Is the extra $7000 worth it for a Garmin 650 instead of a Garmin 355?

[AeronautCanuk]

Am I missing something or does that 7 AMU increase in price just add VOR/LOC/ILS capabilities? I have a 430 right now and a KX155 with glide slope. The 430 appears to not be sending data to the G5s for VOR/LOC/ILS, but I'm having trouble justifying $7k for something I'm probably going to use a lot less once I have LPV capabilities...

Anyone have any thoughts on this?

 

[Jim K]

Personally, while I'm not ready to give up VOR/ILS capability, I don't think redundancy is necessary any more. I'd be totally comfortable with a gnc355 and a kx155. Just be sure to practice flying ILS's on the CDI occasionally. I haven't flown an ILS in anger in years.

I'm planning similar on my RV build...foregoing the GTN for a gnx375 backed up by a gnc 215.

 

[Llewtrah381]

Just be sure to practice flying ILS's on the CDI occasionally

True - but also remember two things/ first, the 650, 355, etc have the ILS approaches in their databases, so they could guide an autopilot while monitoring on a CDI. Second, and similarly, most ILS approaches seem to have RNAV overlay approaches.

I'm planning similar on my RV build...foregoing the GTN for a gnx375 backed up by a gnc 215.

Basically what I have (a 355 instead). Consider the Trig TX56A instead of the 215. The 215 is a disappointment, IMHO, with very different buttonology from the 355

 

[asicer]

Am I missing something or does that 7 AMU increase in price just add VOR/LOC/ILS capabilities? I have a 430 right now and a KX155 with glide slope. The 430 appears to not be sending data to the G5s for VOR/LOC/ILS, but I'm having trouble justifying $7k for something I'm probably going to use a lot less once I have LPV capabilities...

Anyone have any thoughts on this?

The 650 also has a bigger screen. Some find the split keyboard on the smaller 355 to be off-putting. The 650 gives you vertical waypoints while the 355 does not. If the 650 is the Xi variant, it also gives you SmartGlide. There's a few extra interface ports on the back, but probably not of concern to you in the pilot's seat.

 

[Hangontight]

Ive had both, go for the 355, the 650 isn’t worth the extra money in my opinion. I’ve logged a bunch of time behind the 355 and never felt like I was in need of anything else. My new airplane has a 650 but I don’t think it’s $7k better…..just my $0.02

 

[manac]

You don’t state it but are you keeping the 155?
If so I’d go with the 355.
The 355 screen is only .1” smaller.
Instead of the 650 and GTX345 transponder I went with a GNC215 and a GNX375. I’m very happy with the 375.

 

[midlifeflyer]

I still want VLOC capability. If not a navigator with that, I’d want a second NAV/COM. The other small consideration, if you care, is the lack of enroute VNAV capability in the “sub-GTN” units. Might not care if you don’t have an autopilot able to take advantage if it.

Screen size doesn’t matter too much to me so long as it’s easy to move up and down in the flight plan. I see a moving map as an EFB function.

 

[MackMooney]

except for screensize, i don't believe so anymore.
keep your 430, this will give you backup gps and the additional vor/loc/ils, install the gnc 355 as main, get the avionics shop to fix the connection between the 430 and the g5s.

ils/loc -- absolutely, vor nav, bleh.
tbh, the built in connext functionality for the gnc355 is worth way more to me than any additional feature of the 650

 

[AeronautCanuk]

True - but also remember two things/ first, the 650, 355, etc have the ILS approaches in their databases, so they could guide an autopilot while monitoring on a CDI. Second, and similarly, most ILS approaches seem to have RNAV overlay approaches.

Basically what I have (a 355 instead). Consider the Trig TX56A instead of the 215. The 215 is a disappointment, IMHO, with very different buttonology from the 355

oh that's a good point I didn't consider! So you could have the 355 giving you "information only" ILS while you did the actual approach on the KX155? That sounds like a good set up!

 

[AeronautCanuk]

except for screensize, i don't believe so anymore.
keep your 430, this will give you backup gps and the additional vor/loc/ils, install the gnc 355 as main, get the avionics shop to fix the connection between the 430 and the g5s.

ils/loc -- absolutely, vor nav, bleh.
tbh, the built in connext functionality for the gnc355 is worth way more to me than any additional feature of the 650

oh yeah, the Connext would be so nice. I am already a Garmin Pilot user and I used to fly a plane that had a 650 and it was so nice to do my flight plans on my ipad/phone and then sync up. Even in flight, it's easier to make adjustments on the handheld device.

 

[m4tman]

Anyone have an opinion on which audio panel is better Garmin VS PS Engineering ? I am looking to upgrade my avionics in my Cherokee 180 and don't know much about this stuff. I have purchased 2 AV-30's with the AV-link, AV-HSI, and the External Mag. I am looking at either the Garmin 345 or the PS Engineering PMA 450C for the audio panel, and a Garmin GNC 355. Does anyone know if this will all "JIVE" together ?

 

[MackMooney]

i love my ps engineering audio panel, intelliaudio is awesome BUT i don't think you can go wrong with either ps engineering or garmin.
they will both work

 

[WDD]

Net net, I'd get the GNC 355.

Your questions are great. FWIW, I currently have both a GTN 650xi AND a GNC 355 in my panel. I did fly it for half a year with only the GNC 355.

How long will you have this plane? How much / what % of flying will be IFR?

IF you'll have this plane a long time, and/or IF you fly a lot of IFR, the GTN 650xi is a nice upgrade with the larger screen, smart glide, ability to input altitudes into the way points for the auto pilot, etc.​

That said, the GNC 355 is a perfectly fine option for flying GPS and RNAV approaches.​

​

Either one will feed your ADSB transponder, run a Garmin autopilot, etc.​

Either choice will give you GPS / LPV's on the G5, but no Nav radio ILS. Your G5 HSI can only be hooked up to the GTN/GNC, but not also your Nav radio. It sounds like your Nav radio already has that solved with it's built in glide slope though. (EDITED TO UPDATE "Radio")

Why did I add the GTN 650xi to the existing GNC 355? I'll be keeping this plane for a long time, I didn't have any Nav radio navigation capabilities, I do like the larger screen, faster processer, etc., and I liked the idea of having a back up GPS. That said, I've done dozens of approaches in 2025, and only one of those was an ILS. And as mentioned, any runway with an ILS approach also has an RNAV.

It's also a scalable option. You can always add a GTN later if you find yourself keeping the plane for a while, and you get to where you'd like the larger more capable GTN 650xi features. The GTN and GNC will sync nicely together as well as all the other benefits to a dual GPS system.

 

[MackMooney]

Net net, I'd get the GNC 355.

Your questions are great. FWIW, I currently have both a GTN 650xi AND a GNC 355 in my panel. I did fly it for half a year with only the GNC 355.

How long will you have this plane? How much / what % of flying will be IFR?

IF you'll have this plane a long time, and/or IF you fly a lot of IFR, the GTN 650xi is a nice upgrade with the larger screen, smart glide, ability to input altitudes into the way points for the auto pilot, etc.​

That said, the GNC 355 is a perfectly fine option for flying GPS and RNAV approaches.​

​

Either one will feed your ADSB transponder, run a Garmin autopilot, etc.​

Either choice will give you GPS / LPV's on the G5, but no Nav radio ILS. Your G5 HSI can only be hooked up to one source, which means your existing Nav radio can't also be hooked into it. It sounds like your Nav radio already has that solved with it's built in glide slope though.

Why did I add the GTN 650xi to the existing GNC 355? I'll be keeping this plane for a long time, I didn't have any Nav radio navigation capabilities, I do like the larger screen, faster processer, etc., and I liked the idea of having a back up GPS. That said, I've done dozens of approaches in 2025, and only one of those was an ILS. And as mentioned, any runway with an ILS approach also has an RNAV.

It's also a scalable option. You can always add a GTN later if you find yourself keeping the plane for a while, and you get to where you'd like the larger more capable GTN 650xi features. The GTN and GNC will sync nicely together as well as all the other benefits to a dual GPS system.

what do you mean by g5 hsi can only be hooked up to one source? my plane is in the shop at this moment having the g5's connected to both my gns480 and gnc355? Hoping i won't be getting any surprises when i pick it up in a few days

 

[WDD]

what do you mean by g5 hsi can only be hooked up to one source? my plane is in the shop at this moment having the g5's connected to both my gns480 and gnc355? Hoping i won't be getting any surprises when i pick it up in a few days

I misspoke, apologies -

I believe the G5 cannot be hooked into both a radio and a GNC/GTN. But it can be hooked into multiple GNC/GTN. For example, my GI275 can switch from GPS 1, GPS 2, and Nav radio.

If I'm incorrect on the radio part, appreciate an update.

 

[WDD]

Anyone have an opinion on which audio panel is better Garmin VS PS Engineering ? I am looking to upgrade my avionics in my Cherokee 180 and don't know much about this stuff. I have purchased 2 AV-30's with the AV-link, AV-HSI, and the External Mag. I am looking at either the Garmin 345 or the PS Engineering PMA 450C for the audio panel, and a Garmin GNC 355. Does anyone know if this will all "JIVE" together ?

My panel upgrade this past March, I picked the PS engineering over the Garmin. Why? PS works so well with everything, they have excellent products, and great support. "They do one thing, and they do it well".

 

[asicer]

So you could have the 355 giving you "information only" ILS while you did the actual approach on the KX155?

Yes, but it helps to be aware of what the GPS is really telling you.

A

Post in thread 'New panel for a 206'

Jan 29, 2025

I do not plan to have the autopilot connected to the VOR, so I want to make sure that it will track the “fake” glideslope coming from the GNX375 while the VOR/LOC GS is set up as primary. Obviously, the same question is in play for an RNAV/LPV glideslope, but I am somewhat more confident that this is supported.

So today I programmed an ILS approach on the GNX375 and told my autopilot to follow it. I also dialed it up on my NAV2/CDI2 for monitoring. From the IAF, the GI275 was indicating LNAV precision the whole way down. Even past the FAF, the VDI never popped up. However, I flew a...

• asicer

 

[asicer]

any runway with an ILS approach also has an RNAV.

"almost any". There's a couple of exceptions.

 

[WDD]

except for screensize, i don't believe so anymore.
keep your 430, this will give you backup gps and the additional vor/loc/ils, install the gnc 355 as main, get the avionics shop to fix the connection between the 430 and the g5s.

ils/loc -- absolutely, vor nav, bleh.
tbh, the built in connext functionality for the gnc355 is worth way more to me than any additional feature of the 650

This is a great choice IMHO

 

[asicer]

tbh, the built in connext functionality for the gnc355 is worth way more to me than any additional feature of the 650

To each their own. For some people, vertical waypoints (or "enroute VNAV" in @midlifeflyer-speak) is a pretty big deal.

 

[MackMooney]

i'm frugal to a fault, having a gns480 reinstalled in my plane cause i just couldn't justify a new radio when i had an old one that can do 90% the same stuff. 7000$ is a massive diff for me

 

[m4tman]

My panel upgrade this past March, I picked the PS engineering over the Garmin. Why? PS works so well with everything, they have excellent products, and great support. "They do one thing, and they do it well".

Thank you for the info, it seems like a lot of pilots like the PS

 

[m4tman]

My panel upgrade this past March, I picked the PS engineering over the Garmin. Why? PS works so well with everything, they have excellent products, and great support. "They do one thing, and they do it well".

Thank you WDD

 

[m4tman]

i love my ps engineering audio panel, intelliaudio is awesome BUT i don't think you can go wrong with either ps engineering or garmin.
they will both work

Thank You Sir

 

[asicer]

Anyone have an opinion on which audio panel is better Garmin VS PS Engineering ? ...I am looking at either the Garmin 345 or the PS Engineering PMA 450C for the audio panel

Both just work. With either, there's nothing but analog audio wiring to the rest of the panel so there's no concern with incompatibility. Feature-wise, they are pretty close. One key difference is the UI. In my book, having the PMA450c screen tell you what it's doing is way better than the GMA345 tell you via aural messages.

 

[Llewtrah381]

I do like the larger screen

I’ve said this before elsewhere: I have an Aera 760 connected to my 355, which is great: a nice big screen plus a lot cheaper to get ADS-B in via a GDL50 than what’s needed for the 355. Plus the GDL50 has ADAHARS, so the 760 is a battery-backed extra ADI.

I went with a 300XL/Garmin 396, graduated the 396 to an Aera 660, then graduated the 300XL to a 355, then the 660 to a 760. Plus, the leftover 660 now sits where the CDIs were and is awesome as a dedicated traffic scope (using the GDL50).

Bottom line, the small screen on the 355 need not be an issue plus it’s affordable to add redundancy with the panel mounted handhelds.

 

[flyingcheesehead]

Am I missing something or does that 7 AMU increase in price just add VOR/LOC/ILS capabilities? I have a 430 right now and a KX155 with glide slope. The 430 appears to not be sending data to the G5s for VOR/LOC/ILS, but I'm having trouble justifying $7k for something I'm probably going to use a lot less once I have LPV capabilities...

Anyone have any thoughts on this?

There are several differences... Not in order of importance:

1) 650 has a taller screen
2) 650 has ground based nav capability
3) 650 has VNAV capability (contrary to what some other posters are saying, you do NOT need a fancy autopilot, or an autopilot at all, to take advantage of this)
4) 650Xi has Smart Glide capability
5) 650Xi has some extra processing power and may yet get some additional features before it's replaced by the next big thing.

Anyone have an opinion on which audio panel is better Garmin VS PS Engineering ? I am looking to upgrade my avionics in my Cherokee 180 and don't know much about this stuff. I have purchased 2 AV-30's with the AV-link, AV-HSI, and the External Mag. I am looking at either the Garmin 345 or the PS Engineering PMA 450C for the audio panel, and a Garmin GNC 355. Does anyone know if this will all "JIVE" together ?

PS Engineering. Garmin makes an audio panel that works because they want to sell you every single thing in your panel, but with the exception of the GMA 350c tied to a GTN giving you voice control of the GTN, their audio panels aren't anything special.

PS Engineering does one thing (audio panels), they've been doing it for a long time, and they do it REALLY well. There's nothing that needs to be "compatible" with anything else.

 

[WDD]

Bottom line, the small screen on the 355 need not be an issue plus it’s affordable to add redundancy with the panel mounted handhelds.

1 - I do like the larger screen of the 650xi, but was perfectly safe and functional with the smaller GNC screen.

2 - For IFR, I would not rely on the handheld as a back up. I've had a tablet shut down once or twice. I would also not permanently mount a tablet, as they seem to become outdated sooner rather than later. Panels are expensive to configure, and should last longer than an I Pads life span.

 

[MackMooney]

When flying IFR, my attention is 75% on the instruments g5s, engine, etc... 20% on the efb for plates (sid/star/approach) oh and traffic and less than 5% on the navigators, mostly for switching comm frequencies or selecting procedures; difference in size between the 650 and the 355 matters even less at that point.

 

[WDD]

When flying IFR, my attention is 75% on the instruments g5s, engine, etc... 20% on the efb for plates (sid/star/approach) oh and traffic and less than 5% on the navigators, mostly for switching comm frequencies or selecting procedures; difference in size between the 650 and the 355 matters even less at that point.

Copy that. But a larger screen can still help. I've found that one potentially distracting area is when you have to interact with the GPS unit. Spending even a few more seconds on that unit before returning to the six pack can get you off of the perfect attitude and track you were on. Which is why whatever unit you use you need to drill/practice on the I Pad simulator to the point you have every input sequence and input/button location memorized.

A larger screen can help speed things up when dealing with such things as reloading an approach, loading an arrival and then scrolling and selecting the fix you need to go to, etc. A GTN 750 for example with it's mega screen size would be amazing IMHO.

But all in all, the smaller GNC also works just fine, just a bit more effort.

 

[Groundpounder]

What is your mission? If its mostly VFR with just a little bit of IFR here and there, the 355 is fine. If you want a serious IFR capable machine, go with the 650.

 

[krispetersen4]

Kind of depends on your needs. Little bigger screen, few more features with the GTNxi and capabilities depending on your auto pilot setup. Smart glide, Vnav.. I’d say it depends on what else you have and what else your wanting to do.

 

[SCCutler]

Migrating from the 430, you should seriously consider the Avidyne IFD440. That was my call, and I’ve been very happy with my choice. It does a lot, and does it well. Also allows use of your iPad as almost another IFD device (everything but another radio), through the IFD100 app. Also, the Avidyne slides into your 440 tray - you can save thousands in install cost.

Migrating from the 430, you’ll be learning new flow, and I find the Avidyne vertical intuitive.

As for audio panels, I favor PSE, superior products and absolutely unmatched customer service.

 

[David Tulis]

I’ve said this before elsewhere: I have an Aera 760 connected to my 355, which is great: a nice big screen plus a lot cheaper to get ADS-B in via a GDL50 than what’s needed for the 355. Plus the GDL50 has ADAHARS, so the 760 is a battery-backed extra ADI.

I went with a 300XL/Garmin 396, graduated the 396 to an Aera 660, then graduated the 300XL to a 355, then the 660 to a 760. Plus, the leftover 660 now sits where the CDIs were and is awesome as a dedicated traffic scope (using the GDL50).

Bottom line, the small screen on the 355 need not be an issue plus it’s affordable to add redundancy with the panel mounted handhelds.

I’m planning on adding a couple of AV30-C displays to my Tri-Pacer because they will interface with my Garmin 300XL and I understand Garmin’s own 275 units will not. DT