At some point a parent has just got to let them fail I guess

Timbeck2

Timbeck2

Final Approach
Joined
Nov 4, 2015
Messages
9,167
Location
Vail, Arizona
Display Name
Display name:
Timbeck2
So my daughter (Thing 2 the newly scarved* flight attendant) has her first training flight tomorrow morning out of Dallas. She is in Nashville about to leave with her boyfriend for the drive to Dallas. I texted her and asked her status - "about to leave Nashville" I asked how long is the drive. She replied nine and a half hours. I thought about it, counted to ten and back and then simply texted "way to cut it close."

What I didn't say was: "Listen you moron, the world doesn't stop for you. If you miss your first flight because you waited until the last minute to leave Nashville, you may get fired and I wouldn't blame them for doing so. All your life, I've always told you to "make good choices" every time you left the house and if you remember, the last time I saw you before you left, I told you again to make good choices. Well honey, this time you didn't. You should have already been there maybe eating a nice dinner, seeing some sights and most of all, getting a good night's sleep before your first day on the job. Instead, you will be dragging arse into town late this evening (if everything goes well on the drive) and be tired as hell when you arrive for work. What you didn't account for was car trouble, accidents on the road and anything else that is out of your control on your nine and a half hour drive. I hope you make it and I hope you're well rested enough to make a good first impression on your first flight.

Dad


*scarved because although she has her wings, they aren't allowed to wear them until after their training flights so she only has her scarf and her ID as proof she is a flight attendant.

vent over
 
Living with three women is a lesson in patience. We'd tell the girls that we're leaving 30 minutes before we had to and then we'd maybe leave on time. Their mother is the same way. I don't know how many times we'd leave late, get 5 miles down the road and someone needed to pee or left the curling iron on.
 
Timbeck2 said:
"Listen you moron, the world doesn't stop for you. If you miss your first flight because you waited until the last minute to leave Nashville, you may get fired and I wouldn't blame them for doing so. All your life, I've always told you to "make good choices" every time you left the house and if you remember, the last time I saw you before you left, I told you again to make good choices. Well honey, this time you didn't. You should have already been there maybe eating a nice dinner, seeing some sights and most of all, getting a good night's sleep before your first day on the job. Instead, you will be dragging arse into town late this evening (if everything goes well on the drive) and be tired as hell when you arrive for work. What you didn't account for was car trouble, accidents on the road and anything else that is out of your control on your nine and a half hour drive. I hope you make it and I hope you're well rested enough to make a good first impression on your first flight.
Click to expand...

Every time I go to do something or I screw something up, this is the voice I hear in my head exactly in my Dad's voice.
 
Not all women are this way. My wife will be ready on time. Daughter #1 will be ready on time. Daughter # 2 will be ready eventually. My older sister will leave the house at the time she's supposed to arrive wherever she's going.
 
Is she unable to use her airline employee perks and fly?

Hope all goes well!
 
Timbeck2 said:
Living with three women is a lesson in patience. We'd tell the girls that we're leaving 30 minutes before we had to and then we'd maybe leave on time. Their mother is the same way. I don't know how many times we'd leave late, get 5 miles down the road and someone needed to pee or left the curling iron on.
Click to expand...

When I have a kid I want a girl. Idk why
 
Well it could be worse. I have a friend who’s daughter is so bad at life she’s on the verge of criminal charges for writing bad checks. She can’t seem to understand there has to be money in the account for her to write checks.
 
Tarheelpilot said:
Well it could be worse. I have a friend who’s daughter is so bad at life she’s on the verge of criminal charges for writing bad checks. She can’t seem to understand there has to be money in the account for her to write checks.
Click to expand...

I’d recommend YNAB to her :)
 
I am fortunate in that my wife is incredibly punctual and leaves nothing to chance. I am blessed beyond words.

I do agree with the thoughts (especially as a parent), but you do need to let the kids fail and feel the pain. You (and me) are not going to be around forever. I'd rather let my son meet with some failures early while I'm still around to help provide some guidance with the hope that later in life (when I'm not around anymore) they'll make the right choices, or at least know how to get themselves out of the trouble they're in.
 
Ryanb said:
Is she unable to use her airline employee perks and fly?

Hope all goes well!
Click to expand...

The plan was for her and her boyfriend to leave 2 days ago, stop in Jonesboro Arkansas and visit her grandmother (my mom) maybe spend the night and continue on to Dallas. I don't know what happened and although my mom is probably disappointed that she isn't going to visit, it isn't my place to helicopter parent my 22 year old daughter (that's her mother's job)

I'm sure she could have used her perks to fly but wanted to share the trip with her boyfriend.
 
Timbeck2 said:
Is that a good thing or a bad thing? I'm serious.
Click to expand...

I used to push back hard against that line of thinking when I was younger. I was frustrated because I had to apparently leave 3 hours early for a 20 minute drive to an appointment in town because I had to take into account EVERYTHING that could possibly happen along the way. I hated the thought of over-preparing for something because nothing could possibly happen badly enough that you'd be in trouble.

I made the decision to leave exactly on time for my appointments and engagements and see for myself what kind of "terrible things" would stop me. What could go wrong? I have enough time to drive there, that should be all I need.

And then they did. Flat tires, heavy traffic out of nowhere, gas stops, forgotten items, GPS address was wrong, you name it. I waited to book a hotel to an event too late and couldn't find one nearly as close or as cheap.

Once I saw the validity and rationality of the claims of things happening I adopted it into my decision process. Now every time I think about a decision or when to go or what to do, I always err on the side of caution and plan to be a moderate amount of time ahead in the event that the universe does what it does best, screw with you. I hear my dad calling me an idiot from across the country before I even tell him what happened. If I got a text from my dad saying "Way to cut it close" I would hear that entire message you didn't send even if he didn't say it outright. He's always told me the same thing you've told your daughter, make smart decisions. And he called me out when I did something stupid too.

I think it's a good thing that I hear my dad calling me an idiot for things I could've avoided. But I had to find out myself before I could just believe it. I can't imagine how uncomfortable that must be as a parent.
 
Last edited:
Never ask a question you don’t already know the answer to, or wouldn’t like the answer to.

Went through this phase with both my kids when they got out of college.

Ranger school taught my son the consequences of not being on time.

My daughter learned by showing up 5 mins late to an interview. The school she was interviewing to teach did not allow her to interview.

Those two things did more for them than any opinion I could give them and taught me that I have to change as a parent. They are each responsible for their own successes. I can celebrate with them or listen to their sorrows. Lectures from me are over, though.
 
overdrive148 said:
I used to push back hard against that line of thinking really hard when I was younger. I was frustrated because I had to apparently leave 3 hours early for a 20 minute drive to an appointment in town because I had to take into account EVERYTHING that could possibly happen along the way. I hated the thought of over-preparing for something because nothing could possibly happen badly enough that you'd be in trouble.

I made the decision to leave exactly on time for my appointments and engagements and see for myself what kind of "terrible things" would stop me. What could go wrong? I have enough time to drive there, that should be all I need.

And then they did. Flat tires, heavy traffic out of nowhere, gas stops, forgotten items, GPS address was wrong, you name it. I waited to book a hotel to an event too late and couldn't find one nearly as close or as cheap.

Once I saw the validity and rationality of the claims of things happening I adopted it into my decision process. Now every time I think about a decision or when to go or what to do, I always err on the side of caution and plan to be a moderate amount of time ahead in the event that the universe does what it does best, screw with you. I hear my dad calling me an idiot from across the country before I even tell him what happened. If I got a text from my dad saying "Way to cut it close" I would hear that entire message you didn't send even if he didn't say it outright. He's always told me the same thing you've told your daughter, make smart decisions. And he called me out when I did something stupid too.

I think it's a good thing that I hear my dad calling me an idiot for things I could've avoided. But I had to find out myself before I could just believe it. I can't imagine how uncomfortable that must be as a parent.
Click to expand...

Your post was exactly what I needed to read. Thank you.
 
When flying commercial, which I loathe, my wife literally likes to time arriving at the airport so that you go through security and it's already time to board and you walk on the plane. Needless to say she has missed more than one airplane flight in her life and I have missed zero.
 
Timbeck2 said:
So my daughter (Thing 2 the newly scarved* flight attendant) has her first training flight tomorrow morning out of Dallas. She is in Nashville about to leave with her boyfriend for the drive to Dallas. I texted her and asked her status - "about to leave Nashville" I asked how long is the drive. She replied nine and a half hours. I thought about it, counted to ten and back and then simply texted "way to cut it close."

What I didn't say was: "Listen you moron, the world doesn't stop for you. If you miss your first flight because you waited until the last minute to leave Nashville, you may get fired and I wouldn't blame them for doing so. All your life, I've always told you to "make good choices" every time you left the house and if you remember, the last time I saw you before you left, I told you again to make good choices. Well honey, this time you didn't. You should have already been there maybe eating a nice dinner, seeing some sights and most of all, getting a good night's sleep before your first day on the job. Instead, you will be dragging arse into town late this evening (if everything goes well on the drive) and be tired as hell when you arrive for work. What you didn't account for was car trouble, accidents on the road and anything else that is out of your control on your nine and a half hour drive. I hope you make it and I hope you're well rested enough to make a good first impression on your first flight.

Dad


*scarved because although she has her wings, they aren't allowed to wear them until after their training flights so she only has her scarf and her ID as proof she is a flight attendant.

vent over
Click to expand...


If she misses her training flight does she still get to keep the scarf?
 
TCABM said:
Never ask a question you don’t already know the answer to, or wouldn’t like the answer to.

Went through this phase with both my kids when they got out of college.

Ranger school taught my son the consequences of not being on time.

My daughter learned by showing up 5 mins late to an interview. The school she was interviewing to teach did not allow her to interview.

Those two things did more for them than any opinion I could give them and taught me that I have to change as a parent. They are each responsible for their own successes. I can celebrate with them or listen to their sorrows. Lectures from me are over, though.
Click to expand...

When the last apron string is cut I'll agree with you that lectures are over. But until she is self-sufficient and as long as I'm still footing the bill for things, I've still got skin in the game and a right to voice my opinion.
 
When first married I tried to get Mrs. Steingar going. I quickly learned that it was pretty hopeless. I rather turned that around this trip. I had an unusual aeromedical problem in that it was far warmer than usual for our northern climes. Hot enough that it was giving Mrs. Steingar trouble in the airplane. Thus I told her that the minute I knew we could make the flight it was going to be go go go time. No coffee, no long makeup, no screens. Just go. I told her that the down side of non compliance was a hot turbulent flight that she wouldn't enjoy.

Worked for the first time in two decades. We got off early enough that we had cool smooth flights and got home at a good hour. I of course don't ever expect this approach to work again. One thing I will say for Mrs. Steingar, if I say we need to be ready at X:00 she's ready. Just don't try and get her going 5 minutes before.
 
Marshall R. Naquin said:
When flying commercial, which I loathe, my wife literally likes to time arriving at the airport so that you go through security and it's already time to board and you walk on the plane. Needless to say she has missed more than one airplane flight in her life and I have missed zero.
Click to expand...

My boss was like that. We worked at a previous company together and I stopped riding with him to the airport because it stressed me out. Then one day were scheduled on a Southwest flight. I made the trip and he swept up to the gate at his accustomed last minute. They'd given his seat away. He wouldn't fly SWA for years after that. But he did start getting to the airport earlier. And, eventually, after we'd started our own company and he hired a BD person who lover SWA he returned. It's now one of his favorite airlines...
 
I dont think my lack of a filter would have allowed me NOT to send the second message you posted.
 
JCranford said:
I dont think my lack of a filter would have allowed me NOT to send the second message you posted.
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure what overdrive said above is the case. I didn't have to send the second one as the first one implied my feelings sufficiently.
 
Marshall R. Naquin said:
When flying commercial, which I loathe, my wife literally likes to time arriving at the airport so that you go through security and it's already time to board and you walk on the plane. Needless to say she has missed more than one airplane flight in her life and I have missed zero.
Click to expand...
I operate like your wife and I’ve missed one flight in my life. I airline at least a dozen times a year. My goal is to walk up right as the last section is boarding the airplane.

The time I missed a flight - it didn’t even matter. I flew myself in a 172 instead.

If I arrived an hour earlier than I needed to be - that is 2 hours per trip wasted - well over 24 hours per year. I don’t have that sort of time to be wasting.

A boss of mine once told me “if you don’t miss an airline flight every now and then, you are wasting way too much of the companies time”.
 
Timbeck2 said:
I'm pretty sure what overdrive said above is the case. I didn't have to send the second one as the first one implied my feelings sufficiently.
Click to expand...

With my experience from my dad, I think it's more effective to send the shorter version and let them "hear" the longer version themselves.

You can't argue or push back much against a statement like "way to cut it close".

You can argue or push back against the longer version. This is how I'd mentally reply in the past to my dad saying the same thing:
"If you miss your first flight because you waited until the last minute to leave Nashville, you may get fired"
Click to expand...
I know they can fire me, relax, I have this under control...

"All your life, I've always told you to "make good choices" every time you left the house and if you remember, the last time I saw you before you left, I told you again to make good choices"
Click to expand...
I interviewed and got this position and worked hard to get here, and did great in school, I have been making good choices up to this point...

"You should have already been there maybe eating a nice dinner, seeing some sights and most of all, getting a good night's sleep before your first day on the job"
Click to expand...
I am basically invincible and have functioned before off of very little sleep more often than not, I'll be fine...

"What you didn't account for was car trouble, accidents on the road and anything else that is out of your control on your nine and a half hour drive"
Click to expand...
Those things probably won't happen and I'll make it there just fine. Where does the accounting stop? Car trouble, traffic, nuclear war, meteors? Relax!
Click to expand...
The worst feeling when I screwed myself wasn't necessarily that I had screwed up, it was that deep down I knew my dad was right. I knew I should've listened to his advice. I hated to admit that!

And he didn't have to tell me that he was right, I just knew it because of the comment he made (like "way to cut it close"). I don't know how he instilled that in me though. I think I had been told before that point that things were going to wrong and I just knew better that they weren't. Then he commented on it and commented like timbeck did and voila, it all came back.

Your mileage may vary of course, there are other people my age who can't adult to save their lives or plan more than 5 minutes in to the future.

I am 27 as of last week for a reference point btw.
 
Last edited:
When our son was young we would be late for everything and he hated it. Until...we invented "Mommy time." He would come home and announce he had to be somewhere at 5:30 and we would be there by 6 when everyone else arrived. I would ask him in private if he was talking mommy time and he would tell me the actual arrival date. I sometimes would have to adjust depending on how I estimated travel time and how mommy did.
 
jesse said:
I operate like your wife and I’ve missed one flight in my life. I airline at least a dozen times a year. My goal is to walk up right as the last section is boarding the airplane.

The time I missed a flight - it didn’t even matter. I flew myself in a 172 instead.

If I arrived an hour earlier than I needed to be - that is 2 hours per trip wasted - well over 24 hours per year. I don’t have that sort of time to be wasting.

A boss of mine once told me “if you don’t miss an airline flight every now and then, you are wasting way too much of the companies time”.
Click to expand...


I've missed one flight and it blew the whole effing day, literally about 8 extra hours spent in transit because I wasn't early.

It’s a gamble lol.
 
Timbeck2 said:
When the last apron string is cut I'll agree with you that lectures are over. But until she is self-sufficient and as long as I'm still footing the bill for things, I've still got skin in the game and a right to voice my opinion.
Click to expand...

Even though I'm out of the nest and basically independent, I still value my dad's opinion and look to him for input on things. Even though we don't always agree on the same things, I know that he's experienced a lot more than me and I'd be stupid not to at least look through his lens at something.
 
Yesterday at our Independence Day celebration, one young man said he was worried that his kid never failed. He said one time he intentionally delayed the kids art project so he would not get a good grade. The school came back and said it was a work of art and heaped on praise. He is very worried that his son would grow up and hit a brick wall at some point. This is from a WO5 with six tours in SEA in helos.
 
daughter, huh...……..mwah hah ha, jk. I'm sure that wasn't what u needed to hear.
 
My wife has always been like that. My daughter is the same way. My son and I would rather be an hour early than a minute late. The not-so-funny thing is that it doesn't seem to bother the girls. They've both lost jobs because they just couldn't get to work on time.

I came back from a meeting one morning when a woman I work with was dying laughing. She knows my wife was supposed to be at work at 8 a.m. and called my number at almost 9. "Cheryl just called. She said traffic is so much better at this time of day."

It doesn't bother her in the least. It stresses me out to no end. She'll out live me by 20 years.
 
jesse said:
I operate like your wife and I’ve missed one flight in my life. I airline at least a dozen times a year. My goal is to walk up right as the last section is boarding the airplane.

The time I missed a flight - it didn’t even matter. I flew myself in a 172 instead.

If I arrived an hour earlier than I needed to be - that is 2 hours per trip wasted - well over 24 hours per year. I don’t have that sort of time to be wasting.

A boss of mine once told me “if you don’t miss an airline flight every now and then, you are wasting way too much of the companies time”.
Click to expand...

Depends on where based and where you go. If you are based near a major hub and only taking direct, that works. However, even when based out of the DC area with three major airports, when flying for a DoD contract to places that are not in a major city, one missed flight could be a one day delay.

Now, my airline flying is for vacation to distant places, I am happy to read while I wait in the airport.

Tim
 
jsstevens said:
Not all women are this way. My wife will be ready on time. Daughter #1 will be ready on time. Daughter # 2 will be ready eventually. My older sister will leave the house at the time she's supposed to arrive wherever she's going.
Click to expand...

My wife is never late, and if I hope to have peace in the house, I make sure I'm not late and I never cause her to be late. She takes that "be at the airport two hours before the flight" quite literally, even at little airports like PWM.

She has a friend named Eileen, who's even worse. There's something called "Eileen time" in their household that means something like 15 minutes early for everything, enforced by the wrath of Eileen, all 5' 1" and 110 lbs of her.
 
A friends girl friend was of the type... I'll get there when I want to. She lost a few jobs because of that thought.

But it wasn't her fault she lost the jobs, it was because someone there had it in for her.....:rolleyes:


I have learned to tell my wife that we need to be there at 6:30 when we actually need to be there at 7:30. I think it makes her feel better to make me late.
 
tspear said:
Depends on where based and where you go. If you are based near a major hub and only taking direct, that works. However, even when based out of the DC area with three major airports, when flying for a DoD contract to places that are not in a major city, one missed flight could be a one day delay.

Now, my airline flying is for vacation to distant places, I am happy to read while I wait in the airport.

Tim
Click to expand...

Nowadays the flights are pretty full, and if you miss one you may be stuck for a while. My wife and eldest got stuck in Harrisburg, PA for two days after a flight cancellation.
 
I've had the "timing" conversation with any number of friends, employees, girlfriends, etc. NOTHING is "five minutes away." How long does it take you to find your keys? Remember sunglasses? Lock the door? Back out of the driveway? Drive there? Park? Walk inside the building? Find the right office? Etcetera, etcetera.

And remember - ten minutes early is five minutes late.

To my surprise, I've converted a few, at least on travel time allowances. Left without a few, too. (I do agree with Jesse's boss: he's right. I'm just not willing to suffer the consequences of missing the flight.)
 
Unless I misunderstood the post she was leaving around noonish for an appointment the next morning with a 9-10 hour drive? Seems entirely reasonable to me, she should get there the night before and she's got several hours of time to deal with any problems.

I know we do this for GA flights but a lot of people don't have the time to take an extra day to get somewhere just in case something goes wrong.
 
cowman said:
Unless I misunderstood the post she was leaving around noonish for an appointment the next morning with a 9-10 hour drive? Seems entirely reasonable to me, she should get there the night before and she's got several hours of time to deal with any problems.

I know we do this for GA flights but a lot of people don't have the time to take an extra day to get somewhere just in case something goes wrong.
Click to expand...


Wild guess here....you aren't the parent of a daughter are you?

This isn't merely an "appointment." It is the first day of her new job as a flight attendant.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top