Cessna 150H Purchase

Discussion in 'Flight Following' started by Wesley Bryant, Nov 8, 2018.

?

Is it worth it?

  1. Yes

    21.1%
  2. No

    68.4%
  3. Ill explain below!

    10.5%
  1. Wesley Bryant

    Wesley Bryant Filing Flight Plan

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2018
    Messages:
    13
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    MetroMedic
    I am looking at purchasing a Cessna 150H.
    Aviation financing is horrendously difficult to obtain for low priced models and this seller is willing to do owner carried financing. Just because hes willing to do it, doesn't mean I'm just going to jump ship and purchase the thing. It doesn't look horrible for its age and I think it would be a great first purchase. I know the specs are as follows:

    Make: Cessna Aircraft Company
    Model:150H
    Year:1968

    Registration Number:
    N22462

    Serial Number:
    15068298

    TTAF:5462

    Engine SMOH:1618

    Prop SMOH:528

    Time Before Overhaul:182***

    Compression 1:75 / 80
    Compression 2:76 / 80
    Compression 3:70 / 80***
    Compression 4:76 / 80

    Annual Inspection:02-02-2017***

    Paint Condition:6 / 10
    Interior Condition:6 / 10

    Engine Manufacture:Continental
    Engine Model:O-200A

    Prop Manufacture:McCauley
    Prop Model:1A100/MCM6948

    It does have a crash history back in 1971 with "substantial damage," but I believe that has since cleared up over the last 40 years!

    They are willing to sell it for $15,000.00

    Whats everyone's thoughts?

    I know you can see it here jetcentermfrcom/current-listing/1968-cessna-150h/
     
  2. teejayevans

    teejayevans Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2013
    Messages:
    1,936
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Tom
    If you need to finance a $15,000 airplane, you’re not ready to buy. What happens when engine needs to be overhauled or other large maintenance expense?
    1600+ SMOH that’s likely be sooner than later.
    Given the condition and hours , $15,000 seems pricey to me.
    And your link doesn’t work.
     
    Todd82 and Grum.Man like this.
  3. Wesley Bryant

    Wesley Bryant Filing Flight Plan

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2018
    Messages:
    13
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    MetroMedic
    jetcentermfr.com/current-listing/1968-cessna-150h/

    Let me know if that works and your further thoughts.
     
  4. Wesley Bryant

    Wesley Bryant Filing Flight Plan

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2018
    Messages:
    13
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    MetroMedic
    For younger pilots, such as myself, I can only save up so much haha.
     
    woodchucker likes this.
  5. 3393RP

    3393RP Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2012
    Messages:
    1,768
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    3393RP
    It's funny how responses to asking for opinions about the price and advisability of buying a particular aircraft attract admonitions about financing the aircraft purchase.
     
  6. 3393RP

    3393RP Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2012
    Messages:
    1,768
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    3393RP
    If the owner is willing to finance the deal and you insure the aircraft against loss, it's a path to ownership that should be considered.

    You're the only one who knows if it's a good idea. It looks like a nice little airplane.

    If your post attracts the attention of a POA member in the area, he or she might be able to point you in the direction of a mechanic who could inspect the aircraft and render an opinion about its condition.
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2018
  7. Wesley Bryant

    Wesley Bryant Filing Flight Plan

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2018
    Messages:
    13
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    MetroMedic
    He’s willing to do so, I’m willing to insure it. I just really want to get into aviation and I’ve been told time and time again that an entry plane is the way to go for hours. I definitely want to do it, I just don’t want to purchase a “bad plane.” I want something that’s not exorbitant, but will last me a little while till I can upgrade down the line.
     
  8. 3393RP

    3393RP Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2012
    Messages:
    1,768
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    3393RP
    My advice is to first make sure you can get a medical certificate without any issues. Things in your past like an ADHD diagnosis, depression, or a DUI can make it very difficult to obtain one.

    Go to the medical topics forum and do a search for these subjects.
     
    Kenny Phillips likes this.
  9. Wesley Bryant

    Wesley Bryant Filing Flight Plan

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2018
    Messages:
    13
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    MetroMedic
    I have my second class, so I’m good in that department.
     
    3393RP likes this.
  10. vman

    vman Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2018
    Messages:
    235
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    vman
    5QK likes this.
  11. Grum.Man

    Grum.Man Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2014
    Messages:
    1,935
    Location:
    Statesville NC
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Grum.Man
    Seems too pricey for me as well. While I have no opinion on financing I will caution that if you don't have reserves for the annual that is due in 3 months then you might want to hold off. At today's interest rates it makes sense to finance large purchases to have the free cash. If you can't drop 5k after the purchase for unexpected expenses you will have a financed airport monument. Sometimes you get lucky but often you don't. You can get better deals on the 2 seat Grumman's or even some decent Cherokee 140's for under 20k.
     
    PilotRPI likes this.
  12. midwestpa24

    midwestpa24 Line Up and Wait

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2016
    Messages:
    850
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    midwestpa24
    Reason being is $15,000 is not a lot of money in the aviation world. There are a lot of expenses involved in owning an airplane beyond the purchase price, and if you can't manage to save that amount of cash, you may be setting yourself up for problems. As the other poster noted, it has a high time engine, you had better have some money in reserve for when it goes, or else you will own a ramp queen. We say this because it happens, a lot. Gas, tie-down/hangar, insurance, maintenance are all going to cost the OP a lot more than $15,000 in the first couple years of ownership.

    There is a reason banks don't like small loans. They look at it as if you can't manage to save that small amount of money in a reasonable timeline, then you probably won't be able to pay the loan off plus interest. Its a red flag to a banker.
     
  13. benyflyguy

    benyflyguy Line Up and Wait

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2018
    Messages:
    804
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    benyflyguy
    Mission?? Building hours?? Just for fun??
     
  14. Ken Ibold

    Ken Ibold Final Approach

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2005
    Messages:
    5,837
    Location:
    Jacksonville, Florida
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Ken Ibold
    It is out of annual in the listing, with the comment of fresh annual on sale. To me, that is a major red flag as it states the seller places no value on the airplane, and at the very least it hasn't flown in 8 months. The owner *may* have detected an issue that affects airworthiness but that he has avoided fixing and *may* pencil whip that issue on during that "fresh annual." An annual completed by a seller at delivery should always be looked at with a little skepticism. At the very least, insist on an annual by an independent shop as a condition of sale. The seller is likely to balk. I would encourage you to stick to your guns.

    Here's why. Your funding constraints *may* encourage you to skip a pre-buy inspection to save a few hundred dollars. The aircraft *may* become unairworthy in a few months, and if you can't afford to fix it, the seller *may* helpfully take if off your hands and tear up the note. Then the seller *may* work the same deal with the next buyer to come along. This is not fiction. It happens more often than it should.
     
    Brad Smith likes this.
  15. mscard88

    mscard88 Ejection Handle Pulled

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2015
    Messages:
    23,226
    Location:
    Alabama
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Mark
    Eh, pot luck. I’d try to offer less. But $15K would pay for a lot of flight lessons. I realize you don’t actually have $15K lying around but as others have said, be prepared for some costly repairs. Planes aren’t like cars and trucks. Much more expensive to maintain.
     
  16. Ryanb

    Ryanb Final Approach PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2010
    Messages:
    7,860
    Location:
    Tennessee
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Ryan
    Agree. If you’re able to fold up tight enough to get into a 150, than go for it, but I’d probably hold out if it were me at the stands.

    I’d do some further research regarding aircraft ownership and what all it entails, before you get in over your head with something you can’t financially support in the long run.
     
  17. FastEddieB

    FastEddieB Final Approach

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2013
    Messages:
    8,694
    Location:
    Mineral Bluff, GA
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Fast Eddie B
    Any chance you could find someone to partner with?

    Dividing payments and inevitable repairs by two helps enormously.
     
  18. bnt83

    bnt83 Final Approach

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2012
    Messages:
    8,030
    Location:
    Lincoln NE
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Brian
    Can find out any history on the engine? If that crankshaft has 5000 hours on it I bet it will need a new one if you ever overhaul it. That's not chump change.
     
  19. bnt83

    bnt83 Final Approach

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2012
    Messages:
    8,030
    Location:
    Lincoln NE
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Brian
    With high time engine and no ADS-B out, I'm thinking more like $10k at the most.
     
    murphey likes this.
  20. Glenn D

    Glenn D Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2015
    Messages:
    134
    Location:
    Utah County
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Glenn D
  21. mscard88

    mscard88 Ejection Handle Pulled

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2015
    Messages:
    23,226
    Location:
    Alabama
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Mark
    Yea been in the BHM CL for weeks. I replied for more info twice and got no response. I think it’s just a BS post.

    Reminds of the time I saw a ‘62 Corvette for sale in a newspaper (remember those) in the 80s for like $1500. Said to myself this is BS but would always wonder what if I didn’t call. I did, lady answers the phone and says yeah, someone is playing a prank on us.
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2018
    Glenn D likes this.
  22. EppyGA

    EppyGA Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2009
    Messages:
    10,299
    Location:
    Hoschton, GA
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Let's Fly
    I say go for it and periodically you can post a spreadsheet of your current outlays for maintenance.
     
    Ryanb likes this.
  23. Dan Thomas

    Dan Thomas En-Route

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2008
    Messages:
    4,772
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Dan Thomas
    That right there. A thorough annual as a prebuy inspection. And I mean thorough. Minimize the nasty surprises later on. We've done that for customers and it works well.

    I'm trying to remember if the H model has the flat leaf main gear or the round gear. The '69 airplanes (J models) had the round gear. The flat leaf is corrosion-prone and they tend to crack and fail if the pitting is deep enough. There are no new gear legs and the junkyards know the value of good, uncorroded legs now. Cessna has an SID on it.
     
  24. Pilawt

    Pilawt Final Approach

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2005
    Messages:
    6,422
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Pilawt
    150H is the '68 model (I took my PPL checkride in a 150H in August 1968). The tubular main gear first appeared on the 150 with the 150L version (1971 model).

    Here's a '69 150J with the flat spring gear:

    cessna_150j_1708.jpg

    And the 1970 150K:

    cessna_150k_1708.jpg

    The 1971 150L (tubular gear, new cowl, extended dorsal):

    cessna_150l_1971.jpg
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2018
  25. Kenny Phillips

    Kenny Phillips Line Up and Wait

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2018
    Messages:
    732
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Kenny Phillips
    It appears that the plane is out of annual if that 2/2017 number is correct. So it's not airworthy. For that price I'd want a fresh annual.
     
  26. weilke

    weilke Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2010
    Messages:
    12,025
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    weilke
    What are you going to do for ADSB ?

    What happens if the note-holder forecloses on your plane after you made upgrades, overhauled the engine etc. ?
     
  27. frfly172

    frfly172 Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2008
    Messages:
    12,642
    Location:
    mass fla
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    ron keating
    If your using owner finance,have you considered how you would afford an overhaul,if it comes sooner rather than later? First find a good mechanic that you trust and do a prepurchase,or annual.
     
  28. Polarisguy

    Polarisguy Filing Flight Plan

    Joined:
    May 30, 2018
    Messages:
    10
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Polarisguy
    Have to agree on having to finance $15k.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
     
  29. texasclouds

    texasclouds Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2018
    Messages:
    258
    Location:
    Bryan, Texas
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Mark
    Looks clean, how long has he been trying to sell it?
     
  30. Wesley Bryant

    Wesley Bryant Filing Flight Plan

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2018
    Messages:
    13
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    MetroMedic
    It comes with a fresh annual. My biggest problem is securing financing as it’s difficult for cheaper aircraft. I wanted a piper but there are none in my area :(
     
  31. Wesley Bryant

    Wesley Bryant Filing Flight Plan

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2018
    Messages:
    13
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    MetroMedic
    From what I know, a few months now.
     
  32. Ken Ibold

    Ken Ibold Final Approach

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2005
    Messages:
    5,837
    Location:
    Jacksonville, Florida
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Ken Ibold
    Sounds like you have already talked yourself into it. I hope you have some financial backup if it goes south. Airplanes can become breathtakingly expensive in the blink of an eye. Please understand that. "Fresh annual" does not mean maintenance free. Good luck!
     
  33. Grum.Man

    Grum.Man Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2014
    Messages:
    1,935
    Location:
    Statesville NC
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Grum.Man
    Considered a personal loan? I doubt you can get 15k without having some decent assets or equity but it might get you closer if you can put 5-7k down.
     
  34. idahoflier

    idahoflier Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2017
    Messages:
    408
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    idahoflier
    What is your mission? Time building or just recreation?
     
  35. teejayevans

    teejayevans Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2013
    Messages:
    1,936
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Tom
    Because I don’t see him get in over his head, resulting in a bad experience, and resulting in another plane dying a slow death on a tie down because the owner could not afford to fix it.
    Either find a partner, a club, or rent. Or wait until you can afford to buy with cash.
    I would guess that the minimum required cash flow in order to maintain, insure, fuel, and tie down would be ~$5000/yr, minimum. So if can’t save enough in 2-3 years to buy with cash, no way can you afford the airplane.
     
  36. FlySince9

    FlySince9 En-Route

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2011
    Messages:
    2,576
    Location:
    Huntersville, NC
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Jerry
    Not to mention, I got the impression that he doesn't have his PPL yet
    So on top of all the stuff you list, there's the cost of training as well... I think the OP is putting the cart before the horse. For someone with the resources, buying an airplane to train in is a pretty good option. For a student, short on funds, maybe not so much...
     
    Ryanb likes this.
  37. Lachlan

    Lachlan Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2015
    Messages:
    2,379
    Location:
    North Creek, NY
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Lachlan
    As a 150 owner, I have to jump in here and say that maintaining/owning a 150 can be very affordable, and it can also be very expensive. There's not a lot of "stuff" to deal with; pretty straight forward little airplanes. BUT (I know, everything after "But" is BS) there are a few ADs that MUST be complied with, and a couple can be expensive for a brand new owner that doesn't have the $15,000 purchase price to drop on the airplane. Ok, let's say you've got $5,000 cash for things that pop up. And let's say you have a great mechanic that will teach you/mentor you/watch you/oversee your work, and let's presume you're pretty handy with a wrench and safety wire. That engine may be old since major, but how old are the cylinders? Don't pull one, or you'll be sending it out to have the rocker pivot bosses checked, unless you have the good cylinders already installed. Has that O-200 been running 100LL exclusively? Plan on some sticky valves, which could be why it looks like it has good compressions (almost too good to believe on an O-200 with 1600+ hours, honestly) and find out if it has the STC paperwork to burn ethanol free mogas. Big money saver, huge maintenance saver. Next, pour over the log books like your life depends on it, because it does. Find out EVERYTHING there is to know about that engine, and then the airframe repairs. Get a good pre-buy done by someone who has NEVER seen the airplane before. Trust me on this, it's not a "Hey, that would be cool if I could work it out that way" kind of thing. It's more of an "It's the only way in hell I'm buying that airplane" kind of thing.

    If everything works out well and it's truly a solid little airplane, then buy it, but be prepared to spend some money on it, even after a thorough pre-buy. Old things wear out, old instruments wear out, steering boots wear out, and if it isn't worn out yet, well, trust me, it will be before long. I have a very, very solid little 150M, and I still treat it like it's made out of crepe paper. My mechanic lets me do almost anything while under his supervision, and I've saved a LOT of money that way. He's an IA, also, and at our first annual this year he insisted, for my safety, that we treat the airplane like it was harboring secret ways to kill me and we literally went over every single piece and part of that airplane together, so that I knew exactly what I have. Lucky me, it is in extremely good shape and it has low total time and just under 600 hours on a reputable shop's full major overhaul. It runs soooooo nice. For now. If that changed, I could afford to deal with it. I bought my 150 outright, paid cash for it, and all subsequent repairs and upgrades. I am of the camp that says if you can't afford a 150 out of pocket, then you can't afford to own anything. Airplane ownership really doesn't get any less expensive than owning a 150. Take it to heart or disregard it; you're the final arbiter of what is right for you. :)
     
    iflyvfr likes this.
  38. Skyrys62

    Skyrys62 Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2017
    Messages:
    1,946
    Location:
    Owensboro, KY
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Skyrys62
    My thoughts exactly.

    No shame in renting until you have a solid plan/finances. You'll still be flying!
     
  39. Todd82

    Todd82 Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2017
    Messages:
    232
    Location:
    Southwest Ohio
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Todd
    $15k with a pretty run out engine AND out of annual seems really high for an old 150. I just recently had someone offer me one for $15k with a 200hr engine and fresh annual, but it wouldn't win any beauty contests.

    Unless it's got it's ADSB done already, a Garmin 430W, or something of the like which most 150s don't, I think you're getting hosed for that kind of money.

    And I second all the prior sentiments of if you gotta finance a $15k bird, you're sitting on a time bomb with a run out engine that you'll never get a loan for an overhaul.
     
  40. Rushie

    Rushie Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2006
    Messages:
    1,761
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Rushie
    We had a friend buy a $15,000 C150. His first annual was $8,000.
     
    Ryanb likes this.