High altitude airports

Flymeariver

Flymeariver

Pattern Altitude
Joined
Nov 22, 2013
Messages
1,866
Location
Delaware
Display Name
Display name:
Justin
What do y'all consider an high altitude airport? Being a flat lander that is looking to venture further out I am starting to look at destinations that are 1000-2100msl. Would those be considered high alt?
 
It probably depends somewhat on your purpose for asking the question. For example, are you trying to decide when you need to lean the mixture for takeoff?

The density altitude is more important than the MSL altitude. I would not consider 2100 MSL to be a particularly high altitude at standard temperature, but on a hot day, it would have the effect of a higher altitude.
 
Last edited:
Palmpilot said:
It probably depends somewhat on your purpose for asking the question. For example, are you trying to decide when you need to lean the mixture for takeoff?

By the way, the density altitude is more important than the MSL altitude.
Click to expand...

Sorry----yep, mixture settings are my biggest concern. Its showing to be -14c tomorrow so I imagine the DA will be lower than field elevation.
 
Let's put it this way.

I had to lean for takeoff in a 182 at Fresno in August. Full rich was obviously WAY under max power. KFAT field elevation is about 400 MSL, and summer temperatures are stupid hot (unless you live in Blythe, Las Vegas, or Phoenix).
 
Last edited:
Flymeariver said:
Sorry----yep, mixture settings are my biggest concern. Its showing to be -14c tomorrow so I imagine the DA will be lower than field elevation.
Click to expand...

Your POH may say at what altitude you should lean for takeoff. If so, I would use density altitude in making the determination.
 
As MAKG points out, density altitude considerations aren't the monopoly of airports with high msl altitude.

But as a general proposition, IMO you should be considering the effects of density altitude if you are going to airports that are going to be above 1,000 msl. It's not just about leaning for takeoff.
 
Flagstaff at 7,000 is what I consider to be the start of high altitude around me.
 
We're high in Denver.














:D
Sorry, just couldn't resist
 
I start worrying about the FE when the runways are shorter than normal. Otherwise, I couldn't care less.
 
midlifeflyer said:
Thanks. You pick up a few things flying and instructing in Colorado. :wink2:
Click to expand...

Well, they DO teach us about altitude's effects on aircraft performance here in California, whose highest point is higher than Colorado's highest point. :wink2:
 
Id say about 4000' is where you start noticing LESS power on takeoff when you don't lean.
 
The Navy flying club I learned at required a checkout before you went to an airport >3,000', FWIW.
 
Meh, over 6,000 MSL
 
Lycoming documentation uses 5000 MSL (ground, cruise, whatever) as the minimum to lean for altitude in a non-turbo engine.
 
Thanks guys for the info, I figured I was just a noob :lol: I would say this is one down side to always staying in such low areas....seeing higher numbers get the mind wandering.
 
Sheesh... Really???
Density altitude will matter differently in every type, and then depending upon weight. To give a one figure fits all is silly. Some have suggested an altitude. Ridiculous. In YOUR airplane that may be a non event, OR, It may be a huge event well before that altitude. Know your airplane. If there is ever any doubt simply run the numbers. Your numbers are different than the guy next to you in the FBO.

Although we do the process differently, we check every takeoff and every landing. Have done so for the past 20 years in 135/121 flying.
 
Kritchlow said:
Sheesh... Really???
Density altitude will matter differently in every type, and then depending upon weight. To give a one figure fits all is silly. Some have suggested an altitude. Ridiculous. In YOUR airplane that may be a non event, OR, It may be a huge event well before that altitude. Know your airplane. If there is ever any doubt simply run the numbers. Your numbers are different than the guy next to you in the FBO.

Although we do the process differently, we check every takeoff and every landing. Have done so for the past 20 years in 135/121 flying.
Click to expand...
You are, of course, correct. I recall learning making adjustments for density altitude in a 152 at a 243 msl altitude airport in Connecticut when I was a newly-minted private pilot.

OTOH, the question invites altitude answers.
 
Palmpilot said:
Well, they DO teach us about altitude's effects on aircraft performance here in California, whose highest point is higher than Colorado's highest point. :wink2:
Click to expand...

Very true...but the discussion is about airports. Even the backcountry strips in Coolorado are higher.
 
Since my house is at the 6000' level, I think there is only ONE airport in the entire country the qualifies as HIGH ALTITUDE ---> KLXV

During the normal flying season, one rarely sees density altitudes below 8500', so the air has to be higher than that to raise eyebrows, never mind concerns
 
Last edited:
murphey said:
Very true...but the discussion is about airports. Even the backcountry strips in Coolorado are higher.
Click to expand...

Not every CA airport is at sea level. There are several in the Sierra that require mountain techniques, some of them with not-so-long runways. There are quite a few that require moderate DA techniques in summer.
 
Scottsdale on a hot summer afternoon in a 172
 
MAKG1 said:
Not every CA airport is at sea level. There are several in the Sierra that require mountain techniques, some of them with not-so-long runways. There are quite a few that require moderate DA techniques in summer.
Click to expand...

Lee Vining comes to mind.

Lee%20Vining%20Airport%201.jpg


Mammoth Yosemite and South Lake Tahoe can be interesting even with their long runways.
 
CharlieTango said:
Lee Vining comes to mind.

Lee%20Vining%20Airport%201.jpg


Mammoth Yosemite and South Lake Tahoe can be interesting even with their long runways.
Click to expand...
My high altitude checkout in CA, while I was still getting my private, was to South Lake Tahoe and some other airports I don't remember. My flying club was very concerned about mountain flying because they had a fatal on Kearsarge Pass a few months before I started taking lessons there.
 
Everskyward said:
My high altitude checkout in CA, while I was still getting my private, was to South Lake Tahoe and some other airports I don't remember. My flying club was very concerned about mountain flying because they had a fatal on Kearsarge Pass a few months before I started taking lessons there.
Click to expand...

Which club did you learn at?
 
Everskyward said:
University of California Flying Club, based at KOAK.

The accident I was referring to was this one.

http://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.a...a38d-4e12-86d8-e6b1a9088a46&pgno=2&pgsize=100

The survivor wrote a book, there was a made for TV movie, and weirdly, the LA Times wrote an article about it as late as 2006.

http://articles.latimes.com/2006/may/07/local/me-then7
Click to expand...

Ha...

That was a LONG time ago... Even I remember walking into a FSS and getting a briefing...


NTSB Identification: OAK76AP051
14 CFR Part 91 General Aviation
Aircraft: CESSNA 182P, registration: N52855

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
FILE DATE LOCATION AIRCRAFT DATA INJURIES FLIGHT PILOT DATA
F S M/N PURPOSE
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
3-1445 76/4/26 NR.INDEPENDENCE,CA CESSNA 182P CR- 1 0 0 NONCOMMERCIAL PRIVATE, AGE 36, 213
TIME - 1315 N52855 PX- 1 1 0 PLEASURE/PERSONAL TRANSP TOTAL HOURS, 46 IN TYPE,
DAMAGE-SUBSTANTIAL OT- 0 0 0 NOT INSTRUMENT RATED.
DEPARTURE POINT INTENDED DESTINATION
OAKLAND,CA FURNACE CREEK,CA
TYPE OF ACCIDENT PHASE OF OPERATION
COLLISION WITH GROUND/WATER: CONTROLLED IN FLIGHT: NORMAL CRUISE
PROBABLE CAUSE(S)
PILOT IN COMMAND - CONTINUED FLIGHT INTO KNOWN AREAS OF SEVERE TURBULENCE
WEATHER - DOWNDRAFT,UPDRAFTS
PILOT IN COMMAND - IMPROPER IN-FLIGHT DECISIONS OR PLANNING
FACTOR(S)
WEATHER - HIGH DENSITY ALTITUDE
TERRAIN - HIGH OBSTRUCTIONS
WEATHER BRIEFING - BRIEFED BY FLIGHT SERVICE PERSONNEL, IN PERSON
WEATHER FORECAST - FORECAST SUBSTANTIALLY CORRECT
SKY CONDITION CEILING AT ACCIDENT SITE
CLEAR UNLIMITED
VISIBILITY AT ACCIDENT SITE PRECIPITATION AT ACCIDENT SITE
5 OR OVER(UNLIMITED) NONE
OBSTRUCTIONS TO VISION AT ACCIDENT SITE TYPE OF WEATHER CONDITIONS
NONE VFR
TYPE OF FLIGHT PLAN
NONE
REMARKS- FLT IN KNOWN TURB COND BLO MTN RIDGES.
 
N801BH said:
Ha...

That was a LONG time ago... Even I remember walking into a FSS and getting a briefing...


NTSB Identification: OAK76AP051
14 CFR Part 91 General Aviation
Aircraft: CESSNA 182P, registration: N52855

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
FILE DATE LOCATION AIRCRAFT DATA INJURIES FLIGHT PILOT DATA
F S M/N PURPOSE
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
3-1445 76/4/26 NR.INDEPENDENCE,CA CESSNA 182P CR- 1 0 0 NONCOMMERCIAL PRIVATE, AGE 36, 213
TIME - 1315 N52855 PX- 1 1 0 PLEASURE/PERSONAL TRANSP TOTAL HOURS, 46 IN TYPE,
DAMAGE-SUBSTANTIAL OT- 0 0 0 NOT INSTRUMENT RATED.
DEPARTURE POINT INTENDED DESTINATION
OAKLAND,CA FURNACE CREEK,CA
TYPE OF ACCIDENT PHASE OF OPERATION
COLLISION WITH GROUND/WATER: CONTROLLED IN FLIGHT: NORMAL CRUISE
PROBABLE CAUSE(S)
PILOT IN COMMAND - CONTINUED FLIGHT INTO KNOWN AREAS OF SEVERE TURBULENCE
WEATHER - DOWNDRAFT,UPDRAFTS
PILOT IN COMMAND - IMPROPER IN-FLIGHT DECISIONS OR PLANNING
FACTOR(S)
WEATHER - HIGH DENSITY ALTITUDE
TERRAIN - HIGH OBSTRUCTIONS
WEATHER BRIEFING - BRIEFED BY FLIGHT SERVICE PERSONNEL, IN PERSON
WEATHER FORECAST - FORECAST SUBSTANTIALLY CORRECT
SKY CONDITION CEILING AT ACCIDENT SITE
CLEAR UNLIMITED
VISIBILITY AT ACCIDENT SITE PRECIPITATION AT ACCIDENT SITE
5 OR OVER(UNLIMITED) NONE
OBSTRUCTIONS TO VISION AT ACCIDENT SITE TYPE OF WEATHER CONDITIONS
NONE VFR
TYPE OF FLIGHT PLAN
NONE
REMARKS- FLT IN KNOWN TURB COND BLO MTN RIDGES.
Click to expand...
So do I. Oakland had an on-field FSS. I even remember the teletype machines...
 
Everskyward said:
University of California Flying Club, based at KOAK.

The accident I was referring to was this one.

http://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.a...a38d-4e12-86d8-e6b1a9088a46&pgno=2&pgsize=100

The survivor wrote a book, there was a made for TV movie, and weirdly, the LA Times wrote an article about it as late as 2006.

http://articles.latimes.com/2006/may/07/local/me-then7
Click to expand...


I remember watching that movie!

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0078775/?ref_=fn_al_tt_1

I actually think about that movie anytime I'm flying around/over tall rocks.

Highest elevation field I ever flew from was a bit more than 8k MSL.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bamyan_Airport

attachment.php



attachment.php


Actually, there might be one or two higher that I've flown from. This was the most scenic though.
 

Attachments

  • IMG_3744.JPG
    IMG_3744.JPG
    221.9 KB · Views: 67
  • IMG_4762.JPG
    IMG_4762.JPG
    189.6 KB · Views: 64
midlifeflyer said:
You are, of course, correct. I recall learning making adjustments for density altitude in a 152 at a 243 msl altitude airport in Connecticut when I was a newly-minted private pilot.

OTOH, the question invites altitude answers.
Click to expand...

Mark, I agree with your posts almost always, BUT... 7B9 was 253 feet.. Lol!! :D
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top