Leaky airplane can't stay in community hangar?

BellyUpFish

BellyUpFish

Cleared for Takeoff
Joined
Aug 15, 2011
Messages
1,157
Display Name
Display name:
Backtothesand
Based on the reaction of many you'd think this is the original post:

Hey idiots, your mothers can't cook an egg to save her life and your wives all look like a mangy mutts. Your kids are ugly too! Man, I'd shave them and teach them walk backwards if my kids were that ugly.

Oh, yeh, while I have your attention, my bird is dripping our super special blend of fuel (chlorine trifluoride, hydrogen and jet-a) by the 55 gallon drum full all over the hangar floor and they won't let my buddies launch their D sized model rockets near it! I left the parking brake on and they are dragging that thing out of the hangar into a full blown tornadic hail dust storm.

Boy, I'm about to run over there and put my size 13 somewhere the sun don't shine! I'm gonna walk all over any numbskull moron who gets in my way!!

Who do they think they are!?! How dare they treat me in such a ruthless manner!!!!

Allahu Akbar!!

However, what I really said was:

Ok, so the Cheyenne I'm flying has developed a small fuel (Jet A) leak.

This leak has caused airport management to pull the aircraft out and leave it on the ramp.

I'm unsure, and I'm headed to the airport in a few to discuss this, as to the reasoning behind having it sit on the ramp.

Anyone have any idea why this would be required to sit on the ramp?
 
Last edited:
Because airport management said so - and it's probably indicated as such in the hangar agreement.

I certainly wouldn't want my plane in a community hangar where another plane is leaking flammable liquid all over the floor.
 
BellyUpFish said:
Ok, so the Cheyenne I'm flying has developed a small fuel (Jet A) leak.

This leak has caused airport management to pull the aircraft out and leave it on the ramp.

I'm unsure, and I'm headed to the airport in a few to discuss this, as to the reasoning behind having it sit on the ramp.

Anyone have any idea why this would be required to sit on the ramp?
Click to expand...

Fuel vapor is not only noxious, it's explosive, even JetA. Fix the leak, leave it outside until then. It not only puts the entire hangar at risk, it also puts your own plane at greater risk inside. Fix the leak.
 
BellyUpFish said:
About a drop every 15 seconds. Leaked about a pint of fuel in a 24 hour period. All into a catch device.

We have no MX support on the field and I haven't been able to get it to MX yet.
Click to expand...

Leave it outside until you do.
 
BellyUpFish said:
About a drop every 15 seconds. Leaked about a pint of fuel in a 24 hour period. All into a catch device.

We have no MX support on the field and I haven't been able to get it to MX yet.
Click to expand...

Not a issue... IMHO...
 
BellyUpFish said:
That's the plan. I'm not "living" with the leak. The opportunity to have it fixed hasn't presented itself.
Click to expand...

Good, a few days on the ramp won't hurt it, and if some odd occurrence does happen, it's insured.
 
N801BH said:
Not a issue... IMHO...
Click to expand...


Yeh, it's not enough to be overly concerned with. Which is why I didn't understand why a catch device wouldn't suffice in the hangar.

Like someone said, it's their hangar. Fine with me.

Henning said:
Good, a few days on the ramp won't hurt it, and if some odd occurrence does happen, it's insured.
Click to expand...


Yep. Such is life. ;)

There is an open T-hangar. May stick it in there.
 
BellyUpFish said:
Yeh, it's not enough to be overly concerned with. Which is why I didn't understand why a catch device wouldn't suffice in the hangar.

Like someone said, it's their hangar. Fine with me.




Yep. Such is life. ;)

There is an open T-hangar. May stick it in there.
Click to expand...

There you go, perfect option.
 
Henning said:
Fuel vapor is not only noxious, it's explosive, even JetA. Fix the leak, leave it outside until then. It not only puts the entire hangar at risk, it also puts your own plane at greater risk inside. Fix the leak.
Click to expand...

How many airplanes with leaky bladders filled the cabin with 100LL vapors and still they didn't explode when someone fliped the master on?
 
bnt83 said:
How many airplanes with leaky bladders filled the cabin with 100LL vapors and still they didn't explode when someone fliped the master on?
Click to expand...

How often it happens is irrelevant. Tankers washed and ran around empty for a long time without inerting the tanks and rarely did one explode, but once we figure out why they did, we quit and immediately rectified the situation. Now all tankers run with inerted tanks.
 
If you've ever seen a hangar fire you'd understand.
 
There is another fix to the situation.

Call your insurance carrier, and explain that you want to keep your plane in a comm hangar with a bunch of other planes, and that your plane is leaking fuel. Give them your N number and ask them for the premium for coverage for a Cheyenne leaking fuel in the comm hangar. Oh - make sure you specify 'leaking fuel, comm hangar and your N number'.

Bazinga
 
Catching the fuel in a basin actually adds to the hazard with a small leak as it provides walls in which vapor can collect above the liquid. Then combine that with if it ignites, it concentrates the fire right under a fuel supply.

Just all in all a poor idea to have open fuel in an enclosed space where a condition between LEL and UEL can be exposed to a source of ignition.
 
If you have a buddy with an SR-71 and room in his hanger, he'll share it with you. That airplane leaked a sieve at less than M1.0.
 
JimNtexas said:
If you have a buddy with an SR-71 and room in his hanger, he'll share it with you. That airplane leaked a sieve at less than M1.0.
Click to expand...

:lol: But it also took Triethylborane to get it to ignite since it doesn't vaporize well at all. ;)
 
BellyUpFish said:
About a drop every 15 seconds. Leaked about a pint of fuel in a 24 hour period. All into a catch device.
Click to expand...
Unless the catch device is very specific and grounded to the airframe, you can bet that it's dangerous. I've seen more aircraft destroyed by fuel falling through the air into simple cans/buckets.
 
If my airplane was also in that hangar and no one moved your leaking plane outside, I'd drag it out myself. If the the first posts reads as you intended, then you're way out of line in your thinking.
 
JimNtexas said:
If you have a buddy with an SR-71 and room in his hanger, he'll share it with you. That airplane leaked a sieve at less than M1.0.
Click to expand...
IIRC, the heat from the friction of the air cause parts to expand and it would tighten up.
Still one of the coolest airplanes ever.
 
That same hangar had a Citation in it for years and they kept mats under it to absorb the fuel. Most of the old Citations leak. In that same hangar a 310 set for weeks leaking 100 LL. Of course 100LL evaporates. You move all of the aircraft out of hangars that leak a fluid of one kind or another the ramps are going to be crowded. New airport manager, much to do over nothing.
 
Last edited:
BellyUpFish said:
About a drop every 15 seconds. Leaked about a pint of fuel in a 24 hour period. All into a catch device.

We have no MX support on the field and I haven't been able to get it to MX yet.
Click to expand...
What's the limit in the maintenance manual?
 
Seems like if you keep minimal fuel in the airplane, it would at least help to slow it down. Hell, on a metroliner, all my friends who flew them said, if it isn't leaking, I'd be worried.
 
flyingron said:
Unless the catch device is very specific and grounded to the airframe, you can bet that it's dangerous. I've seen more aircraft destroyed by fuel falling through the air into simple cans/buckets.
Click to expand...

Yep, our maintenance hangar lost a 172 that way and almost four other planes. Mechanics were fixing a leaky gas sump valve and static from the dripping gas lit things up. Line guys were very quick with the big CO2 cart. If they'd been on a fuel run............
 
In a row of T-hangars, the hangar next door had a Prist leak that bled under the walls into my hangar. Now the hangar smells like diesel fuel every time I walk in. At first, it was so bad that I was worried about the smell permeating inside the aircraft and persisting (a la cigarette smoke). It's much better now, but 4 months after the spill, I'm still sprinkling kitty litter and still smell that aroma when I first open the door.

If it smells like Prist and I was in the hangar with you, I'd as you to get the leak fixed.
 
JHW said:
If my airplane was also in that hangar and no one moved your leaking plane outside, I'd drag it out myself. If the the first posts reads as you intended, then you're way out of line in your thinking.
Click to expand...


LOL.. You must be one stout fella..

I'm not sure how the first post reads, but it seems you've taken offense to it.

It should read very similar to "they pulled the airplane out of the hangar and I'm going to discuss with them why."
 
BellyUpFish said:
LOL.. You must be one stout fella..

I'm not sure how the first post reads, but it seems you've taken offense to it.

It should read very similar to "they pulled the airplane out of the hangar and I'm going to discuss with them why."
Click to expand...
well obviously I'd use my tractor

Really, i don't get what you're asking. If you're leaking fuel you can't stay inside unless you drain all the fuel out of that tank. That's just common sense.
 
BellyUpFish said:
LOL.. You must be one stout fella..

I'm not sure how the first post reads, but it seems you've taken offense to it.

It should read very similar to "they pulled the airplane out of the hangar and I'm going to discuss with them why."
Click to expand...

The thing is, that reads like you don't understand why it's outside, implying (correctly or not) that you don't believe that a plane leaking fuel in a hangar is a problem.
 
A leak that small is a non issue. You people with your panties in a wad over a few drops of kerosene crack me up. Like I have already posted, planes have set in that hangar and leaked a lot more than that. The only plane I ever saw taken out of that hangar was a Navajo that had nacelle tanks and one sprang a leak dumping about 25 gallons over night. Cleaned up what did not evaporate and quit using the nacelle tanks. No big deal. There was a maintenance facility in one area of this hangar at one time, until they ran him off. Anyway, a lot more liquid gets spilled in maintenance than a few drops of kerosene. The whole thing the OP is putting up with is an airport manager that knows nothing about aircraft operation and maintaining an aircraft.

OP I assume you put it in the center drive through hangar on the first row. Don't think there is a T hangar out there that it would fit in:dunno:. Do you know what is leaking yet? Did our mutual friend in TN. have any ideas? Did you talk to him? It is a shame the way general aviation is treated there.
 
Last edited:
Is it low risk? Most definitely. Is it a risk that should be avoided? Most definitely.
 
Bravado is often the key to message board interaction. I doubt we'd all talk to each other he way we do on a message board in real life, but it's fun to pounce on someone via a keyboard. It is what it is. I don't lose any sleep over it. ;)

I spoke with him, we aren't sure what the issue is. Sending unit on the left ladder was the suggested culprit, but hasn't been proven to be the problem.

It quit leaking after the last out and back and I thought we were good, but I got a call this morning saying it wasn't.

It's really a pain with no MX on field.
 
BellyUpFish said:
Bravado is often the key to message board interaction. I doubt we'd all talk to each other he way we do on a message board in real life, but it's fun to pounce on someone via a keyboard. It is what it is. I don't lose any sleep over it. ;)

I spoke with him, we aren't sure what the issue is. Sending unit on the left ladder was the suggested culprit, but hasn't been proven to be the problem.

It quit leaking after the last out and back and I thought we were good, but I got a call this morning saying it wasn't.

It's really a pain with no MX on field.
Click to expand...

No MX on the field is a huge PITA, especially if you need to use the plane frequently on a "demand" schedule.
 
Henning said:
No MX on the field is a huge PITA, especially if you need to use the plane frequently on a "demand" schedule.
Click to expand...


It sure is. Even a basic piston single has to be flown out for an annual.

As ronnieh mentioned, our is fairly unfriendly towards GA. Used to be quite a nice place. Multiple FBO's, etc. Not anymore.
 
I'm sure glad none of you worry warts were around during my heavy check hangar days when we had to sump and vent the tanks on both wide body and narrow body jets prior to tank entry for maintenance or inspection. Of course we took all of the necessary precautions but still the amount of fuel we drained out of tanks was substantial.
 
I suspect if it was leaking red or black fluid it wouldn't have been moved.

Since it's the stuff that is supposed to burn that was leaking, moving the plane from an enclosed space is the safest course of action.

Many large leaks start with occasional drips. And with no MX on field, how soon will (or was) this situation corrected?
 
If walk into a hangar and smell oil / 'engine smell' / lube that's normal. If I walk into a hangar and smell fuel (Jet A or 100L) that's a red flag. I don't fault them for wanting to move it outside. Was the building in imminent risk of exploding? Probably not, but let's not find out.
 
Last edited:
BellyUpFish said:
It is extremely low risk. It is also something that should be handled.

All the "I'd move it for you!!!" and "it's a disaster waiting to happen spilling fuel all over the floor!?!?!!!" stuff is silly.

I mean, really..

I don't know why people act like they do on the Internet. Anonymity I guess.
Click to expand...
It just seems like common courtesy to me. I meant what I said, if we share a hangar and I notice your airplane is leaking fuel, first I'm going to see if there is something obvious I can do to stop the leak and next step I'm going to tow it outside. I'd expect my neighbors to do the same for me if my plane was leaking.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top