Out of control cops or out of control preg. woman?

Are you trying to justify one by the other......Really you want to go thier...?

I'm not getting what you trying to get at?

So whenever someone gets arrested all they have to do is yell and curse and they will be sent on there way? The cops were called to a fender bender, I have bets on who began the escalation.


-VanDy
 
There are 2 ways to get compliance from somebody, reason (that wasn't working) or force. Yelling and cussing is no way to speak to anybody, at least how I was raised. Yell and scream at me and I'm pretty much done talking to you at that point. The cops didn't have the option of walking away.


-VanDy
 
There are 2 ways to get compliance from somebody, reason (that wasn't working) or force. Yelling and cussing is no way to speak to anybody, at least how I was raised. Yell and scream at me and I'm pretty much done talking to you at that point. The cops didn't have the option of walking away.


-VanDy

Why not?
 

It was apparently the middle of a traffic stop, and it would send a message that all you have to do is be confrontational to get out of dealing with the police.

Take for instance the video where the guy is stopped for open carrying a pistol, and the officer wants to seize the weapon while they are talking. The guy was polite, didn't raise his voice, and stated why he wasn't giving it up. He has a pistol, but wasn't aggressive and all said and done he walked away and never have up his pistol. That is an appropriate way to respond when you have a disagreement or believe your rights are being infringed upon.


-VanDy
 
Choose to flight the police and you will loose.

Regardless of how the situation got to where it is when the video starts the officer has limited options
He could deploy OC and get her, her baby daddy and the other officer
He could physically tackle her, likely dropping her hard onto her stomach
He could use his baton, but there isn't room to swing between the cars
He could taze her and end up on YouTube
He could leave her to continue to interfere with the arrest of the male subject
 
It was apparently the middle of a traffic stop, and it would send a message that all you have to do is be confrontational to get out of dealing with the police.

Take for instance the video where the guy is stopped for open carrying a pistol, and the officer wants to seize the weapon while they are talking. The guy was polite, didn't raise his voice, and stated why he wasn't giving it up. He has a pistol, but wasn't aggressive and all said and done he walked away and never have up his pistol. That is an appropriate way to respond when you have a disagreement or believe your rights are being infringed upon.


-VanDy


I recalled incorrectly, he did give up his weapon temporarily.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RZHfylk2j3o
 
It was apparently the middle of a traffic stop, and it would send a message that all you have to do is be confrontational to get out of dealing with the police.

-VanDy


That doesn't answer my question.
 
Choose to flight the police and you will loose.

Regardless of how the situation got to where it is when the video starts the officer has limited options
He could deploy OC and get her, her baby daddy and the other officer
He could physically tackle her, likely dropping her hard onto her stomach
He could use his baton, but there isn't room to swing between the cars
He could taze her and end up on YouTube
He could leave her to continue to interfere with the arrest of the male subject

He could wait 5 minutes for the fat cow to run out of hot air.
 
He could wait 5 minutes for the fat cow to run out of hot air.

But then he wouldn't get to vent his anger that's been compounded over the years from having a tiny penis.
 
That doesn't answer my question.

ok, here is the Illinois code.

Sec. 11-203. Obedience to police officers. No person shall wilfully fail or refuse to comply with any lawful order or direction of any police officer, fireman, or school crossing guard invested by law with authority to direct, control, or regulate traffic. Any person convicted of violating this Section is guilty of a petty offense
 
ok, here is the Illinois code.

Sec. 11-203. Obedience to police officers. No person shall wilfully fail or refuse to comply with any lawful order or direction of any police officer, fireman, or school crossing guard invested by law with authority to direct, control, or regulate traffic. Any person convicted of violating this Section is guilty of a petty offense

That still doesn't explain why the cops can't just sit, wait for them to cool down, and then take care of things. They have them blocked in, they aren't going anywhere. Nope, it's obviously better to get in someone's face that's already irritated.
 
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That still doesn't explain why the cops can't just sit, wait for them to cool down, and then take care of things. They have them blocked in, they aren't going anywhere. Nope, it's obviously better to get in someone's face that's already irritated.

I see what you are saying here, I was looking at walking away as more of get in the car and leave... Had they moved to the rear of the car, I may be ok with that if i was in their shoes.

And don't take this as me defending all cops, there are dipsh!t's in all professions and walks of life.
 
That still doesn't explain why the cops can't just sit, wait for them to cool down, and then take care of things. They have them blocked in, they aren't going anywhere. Nope, it's obviously better to get in someone's face that's already irritated.

Let them get into the 3000lb battering ram?
 
In the mean time the situation continues to escalate?

Much better for the police to escalate the situation.:rolleyes: Then they get to beat up a pregnant lady. Funny thing no one will point out is no one cares about her rights because it was an obnoxious black lady.
 
Much better for the police to escalate the situation.:rolleyes: Then they get to beat up a pregnant lady. Funny thing no one will point out is no one cares about her rights because it was an obnoxious black lady.

I think that her being an obnoxious black lady will not keep folks from caring.


And yes if the situation is going to escalate anyway, I would rather the police do the escalating.

Then after the fact if it is found that the police actions were wrong then training needs to change, or if they acted out of the scope of their training punitive actions should be taken. Police are not immune (or should not be) from the results of their actions. That said those cops would be welcome to walk my block any day.
 
Punitive actions for cops? Oh you mean paid vacations. You are either a cop or delusional.
 
Punitive actions for cops? Oh you mean paid vacations. You are either a cop or delusional.

Not a cop, nor delusional.

I just pay attention and see that not only do cops screw up, they loose their jobs and are personally liable in civil court in many cases.

Trick is a clean department starts from the top down, our local Chief is a teacher at the local academy. His specialty? Constitutional law.
 
So, does that seem like the best solution to you? Sounds like a better chance for injury and property damage to me.

Not having a "i'm a cop, do what I say because I'm better than you" attitude is a better solution. I've dealt with ones that were immediately confrontational, and I've dealt with ones that were cordial. Guess which approach has a much higher chance of escalating the situation?
 
#2, and prove to me that the cops in the video showed up and immediately escalated the situation and I will be in agreement with anyone who wishes for punitive action.
 
Here's the deal.

You can read the police report to get their side of the story.

Here's the short version: An officer is trying to handle a traffic accident, with four people involved. One of the people involved becomes verbally aggressive with the police officer and the two citizens on the "other side" of the accident. The police officer makes repeated attempts to get the aggressor to quiet down and wait at his car, but the aggressor refuses. The officer decides to arrest the aggressor.

But the aggressor does as aggressors often do, and resists arrest. A physical fight begins, and the fight winds up between two parked cars. While the officer is still fighting with and trying to arrest the aggressor, the aggressor's pregnant girlfriend approaches the officer from the rear. She puts her hands on the officer, in an attempt to pull him off her boyfriend.

It is at this point that a second officer arrives, summoned by the first officer's radio call for emergency assistance and finds the first officer in a fight with two people. It is the second officer who Tases the original aggressor first. The girlfriend continues to physically interfere with both the officers, and refuses to follow the officer's orders. The second officer then Tases the girlfriend.

Let's reframe this discussion a little bit. You're at work when you get a panicked call from your spouse or significant other, kid, or whomever it is you care about. That call says "Come quick, help me, I'm being attacked!" You rush home to find your loved one in a confined space, with no route for escape, being attacked from the front and the back. When you rush to the fight, one of the fighters says "don't hurt me, I'm pregnant/I've got a bad knee/I've got a slipped disk/etc."

What do you do?

The police were called to give service to citizens at that location.
The police were prevented from giving service by the aggressive acts of one of the people involved.
The officer decided to arrest the aggressive actor, since he had at that point broken the law.
The actor physically resisted arrest and assaulted the officer when the officer tried to arrest him.
During the arrest, the officer was assaulted from the rear (which is a big deal in any fight situation) by a second person.
The second person was also refusing to follow the lawful orders of the police officers.

Furthermore, the officer used a "Drive Stun", which is a option of the Taser which does not fire the darts, and does not affect the central nervous system. Instead, it "causes significant localized pain in the area touched by the Taser, but does not have a significant effect on the central nervous system. The Drive Stun does not incapacitate a subject but may assist in taking a subject into custody." (Source: Las Vegas Metropolitan Police Department Use of Force General Orders)

This officer did just about as little as he could to put an end to this situation. There's nothing to see here, please move along.
 
What really bothers me is no charges were filed outside the arrest. Neither victims had committed a crime. The police created the crime with their presence.

I am allowed to be loud and rude to a police officer, not that I ever would be. We still do live in a free country. My being raucous is not a crime, nor is it probably crime for one, and should not be treated as such.
 
What really bothers me is no charges were filed outside the arrest. Neither victims had committed a crime. The police created the crime with their presence.

I am allowed to be loud and rude to a police officer, not that I ever would be. We still do live in a free country. My being raucous is not a crime, nor is it probably crime for one, and should not be treated as such.

Sorry you are not allowed to be loud and rude to a police officer. The charge is jokingly referred to as 'resisting police brutality' if you are white and otherwise not guilty of anything obvious the judge will likely let you off with time and beating served.
 
I am allowed to be loud and rude to a police officer, not that I ever would be. We still do live in a free country. My being raucous is not a crime, nor is it probably crime for one, and should not be treated as such.

You are not allowed to interfere with a law enforcement officer executing his duty. These people chose to do it, and in doing so, committed a crime that the officer was within his discretion to arrest them for.

Your blaming the officer for arresting them, after they disobeyed the officer's lawful commands is a lot like blaming the rape victim for wearing too short of a skirt. She created the situation, so it must be her fault. Right?
 
The woman was asked to comply, she chose not to comply.

Our law enforcement officers need to be shown more respect


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

That is ABSOLUTE horse****.
cops are public servants. I know this hard to understand in the current age where citizens are second class to government, but the truth is true.
 
Sorry you are not allowed to be loud and rude to a police officer.

Actually, yes I am, so long as I obey lawful orders and don't interfere with the officer's conduct of his or her duty.

Like I said, if I were in a fender bender, and some police officer loudly and forcefully ordered me to the ground, it would take a minute for the situation to percolate in my noggin. I think it would for anyone not educated in the penal system.
 
Yes, but would you be so slow on the uptake if the event immediately preceeding the officer's command was not a parking lot fender bender, but was instead you trying to pull a police officer off of your partner, whom the officer was fighting with while trying to execute an arrest? I don't think so.
 
Yes, but would you be so slow on the uptake if the event immediately preceeding the officer's command was not a parking lot fender bender, but was instead you trying to pull a police officer off of your partner, whom the officer was fighting with while trying to execute an arrest? I don't think so.

If an officer was assaulting my spouse and I was uncertain the cause, I would do far more than attempt to pull the errant officer off my spouse, and damn the consequences.
 
Then, respectfully, you would end up a lot like the pregnant woman referenced in the thread title.

Don't interfere with a law enforcement officer who is discharging his duties. Just don't. The system has a method of dealing with law enforcement officers who make mistakes during the discharge of their duties, it's called the courts. But the court of fisticuffs is not the right venue here.
 
Oh please the courts take care of bad cops yeah right. You folks watch too much tv.
 
Then, respectfully, you would end up a lot like the pregnant woman referenced in the thread title.

Don't care. If an LEO is physically manhandling my very frail spouse, he or she will receive the maximum my little 5'6" frame can deliver. You folks talk a good game about not being sheeple when it comes to firearms, but seem ready to roll right over for police brutality. They can do whatever they want to me, but they'd better keep their mitts off Mrs. Steingar.

Don't interfere with a law enforcement officer who is discharging his duties. Just don't. The system has a method of dealing with law enforcement officers who make mistakes during the discharge of their duties, it's called the courts. But the court of fisticuffs is not the right venue here.

You watch way too much TV.
 
Based on just this clip, I'd say it's a tough call. No idea what the charges were, or what else she'd done. I don't know if I'd taze a large, agitated pregnant woman who was prepared to get physical with me... but I'd sure want to. :D
Pregnant women can be pretty scary when they are riled up, and they are not all frail, swooning vessels of motherly purity. Besides, her companion was pretty damn agitated himself... none of this was helping the cop with his situation.
Maybe it was out of line, but if so, it's not because he's a cop, but because he's human. It's reasonable to expect high standards of training and self-control for LEOs, but they're only human. The alternative is Robocop, and we all know what that would be like. :D
 
Cops are human so it is excusable for them to get a little punchy? I'm human too, can I be excused from punching a cop?
 
The new mantra is to submit. At any time, in every way, submit to the government or get hammered by idiots with expensive publicly funded toys.

When did American men become such wusses?
 
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