFly

    WannFly Final Approach

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    Donno, my CFI says the same thing about the left seat guy....

    Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
     
  26. asicer

    asicer Final Approach PoA Supporter

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    What happens if you take up someone in a plane with tandem seating?
     
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  27. TommyG

    TommyG Pattern Altitude

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    How about taking people up and just having fun and letting them have fun taking the controls. If it really bugs you, stop letting people take the controls.

    And as already stated it could be the rigging. My 182 likes to dip to the right. I noticed it, my partner was completely blind of the dip because he held the yoke slightly to the left to count he dip without realizing what he was doing that.
     
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  28. GRG55

    GRG55 Final Approach Gone West

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    "Aviation Monetary Unit". Widely known and understood colloquial term in the GA community especially among those of us that shell out all the costs of flying from our own pockets. Generally considered the "fifth force" acting on an airplane.

    Applies equally, without discount, regardless of whether your plane flies wings level or turns to the right. I seriously doubt you'll find much support to stamp it out. ;)
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2018
  29. JonH

    JonH Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Who said I wasn't having fun? It bugs me in the sense that I don't know why it happens.
     
  30. Paulie

    Paulie Line Up and Wait

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    I know what it means. My problem with it is that it is stupid. It is another attempt to be cute or cool. When I see it in a post my reaction is the guy using it doesn't know what he's talking about and is throwing in a acronym to impart the illusion of knowledge.Apply it to any other subject. "I'm going to spend a lot of GMUs at the supermarket" Sounds stupid doesn't it? That's because it is.
    It is heavily used on mooneyspace, where there actual aviation knowledge is in short supply but technical opinions are not.
     
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  31. Zeldman

    Zeldman Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Maybe they are subconsciously showing their political leanings.....:rolleyes: :lol::lol::lol:
     
  32. Lachlan

    Lachlan En-Route

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    I think you missed that entirely. See post #2 for assistance. :)
     
  33. flyingron

    flyingron Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Perhaps it comes from watching too much Fox News.
     
  34. Lachlan

    Lachlan En-Route

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    Is the door open or closed? And is the passenger up front or back seat? Either way I’m pretty sure this would result in 100% good times. Two thumbs up on tandem taildraggers.
     
  35. SkyDog58

    SkyDog58 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Trying to make aviation great again?
     
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  36. GRG55

    GRG55 Final Approach Gone West

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    Just another TLA (three letter acronym). ;)
     
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