IFR or VFR?

Discussion in 'Flight Following' started by Jon Weiswasser, Jun 17, 2021.

  1. Jon Weiswasser

    Jon Weiswasser Pre-takeoff checklist

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    For those of you flying uber high performance planes, do you ever fly VFR? In my Meridian I was taught basically to always fly with a clearance. Yet, and especially when flying in the NE, I've found that it is better all around sometimes to go VFR with advisories to be able to stay higher longer, go faster, burn less gas, and avoid slogging around at 4000' with traffic. Here's a Fastlane episode which details this and some of the challenges of doing it in a Piper Meridian.
     
  2. EdFred

    EdFred Taxi to Parking

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    There's a lot of altitudes between 4000' and 17,500.
     
  3. Plano Pilot

    Plano Pilot Line Up and Wait

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  4. William Pete Hodges

    William Pete Hodges Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Jon, this is the first one of your videos I've seen. I like the way you think! I'll be looking up more of them. Thanks for sharing!
     
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  5. Arnold

    Arnold Cleared for Takeoff

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    Hey John, Miss Lucy and Walker Blue playing again soon?
     
  6. mondtster

    mondtster En-Route

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    Yes, I fly VFR in high performance airplanes all the time.

    An instrument rating and flying IFR is a tool that has an appropriate place and time to use, and it isn’t 100% of the time.
     
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  7. Racerx

    Racerx Line Up and Wait

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    Definitely need a subforum for the YouTubers.
     
  8. Clip4

    Clip4 Final Approach

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    As with most things in aviation, the decision is part risk management.
     
  9. MountainDude

    MountainDude Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Your middle screen is too small. :)
     
  10. jordane93

    jordane93 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    At my regional, we had one of our jets go VFR from JFK to LGA on a reposition flight. Storms just passed and everything was backed up. Instead of waiting for the airspace to clear up, the crew just departed VFR. Sometimes it’s better just to go VFR.
     
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  11. midlifeflyer

    midlifeflyer Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Nah. Unless the discussion centers on video and editing techniques, most of the YouTube based questions I see raise interesting aviation issues.
     
  12. midlifeflyer

    midlifeflyer Touchdown! Greaser!

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    @Jon Weiswasser, good to see you and the band back on the...ummm...road.
     
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  13. EdFred

    EdFred Taxi to Parking

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    But it's not really a discussion, it's a "hey look at my channel." Without watching the video, there's no way to discuss it. Maybe if they posted a transcript below the video...
     
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  14. Rgbeard

    Rgbeard Pattern Altitude

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    the Management council needs to hear this.
     
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  15. UngaWunga

    UngaWunga Pattern Altitude

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    I'm going to write a letter to my senator!
     
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  16. Jon Weiswasser

    Jon Weiswasser Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Sorry you feel that way. Truly! I actually thought that this was an interesting topic for discussion and that the video was salient to that. To be honest, the video is entirely secondary as I framed the discussion in the paragraph before the video. The point is raised and discussion can ensue without having to watch the video, but the video enhances the point.

    If I didnt have a youtube channel (which, BTW, isnt monetized and I dont make a DIME off of) and I asked a question about how to properly execute a hammerhead and included a short video of me attempting one in my RV-8, would you have voiced the same complaint?

    To the others, thanks for the responses. Im glad to know that VFR in the high teens isnt just a part 91 thing and that it can be thought of as a serious option. I did it the other day coming from boston to NJ - it cut about 25 minutes of time and let me stay above some unpleasant turbulence. Nice to have that in the toolbox.

    And yes, Eaglemania is back in full form.
     
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  17. EdFred

    EdFred Taxi to Parking

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    I go to YouTube for videos, I come here for text/discussion. So yeah, when I see a topic I'm interested in on here, I click on the thread, and then it's a poster-owned video that contains more information than the thread, I am not a fan. I don't want to have to go to yt, watch a however long it is video by the poster in order to have a discussion. Monetized or not isn't the issue.
     
  18. Stephen Shore

    Stephen Shore Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Jon - keep posting your videos here. I enjoy the others that do the same. It alerts me to some interesting topics and content that I would otherwise miss.

    I have very little trouble scanning the titles in the posts to find ones I am interested in. If some readers don't want to watch a video and join the discussion - feel free not to. Not sure why they feel obligated to participate.

    Anyone can tell by my number of posts that I usually choose not to participate.

    BTW - your videos are unique and always interesting. And...your airplane (both of them) are awesome.
     
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  19. Wrench978

    Wrench978 Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Down here in Puerto Rico, we have PC12s that go from SJU to TFFJ (St Barths) and 17,500, and come back at 16,500. they are almost always VFR unless the weather doesnt cooperate
     
  20. William Pete Hodges

    William Pete Hodges Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Jon,
    As far as I see, you have done nothing wrong here. You asked an aviation question and included a video as a reference. Lots of other POA'ers do the same thing all the time. I searched your post history and looked at the first one you posted. It is easy compared to searching YouTube. I'll be looking at more of them as time permits.

    I have a personal code that I use here at POA. 1. I try to comment only when I have something meaningful to add. 2. I stay on topic. 3. I refrain from negative comments as much as possible.

    You have spent a great deal of time and effort to create meaningful aviation videos that are presented in a high quality and professional manner. (I wish I could do my videos as well as you.) These videos have aviation and life reality mixed together and are interesting to pilots and non pilots (if other parts of the video are interesting to them). These videos are positive in nature and tell a story as it happened. They also explain in a unique way what a pilot does both in the air and on the ground before the flight, and how real life pressures affect flying go/no-go decisions.

    I hope you continue making these and keep sharing them with us. Keep asking questions. Keep them meaningful. Keep them on topic. Keep them positive. Well done!
     
  21. Groundpounder

    Groundpounder Pattern Altitude

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    Love your videos Jon, don't listen to the hater(s).

    I used to fly a PC-12 in the northeast, and I would go VFR any time I could. Always a big time saver, especially from the cape and the islands to the NY metro airports. I've even flown the Challenger I fly now VFR from TEB to BED when a lone thunderstorm shut down our departure gate. Familiarity with the airspace is a big help, especially with NYC controllers, but I'd imagine you've gotten that down pretty good by now.
     
  22. Rushie

    Rushie Pattern Altitude

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    We flew uber low performance planes and almost always were on an IFR plan. And I didn’t even watch the video to make this comment. Clicking on a thread to find it contains a YT video doesn’t force me to watch it. Imagine that.
     
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  23. luvflyin

    luvflyin Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    What’s that thing above your right knee? Some sticky thing to keep things you put there from sliding around? If so, where did you get it? I used to be Controller at Los Angeles Center. High performance planes VFR up in the teens plus five was common.
     
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2021
  24. Racerx

    Racerx Line Up and Wait

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    I'm not hating. Just stating my opinion that there should be another section for guys to post their videos is all. Would it not be more convenient for those that want to see videos look in a video section?
     
  25. N1120A

    N1120A Pattern Altitude

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    I'm fine with the YTers posting their videos and the OP had a perfectly legitimate, interesting question.

    I know Cirrus drivers who freak out if they need to fly VFR, so a Meridian pilot wondering about how often people in more powerful machines are using VFR to save time and money isn't something weird.
     
  26. luvflyin

    luvflyin Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Hmm. I never thought of it as some folk just want to see videos. Like already said, some videos have very legitimate aviation instructional content. Ones that would be at home in one of the existing forums such as Flight Following, Cleared for the Approach etc. So, Admins, can ya write some code to duplicate videos? Leave the one posted where it is and copy it into a new Videos forum. Folk who don’t like videos can just not click on it when cruising general forums. Folk who want to watch videos for the sake of watching videos can go to videos.
     
  27. bluerooster

    bluerooster Pattern Altitude

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    Yes, I figure an IR is kinda like 4 wheel drive. Go in on 2 wheel, use 4 wheel to get out if need be. If you go in with 4 wheel and get all 4 spinning, your stuck. That said, I've never been in an "uber High performance" aircraft. Fastest thing I've flown was a Cessna T-50, and did it all VFR. By todays standards it was slow, and burned a lot of gas. But, sure was fun, and a lot faster than my Cherokee.
     
  28. benyflyguy

    benyflyguy En-Route

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    Live in NE. There’s a guy at our field that flies a king air that blasts off VFR all the time and goes direct at 17,500. Saves a lot of time and be routing around.
     
  29. coma24

    coma24 Line Up and Wait

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    Jon, so glad you're back again! The context in which you post your videos seems entirely appropriate to me. We need to get lunch at The Fine Grind again now that the madness has subsided!

    Re: VFR vs IFR for higher performance GA aircraft, I can really only see a strong argument for IFR for planes which are considerably more efficient in the flight levels. I don't have any turboprop time, so I don't know if 17.5k is considerably less efficient than FL230, for example, however, assuming FL230 is only slightly more efficient, I can absolutely imagine it being a wash, or still +1 for VFR when you consider the route efficiencies and altitude flexibility that VFR brings.

    For a normally-aspirated piston, it's a no-brainer....I'll take VFR all day long if the WX supports it. Other than that, there are a spectrum of options from filing IFR, picking it up on the ground, including a release, to the same thing, but with a VFR departure, to filing IFR from an airport not far from where I anticipate needing the clearance, to just calling for a pop-up IFR. I've used all of those techniques many times, and they all have their place. However, to answer the very specific question of VFR vs IFR on a day when end to end VFR is possible, then that's what I'm going to do pretty much every time at this point. Back in the day when I was becoming comfortable with flying in the system, I filed IFR every time until I found I wasn't learning much new on each flight.
     
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