Ok, really...WTF

Discussion in 'Flight Following' started by vkhosid, Jan 21, 2021.

  1. vkhosid

    vkhosid Cleared for Takeoff

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    So, maybe this isn't the most appropriate title in a "normal" section of the forum, but I had to ask....

    I moved from the SF Bay Area to the North Jersey area about a year ago. When in the SF area, I got my private ticket. The rental plane from the place I used was $117/hr for a C-172, R model. I recently decided to look into plane rentals in my area, and the places I've called thus far have (what I think) absurd prices; the lowest one being $165/hr, plus $70/hr for an instructor.

    For those that are local...am I just looking in the wrong places, or is that what the prices are around here?

    I should add that I haven't been in an airplane for a while, and would need instruction to get back up to speed.

    Thanks!
     
  2. kath

    kath Administrator Management Council Member

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    There can be a lot of variation depending on how an airplane is equipped. (GPS? Fancy IFR-certified GPS? Glass panel? Autopilot? Just basic VOR's? Souped-up engine?)
     
  3. eman1200

    eman1200 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    north jersey is expensive AF yo. that's why I moved out. a hundredaire like me can live like a king here in the south!

    what about places even further north, like sussex county and whatnot, is that an option?
     
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  4. Sierra_Hotel

    Sierra_Hotel Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Down here in the NOLA area it's around $160/hr plane + $60/hr instructor. $117/hr for an R model is an insanely good price.
     
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  5. TCABM

    TCABM Pattern Altitude

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    $130-$165/hr for 172G-P models here in south central TX
     
  6. vkhosid

    vkhosid Cleared for Takeoff

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    I used to drive about an hour in SF to get to my airport/plane rental....so, driving is certainly an options. If you have suggestions, I'm all ears!
     
  7. vkhosid

    vkhosid Cleared for Takeoff

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    Truth be told, I didn't ask about equipment. However, in their quoting of prices, they quoted a higher price for a glass panel...So, I assume the cheaper rate is for steam gauges?? But, I could be wrong.
     
  8. vkhosid

    vkhosid Cleared for Takeoff

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    That's too far of a commute for me....:(
     
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  9. eman1200

    eman1200 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    I've been out of jersey too long to know the scoop up there but I would assume there'd be a big difference between mo'town/caldwell area vs sussex. but I really can't say, no idea what current rates are, just a guess.
     
  10. asicer

    asicer Final Approach

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    So about a mile or two? :)
     
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  11. vkhosid

    vkhosid Cleared for Takeoff

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    You must be confusing SF with LA....I lived in SF, worked in Pleasanton, and flew from KLVK
     
  12. Cap'n Jack

    Cap'n Jack Final Approach

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    Where in North NJ?

    Your choices could be SMQ, N51, 47N, 39N (these are all fairly close to one another). MMU and CDW might be in another price level.

    The people at N51 and 39N were really nice, but my information was a long, long, time ago.
     
  13. L.C. Gray

    L.C. Gray Filing Flight Plan

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    Paying $120 wet for 172N and $40 CFI in central Texas. Think I'm getting a bargain here.
     
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  14. Rgbeard

    Rgbeard Pattern Altitude

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    FirstFlight in San Diego continues to offer wet 172s for $85 and a 182 for $125, and a Cherokee Six for $150.
     
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  15. Sierra_Hotel

    Sierra_Hotel Pre-takeoff checklist

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    How is that even possible
     
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  16. NHWannabe

    NHWannabe Line Up and Wait

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    Here in NH the flight school/rental place I trained at a 172R/S rent at $169/hr
     
  17. SoonerAviator

    SoonerAviator Final Approach

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    OK area - C172S steam gauges - $135/hr. G1000 model is $161/hr. Both wet/Hobbs.
     
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  18. SoonerAviator

    SoonerAviator Final Approach

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    Probably dry rates, lol.
     
  19. GaryM

    GaryM Line Up and Wait

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    If you are interested in a club, Morris Aero Club at KMMU has a nice 180 HP Skyhawk. http://www.morrisaeroclub.org Recently upgraded panel with an Avidyn IFD0440 and two G5's, and a PMA450B audio panel. $110 an hour, wet, tach time not Hobbs (so well under $100 an hour Hobbs). Dues are $85 a month; I'd have to look up what the current buy-in is. We have four instructors in the club, they set their own rates but I believe all are well below $70 hour. I'm a member, so let me know if you'd like more information.
     
  20. RyanB

    RyanB Administrator Management Council Member PoA Supporter

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  21. WDD

    WDD Cleared for Takeoff

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    Gary nailed it. This is exactly what I did - found a club. The flight school rental prices around here are high and getting higher. Now the flight school's Tiger is $165 wet. Their C172 steam gauge is $145, and their glass C172 is close to $200. I joined a club that not only has much lower wet rates, they charge per TACH hour and not HOBBS. CFI's are $50/hour. Reasonable for me. And... the planes are nicer and more likely to be not down for maint.


    BTW - if the last time you rented was a few years ago, just for a baseline call your old place in SF and see what their rates are now. High demand in 2020, limited supply pushing rates up? I know flight schools are jammed almost beyond capacity.
     
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  22. Todd82

    Todd82 Line Up and Wait

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    How far from ABE? Ace pilot training has some Cherokee 140's that aren't the newest but they're much more reasonable, and were maintained well when I was living out there. Be kind to N586FL she was my first solo.
     
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  23. bflynn

    bflynn Final Approach

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    In the Raleigh area, I can tell you where to get a 172S with a Garmin 650 for 116.31 wet. The price varies with fuel, but it won't move that dramatically.

    In NJ, that price would be just a dream.
     
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  24. Skyrys62

    Skyrys62 En-Route

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    No maintenance?
     
  25. Rgbeard

    Rgbeard Pattern Altitude

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    So, next time I put the word WET in bold?
     
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  26. Rgbeard

    Rgbeard Pattern Altitude

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    Why would you even say this?

    I know the maintenance team personally, and they're proud of their dispatch rate and fleet.
     
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  27. SkyChaser

    SkyChaser Pre-takeoff checklist

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    If I'm remembering right, the '66 Skyhawk I was originally renting was $110/hr wet, and instruction was $45/hr, through the part 61 flight school based at the airport. The '75 steam gauge Archer I currently rent is $62/hr dry, usually ending up about $90/hr wet. My CFI charges me $35/hr. Plane and instruction separate. Including taxes and $15 of gas to travel to the airport, it's about $140ish per hour of dual. The FBO (who owns the plane) is run by the mechanic who runs the shop on the airport, so the plane is always in very good shape.

    This is small town Midwest.
     
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  28. SoonerAviator

    SoonerAviator Final Approach

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    Ugh, it was obvious the comment was tongue-in-cheek. Take a deep breath and relax.
     
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  29. AlphaMike

    AlphaMike Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Those are great prices! and the 1947 Aeronca 7AC for $65.. I can't even find a tail dragger for rent around me. I keep hearing that the insurance it too high if not impossible to get for a rental tail dragger.
     
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  30. YKA

    YKA Pre-takeoff checklist

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    A 172 is cheap and easy to maintain, and some places choose not to price gouge. I'm in Canada, yet with our dollar being worth less, higher gas prices, and such, it is still possible to rent for as low as $130/hr. Now that I am having to rent, I did a checkout and hours for the insurance, $175/hr with instructor and in Canadian dollars. Rent a 172 from them frequently, $130/hr wet, and they are making money. So maybe they are only pocketing $35 per hour, that beats it making nothing. I bring them back my fuel receipts from fill ups I did at various airports along my route, they deduct those from my rental fee. If you are living where they charge $180 hour, especially American, buy your own 172, fly it when you want, and rent it out for the big money you can stick in your pocket. That is more than double the operation cost.

    For those who are curious, $130 Canadian is the equivalent of $102.93 American.
    Screenshot_20210121-115749_Chrome.jpg
     
  31. Skyrys62

    Skyrys62 En-Route

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    joking around..
     
  32. CaptainXap

    CaptainXap Filing Flight Plan

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    Out of interest, where were you renting your plane from?
     
  33. YKA

    YKA Pre-takeoff checklist

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    For reference, in 1999 when I began learning to fly, in Canadian dollars, a 172 was $60/hr wet, and with an instructor $90. In 2001 I bought a share in a 172, we paid $25 hr we flew it dry, and had a rule we set that upon returning we filled it up, so it was full when parked. I had a side deal with an instructor to pay her $15 cash an hour in my planes, be it my 152 I owned a share in back in 1999, my 172 in 2001 up until 2004 when I moved to a new city too far away, so sold my 172 share, then bought a share in a Cherokee six in late 2004. Now that was expensive, it always had to have something fixed, and burnt twice the fuel for 23% more speed. Wasn't sad to sell my share in it in 2007 when I bought my own 210 I loved. Must say that I had excellent partners in all three of those first shared ownership planes. In 2015 i became a half partner in a Seneca lll, he basically begged me to sell my 210, and become a 50/50 in the Seneca, actual plane was great, but my partner was the nightmare from hell, after 3 years of enduring his BS, we parted ways with him buying me out. He couldn't really afford it on his own, which is why he begged me to be his partner to begin with, in the end he had to sell the Seneca. In a perfect world, I would find a great partner locally, and together the two of us would buy a year or two old DA62, or even a SR22, and then I would buy my own second plane, for playtime, and when the partnership plane is down for maintenance and annuals, or my partner was using it. Who knows what is next, almost thinking about buying a 210, and also an Extra or Gamebird.
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2021
  34. Racerx

    Racerx Line Up and Wait

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    That's about the going rate in the Chicagoland area. One reason I learned in my dads Cherokee Six. I've never been a fan of renting (in my area be it planes or houses). It works out great if you're the one renting it out...for the most part.
     
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  35. Everskyward

    Everskyward Experimenter

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    Someone else I met said that LVK had a really good rate on 172s. I remember LVK when it was out in the farmlands. I used to go there from OAK when I was learning.
     
  36. Rgbeard

    Rgbeard Pattern Altitude

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    Sorry but my Sensitive-Sally britches were a little tight.

    I loosened the straps a notch.

    sensitive-sally.jpeg
     
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  37. Grapeshot

    Grapeshot Filing Flight Plan

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    West Jersey - 140/hr for a 172 with steam gauges, $50/hr for instruction.
     
  38. AggieMike88

    AggieMike88 Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    The original "I don't know it all" of aviation.
    About the same around my area if DFW...

    Glass Panel 172SP’s have been spotted renting for $200-ish at KADS
     
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  39. AggieMike88

    AggieMike88 Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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  40. midwestpa24

    midwestpa24 En-Route

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    No one wants to pay more for something than they have to, and in the OP's situation I'd get sticker shock too at $165 for a 172 and $70 for instructor as that is high anywhere outside of northern NJ.

    That being said I'm also leery of any place advertising low rental rates too. Maintenance, fuel, insurance, etc., all cost money. If the rate is really low, which one are they cheaping out on, and do you want to be the one that finds out. Even my own airplane that I own a 1/4 share of cost each owner $100 month for hangar, and insurance, and $40/hr dry to cover maintenance. With fuel I'm close to $80-90/hr wet, without factoring in hangar and insurance, and our hangar is dirt cheap.