Paint budget

"Patina" is one of the stupidest fads to come along. It screams "I'm too cheap or lazy to do a real restoration".
Should they consult with others and take a vote before they spend THEIR money to paint THEIR airplane? :rolleyes:

Are you the president of an HOA by chance?

Been having a great day. I just don't get wrapped around a post about what other people do with their private property. ;)
 
The patina comment is my opinion, and it's not for me. If other's like it, go for it. But it's just a lazy way to avoid an actual restoration.

We'll start seeing clapped out cessna and pipers advertised as "patina" so the owners can avoid paint jobs. ;)
 
The patina comment is my opinion, and it's not for me. If other's like it, go for it. But it's just a lazy way to avoid an actual restoration.

We'll start seeing clapped out cessna and pipers advertised as "patina" so the owners can avoid paint jobs. ;)
I know - just couldn't resist a little jab this morning. :D And I agree with you 100%. As well, in my opinion, the Patina is on par with fake bullet holes and shark mouths. To each their own, but ......
 
A rattle -can job may restore the original “ glory”?

Quality of the finish was not too good when leaving the factory.

The Maule folks didn’t even have a spray booth. A bud bought one

and questioned the finish. BD Maule himself said; “That’s the way they

come”!
Many (most?) aircraft paint shops don't have the space to spray an assembled airframe in their booth. They pull the ailerons, rudder, fairings, and spray those in the booth, but spray the balance of the beast in a hangar with everything else in the shop draped and the hangar doors situated (with fans) to flow air through the hangar.
 
While I don’t consider myself a “Painter” I have painted several aircraft in different ways. Few comments to follow.

For northerners the heat bill is a big ticket item. The exhaust fans to expel
overspray do the same with heat.

If you are painting in your T-hangar ASSURE protection of neighbors and get their ok. You could get billed for more paint jobs than you planned on. Same with windshield. The walls are not likely airtight.

Don’t skip steps. Often those that paint cars are not familiar with aluminum. After stripping I use a brass brush around rivets and seams.
Etch and alodine per directions unless newer products elininate that item.

IMPORTANT Personal Safety should be #1. Saving a few bucks is way down the line compared to your life. I know of 3 people that died from painting aircraft. 1 from zinc chromate & 2 from polyurethane. They had been warned too!

Don coveralls, hat, face shield, gloves and respirator BEFORE opening cans
and adjusting gun. Exhaust fans ON at this point.
 
I built two experimental aircraft. The first I polished. Just tedious but never again. The second I painted myself. Used single part poly (Interlux). Fuselage done with rollers using the roll n tip method. Just about perfect. Shot the wings n tail. Turned out lower quality than the fuselage. Of course, I used a $16 Harbor Freight gun. Prepped bare metal with Alumiprep and Alodine. Finished it off with Cessna tape stripes. About $700 in paint, rollers, and supplies. I smile all the way to the bank. Can’t see any defects once 6’ away…. I’m thrilled and that’s all that matters.
 
Sounds like a profitable business would be to open a paint shop in Mexico
Almost all of our C ad D checks and paint on fleet AC is done in MX. From what I am told its not the cost, but there are simply not enough MROs to support the entire US fleet in the US alone.

Its nice to see a just painted just out of heavy check jet on the line. It sucks to know that now the real job of finding all the things they messed up is about to begin.

As for $30k for a paint job.... is that mostly labor?
 
As for $30k for a paint job.... is that mostly labor?

From chatting with the shop I used, I suspect it's mostly overhead, though of course I didn't examine the books or even discuss what the payroll might be. Paying for a shop with a paint booth large enough to accomodate planes up to bizjets, plus space for prepping a half dozen planes, is pricey. Add in the specialized equipment, the cost of compliance with environmental regs, all the necessary air handling equipment, fire suppression, etc., etc., and it's not a cheap endeavor by any means. I'm sure insurance is a big piece, too, given the expense of repairs if someone damages a customer's plane.
 
Definitely possible depending on how you define DIY. Assisted with a few repaints where we pulled the wings and tail feathers, the owner did most of the prep, had a local paint shop who was willing to work with us, and in the end had a professional paint job for a reasonable cost.

However, its not for the faint of heart and needs the assistance of a willing mechanic plus have an area large enough to handle the disassembly and prep work. Since a lot of this work falls under prevent mx the owner can work alone to control the billable labor costs. And just to add there are a number of non-hazard paint strippers out there vs paint blasting that keep required prep skill levels well within an average owners capabilities.

I did the prep on my fuselage and hired a guy moonlighting from a car dealership to shoot it. Came out beautiful.

I prepped and painted the wings myself. It also came out nice, but there are a few spots I am not satisfied with. It is hard to paint vertical surfaces without runs or sags.

I spent a few thousand bucks in paint and supplies, and $2,000 to the painter.

Most important part of DIY is safety. Don't want to wind up doing the kicken' chicken.
 
Almost all of our C ad D checks and paint on fleet AC is done in MX. From what I am told its not the cost, but there are simply not enough MROs to support the entire US fleet in the US alone.

Its nice to see a just painted just out of heavy check jet on the line. It sucks to know that now the real job of finding all the things they messed up is about to begin.

As for $30k for a paint job.... is that mostly labor?
I think paint costs have increased dramatically. Reading between the lines (and talking with the local paint shop), supplies are probably ~30% of the cost. After that, stripping an airplane is a big job, then you get into fit and finish issues - plastic or fiberglass that needs work, repairing minor dents and dings, etc. And don't forget about the cost of disassembly/reassembly. But yes, labor, actually the shop rate, which is probably ~$100/hr, is most of the cost.
 
I think paint costs have increased dramatically. Reading between the lines (and talking with the local paint shop), supplies are probably ~30% of the cost. After that, stripping an airplane is a big job, then you get into fit and finish issues - plastic or fiberglass that needs work, repairing minor dents and dings, etc. And don't forget about the cost of disassembly/reassembly. But yes, labor, actually the shop rate, which is probably ~$100/hr, is most of the cost.

Cost me around $2K in paint. I used Delfleet Essentials. It is a single stage urethane designed for fleet vehicles. Two stage basecoat/clearcoats are more expensive, but IMO not a great fit for aircraft.
 
I built two experimental aircraft. The first I polished. Just tedious but never again. The second I painted myself. Used single part poly (Interlux). Fuselage done with rollers using the roll n tip method. Just about perfect. Shot the wings n tail. Turned out lower quality than the fuselage. Of course, I used a $16 Harbor Freight gun. Prepped bare metal with Alumiprep and Alodine. Finished it off with Cessna tape stripes. About $700 in paint, rollers, and supplies. I smile all the way to the bank. Can’t see any defects once 6’ away…. I’m thrilled and that’s all that matters.
Ok, explain the roll and tip method. This is intriguing.
 
Ok, explain the roll and tip method. This is intriguing.

A variation of the roll & tip method is what I used on my experimental. Here's a a copy of a post I put on another site describing the method used:

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Had a few requests for information about the painting process for my Corvair powered Sonex air frame. Here is a brief description of the process and products.

This paint process is done with paint rollers. The reasons for choosing this process:
1) I didn’t have permission to use the hangar as a paint booth.
2) I did not have an adequate compressor to run a paint gun.
3) The cost was less than 1K complete.
4) It’s much easier to control the amount of paint applied.
5) Finish concerns (runs, drips, trash) can be dealt with easier.
6) I did it all myself, by myself.
7) Acceptable finish, good shine, quality paint, and I was not the first to use this method.

The Sonex is constructed of 6061-T6. The paint manufacturer assured me that this paint required no primer as it is designed to be used on aluminum boats. This would save weight and labor. The manufacturer also noted that no serious prep work was needed but I followed a fellow builder and did prep the surface. First the entire aircraft was washed several times using Dawn dish washing liquid. Dawn is excellent for removing oils and grease. This was followed by washing again with a product from Aircraft Spruce called “PREKOTE© SURFACE PRETREATMENT” and using a red Scotchbrite to scour and rough up the surface. Note that it is very important to remove all of the Prekote when rinsing and that none be allowed to dry on the surface (see Prekote instructions). Once cleaned and dried the use of a well cleaned and dry hangar is highly recommend. My aircraft was still fully assembled when painted. I used 3M blue painter’s tape to mask off areas not to be painted and used 3M Fineline tape for striping lines.

The paint is an Acrylic Urethane Enamel consisting of paint, catalyst, and flow fluid (thinner). For my application the recommended mix was 8-2-4 i.e. 8 parts paint, 2 parts catalyst, 4 parts thinner. I applied it in temps down to near freezing and the manufacturer claims application temps in the mid-teens.
Application of the initial coatings were to roll on a light coat on a small area and then using a dry roller you then would “stretch” the paint out to a larger area. It was amazing to me how far a little paint went. Manufacturer said to apply one coat per day for the three coat method. You can lightly sand between coatings (red scotchbrite or 1500) but take care with raised rivets or corners as the paint is still soft. Using the Scotchbrite tends to leave trash on the surface so be sure to clean it well before the next coat. The first coat will have uneven color coverage. The second one will be much better and by the third the color of the overall paint job should be very consistent and even. You will get some orange peel, dust nibs, and trash in the paint. I did notice that all of the surfaces that were either painted vertical or overhead (the bottom) have a much better flow out with higher shine and less dust to settle on it. If you are painting an un-assembled aircraft, paint the surfaces in the vertical position as much as possible. Using a tack rag before any coating is applied is a must. NEVER use flow fluid on the painted surface unless you want to remove the paint.

This process added 20 pounds to my aircraft. All of the colors and markings are paint with the exception of the N-number, “Experimental”, and the tail graphics. One lesson learned on striping … once the paint has become tacky remove the striping tape. If the paint is allowed to dry the tape can pull paint off with it as you remove it. In order to have the paint match the N-number a sample of the material from the graphics company was sent to the paint supplier. He did a great match! The checkerboard tail was done using a paint mask that you can order from any good graphics supplier. The jury is still out on how well the adhesion will hold up with this primer-less paint system. But it is used on high dollar yachts, I suppose it will hold on at LSA speeds. Costs in 2012 dollars was in the $800 range that included all the supplies & graphics.

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Photo shortly after the paint job was completed:

1756697441125.png

FWIW ...
 
Roll and tip is primarily used on boats. There should be a number of YT videos there.
 
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