BONANZA VS. CENTURION according to AOPA a clean sweep?

Discussion in 'Flight Following' started by FloridaPilot, Nov 24, 2017.

  1. jesse

    jesse Administrator Management Council Member

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    I bet he’d change his tone pretty fast for a mid six figure job flying around Swedish blondes in a 210.
     
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  2. JCranford

    JCranford Pattern Altitude

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    I never got a solid answer on what the issue was with the 210 and the insurance companies. Might have been the combination of my low time, no retract time, and the 210's (early models mainly) gear issues. Hopefully that will resolve itself after the first year when I have a bunch of 210 time. Only time (in the airplane) will tell.

    I liked the AOPA article. Validated my choice. Although, everyone knows, the answer is Bo's. ;)
     
  3. coach

    coach Pre-Flight

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    Don’t count on it. When I bought my 210 the ins broker told me after I had a few hours the premium for not having any retract would decrease. 250 hrs later and 3 years I am still waiting. Although the instrument rating helped. Broker said increased 210 accident rates is the cause. :(
     
  4. Debonair Driver

    Debonair Driver Filing Flight Plan

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    I've flown both and the majority of my PIC has been in Cessnas. Love them but I'd go with the BO (I did) For one the view out of the cockpit from the BO is sooooooooo much better. In most of the larger Cessnas just looking forward over the engine cowling was a pain and having to peek around the wings constantly sucked. The BO flies like a luxury car in the air, fuel efficient, rugged landing gear and is crazy easy to land. 210's feel, fly and look like a truck. Trucks are great but more tiring to operate.
     
  5. FloridaPilot

    FloridaPilot Pattern Altitude

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    Then a high wing airplane? I've flown Cessnas and Pipers and I agree low wing airplanes are MUCH easier to land.
     
  6. tspear

    tspear Cleared for Takeoff

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    Low wing and high wing have little to do with it. More about airfoil. And Beech selected a very forgiving airfoil with room for lots of slop. Hence, it is super easy to land....

    Tim

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  7. timwinters

    timwinters Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    I have no dog in this fight but I remember when the gear issue happened to David and sh*tty maintenance does not equal a sh*tty airplane. Any poorly maintained airplane can try to kill you.

    Cessnas definitely look like wounded ducks when the gear is extending/retracting though. It just ain't right!
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2017
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  8. FloridaPilot

    FloridaPilot Pattern Altitude

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    More forgiving than a Cessna?
     
  9. Fearless Tower

    Fearless Tower Touchdown! Greaser!

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    On landing it is. Most Beech planes are more forgiving of bad technique in landing than Cessnas.
     
  10. brien23

    brien23 Cleared for Takeoff

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    Any aircraft maintained like a pile of junk due to bad maintenance is a problem, the 210 landing gear maintained properly is trouble free. Don't blame the aircraft for bad maintenance. Any aircraft will kill you, and if you fly junk the odds are against you and if you don't know what you are doing as a pilot then you are lucky your still alive. Go back to a simple airplane that you can fly, don't blame the airplane for bad maintenance or your poor pilot ability.
     
  11. FloridaPilot

    FloridaPilot Pattern Altitude

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    What did you mean by flying junk...what do you consider junk?
     
  12. labbadabba

    labbadabba Pattern Altitude

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    I think I remember seeing that the C210s have a higher fatality rate. Certainly the highest amongst the Cessna line. Carrying more people in a complex HP aircraft with more challenging missions will do that.

    That, and they are notorious for gear-ups and engine cooling issues. That said, I do love a tricked out C210. Just cool looking planes.
     
  13. labbadabba

    labbadabba Pattern Altitude

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    Trade in both for a PA-46...
     
  14. Checkout_my_Six

    Checkout_my_Six Final Approach

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    I have to think that most of the issues with these planes has to do with flying into nasty.....and getting bit. They go high and fast.
     
  15. weilke

    weilke Touchdown! Greaser!

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    He traded both for a Supercup on amphibs when he retired. Sadly he passed away before he could get much use out of it.
     
  16. Tantalum

    Tantalum Pattern Altitude

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    One thing a lot of these comparisons miss, and I think why our POA discussions are so adamant between low wing, high wing, Mooney, Cirrus, etc., is that flying (at least pleasure/recreational flying for most people) is equal parts pragmatic and romantic, in other words... it's not all a strict math exercise. That's why in the other thread about the top 10 planes to own you saw so many varied answers, from Piper Cubs to PC12s

    I would pick the Bonanza because I think it looks better than the 210, and I'm rarely (if ever) going to fill a plane to the gills.. but really given any choice I would pick a Cirrus over either

    I think that's why not everyone is driving a minivan, or Prius, or whatever. I drive an FJ Cruiser.. its mileage sucks and the back seat is uncomfortable and the handling is crap.. but guess what, I like it
     
  17. labbadabba

    labbadabba Pattern Altitude

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    Is that like a Big Gulp?
     
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  18. Checkout_my_Six

    Checkout_my_Six Final Approach

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    I was thinking it was more like a trophy of some kind.....:D
     
  19. Fearless Tower

    Fearless Tower Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Exactly. Like any ‘which airplane’ thread, it’s all so subjective.

    I’ve flown both. I think they both have their pluses and minuses, but they’re both good airplanes.

    Personally, I like the way the Bo flies/handles better, and if it was just me flying around, I’d go for the Bo. But if I was hauling my family and luggage somewhere, I’d probably take the 210.


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  20. JCranford

    JCranford Pattern Altitude

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    I'd like to see some stats on just how many gear up landings were actually due to faulty gear compared to how many were due to a faulty pilot seat / gear handle connector. I think I'm probably paying for some dumb pilots.

    I looked at a buncha planes before I bought my 210, Bo included. Since my list included things like big useful load and 'wow that V tail is really ugly', I went with the 210.
     
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  21. Checkout_my_Six

    Checkout_my_Six Final Approach

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    now that right there is funny......and I don't care who ya are.:lol::goofy::lol:
     
  22. brien23

    brien23 Cleared for Takeoff

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    Any aircraft from Florida.
     
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  23. bnt83

    bnt83 Final Approach

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    “The 210 is a workhorse, and it carries a heavy load,” he said. “But it doesn’t have the grace and refinement of a Bonanza, and it never will.”

    LOL grace climbing in & out of the B, especially if you forgot something and the copilot/passenger is already in...
     
  24. Fearless Tower

    Fearless Tower Touchdown! Greaser!

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    You just playing or really that ignorant?
     
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  25. bnt83

    bnt83 Final Approach

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    I tend to agree with him actually. Jets based there show it. Coastal areas are worse than others.
     
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  26. EvilEagle

    EvilEagle Cleared for Takeoff

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    Only a $100k engine upgrade... and no tip tanks to add drag... and still only won a speed race by 5 lengths.
     
  27. EvilEagle

    EvilEagle Cleared for Takeoff

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    The 36 you flew must be a chunk of an airplane. My 36 has 1482 useful load and burns 12.2 gph at 166ktas. That 650 mile flight is 4 hours ish, call it 4.5 hours. With IFR reserves, I'd comfortably make that trip with 70-75 gallons on board. If you round up to 75 gallons on board that still leaves me over 1,000# of useful load to haul stuff.

    I originally wanted a 210, was all set to buy one. I kept telling myself I didn't want a Bonanza; kept telling myself that the tiny back seats and little bitty cargo door on the 210 wasn't a big deal. Then I looked for insurance and at twice the price, I couldn't see me paying for the 210. I have 5k+ hours, all but about 600 are in retracts and jets; still couldn't get the 210 insured for less than double what I could get my 36 insured for.

    We do two trips a year from New Orleans to the Bahamas, we take 4 adults and gear everytime. The 36 is a great traveling machine and the big doors are something you won't want to do without once you get used to them.
     
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  28. EvilEagle

    EvilEagle Cleared for Takeoff

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    The short body Bo's have a problem with this. In the 36, you'd have to try hard to get an aft CG. The closest I ever came to having an issue was taking 650# of water to hurricane Harvey victims. The back was full of water, and I didn't have a ton of fuel. It would've been right on the edge since I didn't have anyone else in the plane so I just took the seats out of the middle row and moved more water forward.
     
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  29. mscard88

    mscard88 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    The context I meant was four adults in the first two rows, and then trying to add adults or bigger kids in the last row, or cargo, as you did with water. I love Bonanzas, just something to be aware of.
     
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  30. EvilEagle

    EvilEagle Cleared for Takeoff

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    If I'd had another person in the front seats I wouldn't have been close. It's a common thing people say about Bo's but I don't think those people have looked at the CG for the 36, it's drastically different than the 35 or 33. If you had big enough people in the 5th/6th seats for it to throw off the CG in the Bo it would be a mute point in the 210/Bo discussion because two of those sized people could never get into a 210 back row.
     
  31. Fearless Tower

    Fearless Tower Touchdown! Greaser!

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    But just like his other sweeping generalizations you can’t say that any airplane from Florida is automatically junk. It makes you sound rather ignorant.

    Yes, Florida can be rather harsh on aircraft, especially ones that spent a lot of time outside. But I’ve also seen some very nice airplanes from FL as well. I could show you a few airplanes that came from FL (one spent 30 years there) and you’d never guess it came from FL.
     
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  32. brien23

    brien23 Cleared for Takeoff

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    BS
     
  33. TheGolfPilot

    TheGolfPilot Line Up and Wait

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    Ya, that isn’t my experience at all. the A36 I’m talking about takes just over 800 pounds with full tanks and is nearly impossible to put anything in the back without putting yourself in a fly out of cg position. Gave me a real bad taste for the things. I love the barn doors for shoving bikes and stuff in there.
     
  34. EvilEagle

    EvilEagle Cleared for Takeoff

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    I know a lot of guys that own/operate 36's and you are the first one that's had that type of experience. I think you just got ahold of a poor example of a 36. Bummer.
     
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  35. ktup-flyer

    ktup-flyer Pattern Altitude

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    My 182 was in Ft. Myers before I bought it. Zero corrosion
     
  36. Checkout_my_Six

    Checkout_my_Six Final Approach

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    impossible....:D
     
  37. weilke

    weilke Touchdown! Greaser!

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    There is a weight limitation on the third row seats (iirc 250lb combined). There isn't all that much side-side room in the third row, so exceeding that weight has never been an issue. The third row in the 210 is also midget territory, so little difference there.

    Our TC is so nose-heavy that I have to strap two cases of oil in the luggage compartment when I fly with one of my partners.
     
  38. Checkout_my_Six

    Checkout_my_Six Final Approach

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    The third row and baggage space....is where the PA-32 shines.
     
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  39. Fearless Tower

    Fearless Tower Touchdown! Greaser!

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    The only BS here is the crap you spread.

    You are a First Class TROLL who does nothing useful but get your jollies by attempting to spread lies and old wives tales. You do a disservice to general aviation.
     
  40. Ken Ibold

    Ken Ibold Final Approach

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    Plus the ability to use the front baggage compartment to help with weight and balance -- especially important if you have club seating and your pax like to sit in the back row, limousine style.
     
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