If They Can Make a GoPro Waterproof Using a Simple Gasket...

Discussion in 'Hangar Talk' started by RJM62, Nov 25, 2018.

  1. RJM62

    RJM62 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    ... then why do cell phone manufacturers claim that the reason they're permanently sealing the batteries in all the newer phones is to make them more water-resistant? My GoPro has a removable battery, and it's spent more time under water than out of it, using only a simple gasket as the seal. I can't think of any good reason that wouldn't work just as well on a phone.

    My hunch is that cell phone manufacturers are full of ****, and that the real reason they seal the batteries in is because they want to force new purchases when the batteries don't hold an adequate charge after 18 months or so.

    Rich
     
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  2. DaleB

    DaleB En-Route

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    I believe you are correct for half the answer. The other half is, people want the thinnest possible phone, and one resistant to doing dumb things like dropping it repeatedly. Not having a case that can open to replace rhe battery means you can make the entire case structural.

    You CAN replace batteries in phones and tablets. It just takes time, a heat gun, and more effort.
     
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  3. RJM62

    RJM62 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    That's becoming less true.

    I have a friend in the cell phone business who says that some of the very latest phone designs no longer have rectangular batteries that are easily-replaced once you heat up the phone to disassemble it. The batteries have bizarre, irregular shapes that wrap around, are wrapped around by, or are integral to the mainboards, making it almost impossible to remove them without destroying the phones. I guess when they have warranty claims, they just replace the whole insides or swap out the phones.

    Rich
     
  4. RJM62

    RJM62 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Besides, almost no phones meet the IEC IP x8 standards for water ingress, and very few meet even the x7 standard.

    Rich
     
  5. Dana

    Dana Line Up and Wait

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    But note that while GoPros are advertised as being waterproof, their warranty specifically excludes water damage... :confused2:
     
  6. DaleB

    DaleB En-Route

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    Not surprising. They're not in the business of producing easy to service devices. They're in the business of selling as many as possible, produced as cheaply as possible. Marketing specs reign supreme and no other factors are given even the slightest consideration, I'm sure.
     
  7. RJM62

    RJM62 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Well, I just ordered another LG V20 (the last high-end phone with a replaceable battery) to have as a spare or to assign to the next person on my account who needs a phone. If they don't like it, they can pay for their own.

    That'll teach their marketing departments a thing or two.

    So there.

    Rich
     
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  8. 172andyou

    172andyou Line Up and Wait

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    Or, rephrashed: They make the sexy looking products people want, because phones with replaceable batteries, multiple sims, etc did not survive the free market hunger games. All of those things used to exist, but people didn't buy them. They bought slim and light.

    Yup. I personally would pay a nice premium for an iPhone with two sim slots. Guess there aren't enough people like me.
     
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  9. Sluggo63

    Sluggo63 Line Up and Wait

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    The newest iPhones have the capability of dual SIMs. One physical SIM and one eSIM. This feature is turned on in the latest iOS update, but providers are being slow to roll it out. Or you can buy the newest iPhone from China, it has two physical SIM slots, since eSIMS are illegal there.

    Don’t ask me why Apple just didn’t release the two physical SIM slots phones world wide, since they are already producing them for the People’s Republic.
     
  10. RJM62

    RJM62 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    That extra SIM slot probably costs them at least $0.08. Maybe even $0.10.

    Rich
     
  11. Zeldman

    Zeldman Touchdown! Greaser!

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    So, I should keep my first smart phone then..??

    [​IMG]
     
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  12. cowman

    cowman En-Route PoA Supporter

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    I don't know why that's a problem. The phone will go obsolete long before the battery should give out.
     
  13. asicer

    asicer En-Route

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    Yeah, but how much for the second radio?
     
  14. genna

    genna Cleared for Takeoff

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    Disagree. It depends on how it’s being used. Just like computers before, flagship phones have become powerful enough to last quite a few years and OS upgrades. iPhone 5s is still pretty usable, but if you bought it new when first released, you would be on second or third battery by now. My 1yo 8 is expected to be in service for at least 3 more years

    As phones are becoming increasingly expensive, more people keep them longer too
     
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  15. RJM62

    RJM62 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    There is no second radio. It's DSDS.

    Rich
     
  16. RJM62

    RJM62 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    There's also been a marked flattening of the functionality improvement curve in recent years. In terms of the functionality that most people use most often, today's flagship phones aren't all that different from those of three or four years ago. Most of the current crop's improvements, in my opinion, are more gimmickry than anything else; and to me, the gimmicks don't justify the price -- especially when easy battery replacement is an option.

    Using the LG V20 as an example, the original price for the AT&T-branded model was $829.00 without subsidies. The AT&T-branded model of LG's current flagship phone, the V40 ThinQ, lists for $949.00. The V40 sports six cores vs four, a 2.8 GHz processor vs a 2.15 GHz processor, 6 GB of RAM vs 4 GB, a slightly larger screen, and slightly better cameras (and more of them). So there are some actual hardware differences that probably justify the higher base price -- if a user is actually going to make use of those improvements.

    For more average users who happen to already own a V20, however, it's questionable, at best, whether the differences between the V20 and the V40 justify laying out $949.00 for a new V40 versus spending between $15.00 and $39.00 for replacement batteries for their V20s. Genuine replacement batteries for the V20 cost $39.00 directly from LG, or about $15.00 from unquestionably trustworthy third-party sellers. Are the V40's functionality improvements worth spending $949.00 compared to spending $39.00 for even the most-expensive replacement battery option?

    For that matter, does the V40's functionality improvements over the V20 justify buying a new V40 versus an "old"-stock, new-in-box, AT&T-branded V20 for ~$230.00? Does the V40 offer more than 400 percent the capabilities of the V20 for average users?

    I suppose for some users, it does. There are people who use their phones for resource-intensive tasks like audio or video editing, or who need cutting-edge cameras because they use their phones for professional photography. Maybe for those folks the enhanced hardware will make a big difference.

    But what about for the rest of us who use our phones for talking, texting, occasional navigation, and the odd selfie once in a while? Will we ever sufficiently exploit the possibilities of the improved hardware to justify a $949.00 expenditure versus a $15.00 to $39.00 expenditure for a new battery?

    It's all a racket, as far as I'm concerned. With the sole exception of users who need phones that are actually waterproof (as in meeting IEC IP standards x1 though x8, which only a tiny fraction of current phones actually meet), there's really no good reason, from the consumer's perspective, to make a battery non user-replaceable. As I mentioned earlier, I'm not even sure that a truly-waterproof phone with a removable battery couldn't be built using a simple gasket and a tight-fitting battery door.

    But for manufacturers who want to sell phones, this new twist on the time-dishonored tactic of planned obsolescence makes perfect sense; and unfortunately, as long as consumers are too passive and stupid to refuse to go along with it, the manufacturers will continue to get away with it.

    Rich
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2018
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  17. wayne

    wayne Cleared for Takeoff

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    Define "obsolete".

    My S8 is still running great, except for the battery. The battery isn't bad yet, but it's noticeably running lower quicker. I may be tempted to get the S10 this spring solely because of the battery. Otherwise I might just stick with the S8 longer. I went from the S5 to the S8, and the S5 was definitely getting slower at the end; bigger apps requiring more CPU and doing more background work. My BIL still has a S5. :eek: Of course he uses it mostly as a phone. o_O Worse, he'll set it down on Friday after getting home and not pick it up again until Monday. :confused: I use mine as a highly portable computer with a phone app and have it with me all the time; except when sleeping; I charge it in another room so it doesn't disturb me or my wife (who is a light sleeper).
     
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  18. Bill Jennings

    Bill Jennings Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    My 6s still does everything I need, runs everthing just fine. But, the battery is dying, so I bought a kit from iFixit, and will do surgery this week to replace.
     
  19. Lindberg

    Lindberg En-Route

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    LG in particular has stopped doing anything new because it isn't making any money on phones. It's likely in the same death spiral that numerous other phone makers that aren't Samsung or Apple have gone through.
     
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  20. dennisc172

    dennisc172 Pre-Flight

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    I just had the battery in my 7 replaced for only $29 at the Apple store. They have this lower pricing till end of the year.. because of all the "reduced performance" issues a few months ago. For $29 I don't want to do it myself risking to break the whole thing :). Good to go for at least 1.5 to 2 years.
     
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  21. Bill Jennings

    Bill Jennings Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    There's only two local Apple repair centers, and they're both booked solid. They're so busy they won't even answer the phone.
     
  22. dennisc172

    dennisc172 Pre-Flight

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    Try in the mornings to schedule (online) the latest day in the schedule... I had this same issue but when I finally got a slot at 12:00 they were able to fix it before 16:30 !
     
  23. Bill Jennings

    Bill Jennings Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    I keep trying, but the closest place with any availability for repair is 85 miles one way.
     
  24. bnt83

    bnt83 Final Approach PoA Supporter

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    BTDT, not too bad of a job, I do them with one hand.
     
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  25. RJM62

    RJM62 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    That's the biggest thing that prevents me from using Apple computers. PCs I can fix myself. People used to pay me to fix theirs. Macs, not so much.

    The fact that the nearest repair centers are all 2+ hours away in different directions doesn't help, either. If I were younger, I might get competent and certified for Apple stuff and see about getting this territory.

    Rich
     
  26. CC268

    CC268 Final Approach

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    I replaced the battery in my iPhone 6S Plus for $29 at the Apple store. Wasn’t a big deal.
     
  27. Bill Jennings

    Bill Jennings Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    If you can get in. We have two replacement centers servicing a population center of 600,000. Good luck!
     
  28. CC268

    CC268 Final Approach

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    Get in? You make an appointment and go to your local Apple store. Took me 30 mins
     
  29. Bill Jennings

    Bill Jennings Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    No matter if I go to the store web sites or used the online scheduler from the battery section of settings, the result is the same. No available appointments for as far as they publish the schedule. They're just under servicing the market.

    EDIT: If it weren't for foreflight, I'd ditch Apple. I used to be Android, did Apple for the last two phones, but I'm ready to go back as I'm tired of their shtick.
     
  30. CC268

    CC268 Final Approach

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    Wow that’s really odd. I just went online just out of curiosity. Tons of appointments all over the Phoenix area. Have you called them? I find their support is generally very good.

    I have no qualms with Android. I was a hardcore Android guy for many years and I used to be very involved with rooting Android phones, custom ROMs, kernels, etc. It was a lot of fun. I spent a lot of time trying to make my Android phones very minimalistic (much like Apple or like the Google phones which run vanilla Android).

    The reality is I like Apple, Android, and PCs - all for different purposes. When it comes to desktops I am still very much a PC guy (I built a top of the line $3000 desktop a few years back and it has been fantastic). I have a Surface Pro 2 which I’ve really enjoyed over the past few years. That said I really do like the Macbook Pros as well.
     
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  31. Bill Jennings

    Bill Jennings Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    4D80D1F6-F813-490B-B713-A4CAE439C956.png 709D95A2-E0AB-4474-8BA9-DE976CA19A3E.png F4854A05-6E06-437D-9B4C-DABD94EB9836.png

    I've been checking for weeks, the local providers never have openings. Right now, the nearest provider with an opening is 97 miles away.
     
  32. CC268

    CC268 Final Approach

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    That’s a shame. Not sure how to help ya. Guess you’ll have to replace it yourself.
     
  33. RJM62

    RJM62 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    I replaced the battery in my V20 for $14.99 in my office. It was even less of a big deal.

    (Although I will say that $29.00 isn't horrible.)

    Rich
     
  34. slacktide

    slacktide Line Up and Wait

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    I have a 5s. I bought it on release day. It still has the original battery.
     
  35. DaleB

    DaleB En-Route

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    My 5s started swelling in the middle a couple years in. I have a 7 now... corporate phone. Our only choice is the iPhone, otherwise I’d go back to Android. Kinda over the whole iPhone thing.
     
  36. genna

    genna Cleared for Takeoff

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    It’s not impossible. Just rare. Depends on your use and some luck. Also on how bothered you are with lower charge capacity
     
  37. asicer

    asicer En-Route

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