Accelerated Training Course...Ceiling Fan Edition

Shawn

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Shawn
Welp...tomorrow I am off to strap a lawn mower engine to my arse and see what happens!

Finally start Paramotor training and beyond mildly stoked.

If you don't see any further posts from me on POA...it might not have gone well. I leave everything to my dog.


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Always wanted to do that. Enjoy Shawn!
 
I always wanted to learn this as well
 
Holy Butt Fans, Batman...these things are a freakin blast!

While I throughly enjoy my plane and love general aviation...my plane is more more of a tranpsoration tool than recreational enjoyment for me. This Paramotor doohickey is like a freakin jet ski in the air and I just barely got started on the basics.

Will do more of a writeup down the line, but got to solo this evening on day three of training after two and a half full days of intense kiting and ground work! This is gonna be a fun week, only bummer is that we have much smaller flying windows than GA flying...two hours after sunrise and two hours before sunset...rest is generally too thermally and turbulent for us noobs here in the Midwest where I am training. Luckily back home in coastal conditions that flying window expands better though the day depending on weather.

...plus filling up only a three gallon fuel tank to go play is a helluv lot nicer on the wallet than two wings full of AvGas!
 
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Man my brain is having a hard time with that picture. I KNOW that he's flying away and to the right, but my brain keeps wanting to orient the pilot as flying towards us and to the right, which means the wing is twisted 90 degrees to the route of flight, which is a real mind-bender.

Reminds me of some of those optical illusions - "is it a wine glass? or two faces?"
 
There is a school like 25 minutes from me...seriously considering trying it out. Looks like it is about 2,000 for a full course...
 
There is a school like 25 minutes from me...seriously considering trying it out. Looks like it is about 2,000 for a full course...

A legit operator will run $2000-$2500 for a 7-10 day training program that includes rental gear. One of the top schools in the US is is bumping up to $3500 and is booked solid for the next 18 months due to demand and boom in the sport.

This is a very unregulated sport in the Ultralight category and you could go buy gear and fly with zero training but knowing what I know now that will likely put you in the hospital in short time!

There are a lot of one man band and jackwaggon trainers out there...if you are gonna do it, do it right and just like GA flight schools, find a solid structured program.
 
A legit operator will run $2000-$2500 for a 7-10 day training program that includes rental gear. One of the top schools in the US is is bumping up to $3500 and is booked solid for the next 18 months due to demand and boom in the sport.

This is a very unregulated sport in the Ultralight category and you could go buy gear and fly with zero training but knowing what I know now that will likely put you in the hospital in short time!

There are a lot of one man band and jackwaggon trainers out there...if you are gonna do it, do it right and just like GA flight schools, find a solid structured program.

Apparently the guy who runs this school near me is #1 in the US and flew competitively and broke many world records - his name is Ryan Shaw.

Looks like it would be easy to spend $10k on your own gear.

http://www.paradrenalin.com/about-us/
 
Holy Butt Fans, Batman...these things are a freakin blast!

So if you've had a bit too much bean and cheese burrito for lunch and then launch in one of those things...

On second thought maybe I don't want to know.
 
Enjoy... a buttfan is about the most fun you can have in the air.
 
So if you've had a bit too much bean and cheese burrito for lunch and then launch in one of those things...

On second thought maybe I don't want to know.

Aren't you glad elephants don't fly..???
 
Looks like it would be easy to spend $10k on your own gear

I will ask around about your lead. These guys I am with know everyone.

New motor run $5500-$9000 and new wings are $1500-$2500 range. Lots of great used gear cheaper on the market, but be careful...a lot of it is crap that students were sold by those jackeaggon instructors and sell after 2-3 flight after they are left high and dry without enough training.

If you ever hear the name Super Dell or Captain Kurt...run...far away...without their fan on your back!
 
I will ask around about your lead. These guys I am with know everyone.

New motor run $5500-$9000 and new wings are $1500-$2500 range. Lots of great used gear cheaper on the market, but be careful...a lot of it is crap that students were sold by those jackeaggon instructors and sell after 2-3 flight after they are left high and dry without enough training.

If you ever hear the name Super Dell or Captain Kurt...run...far away...without their fan on your back!

Yea I was just looking around online...curious about it and those numbers are exactly what I was seeing. Not bad compared to an airplane of course, but not cheap either!

Anyways...I might have to get out to this paradrenalin school sometime and do a discovery flight.
 
There unfortunately is not an active PPG forum like POA just yet...but there are a few PPG Facebook groups. Search "paramotor" on Facebook and few will pop up. "Paramotor" is the biggest...but a lot of international people as the sport is a lot bigger outside the US.
 
I have never even heard of that, just watched some videos and that is AWESOME!
 
I've been working on scheduling a demo flight for the last week or so. I'm curious as to whether my fear of heights will keep me from enjoying it before I sign up for a full training course and buy some equipment. I'm fine in an airplane, but did NOT like skydiving (got talked into trying it and won't be doing it again).
 
Shawn, looks like a blast! What school are you training with?
 
Apparently the guy who runs this school near me is #1 in the US and flew competitively and broke many world records - his name is Ryan Shaw.

Got great feedback about Ryan as a PPG instructor. Sounds like a great guy...just do your homework and research on the gear he recommends to make sure it is right for you before committing to purchase, especially the wing...as you should research any purchase from an instructor that is pushing a specific brand. I have a guy in my class that pre-oreded gear and already changed his mind to another rig after actually flying, lucky the school has others waiting that will pick up that pre-oreded motor. The sport is booming and the good guys are in high demand and getting booked solid through next year...if you can lock in which him, do it!

Anyways...I might have to get out to this paradrenalin school sometime and do a discovery flight.

So, unlike flight schools there is not really the equivalent to a "discovery flight" option available like when getting your PPL for PPG schools. You can go check out schools and observe, but it is a commit or not kinda deal. Most have rental gear so not like you have to buy BEFORE you train (and if you do HAVE to, run). There is a tandem option but if you have been up in a small plane, it is really of no benefit as you are just hanging there for a ride and not experiencing any of the controls or piloting. It works for those that have never been up in a anything but commercial, but for a GA pilot to would be worthless doing a tandem flight.

I'm curious as to whether my fear of heights will keep me from enjoying it before I sign up for a full training course and buy some equipment. I'm fine in an airplane, but did NOT like skydiving (got talked into trying it and won't be doing it again).

No one seems to have that fear materialize generally although many have expressed it. Totally different sensations from skydiving. You are piloting a wing and the harness feels like you are cradled in a giant camping chair once you are up in your seat. You are extremely strapped in. Once launched and relaxed, none of the straps are even tight to your body but you could not get out the harness if you tried. If GA does not freak you out, paramotors will not.

DO NOT buy gear till you train...the old saying is you don't know what you don't know. Go learn THEN figure out what is right for you. I had my pre conceived notions as to what I wanted walking in the door and my mind is rapidly changing as I go through this process. It is like asking POA what plane you should buy before you even take your first student pilot flight...don't do it.

Shawn, looks like a blast! What school are you training with?

I wound up with Midwest Powered Paragliders out in Indiana...and they are now booked solid through April and have been getting 8 calls a day from new prospects wanting to fly. They are part of the Aviator Alliance started by Aviator PPG in Florida who is one of the top outfits in the country...and those guys are booked now 18 months out...but if you wanna fly, call them an they will get ya hooked up with one of their affilaite partners that may have room. Imagine the best flight school around then this alliance pools all their collective resources and knowledge of other existing top schools to build on their established training techniques and syllabus all togher vs a single independent CFI working outta a podunk airstrip on his own. That is what you get with these guys.

http://www.aviatorppg.com

Two incredible Youtube channels whose content in part is driving the current boom and interest in the sport:

Tucker Gott https://www.youtube.com/user/J3Cub2009
Aviator PPG https://www.youtube.com/user/TheAv8tqr

Today was day five for my training. We spent days one and two working our arses off as we had great kitting weather. Was expecting a lot of ground school, but nope, day one we were flying the kites up for two straight days with occasional ground school sessions for breaks. I got my first solo flight in Monday night which was end of day three. Only got one flight in as we ran outta daylight trying to get everyone up. We were 50/50 success rate...three did it, three blew their first launches which is common. After 3-4 blown succesive launches you are done as your a physically fried when you are learning. Day Four...I blew my next set of launches that night...frustrating but we were all physically fried and it was zero wind which is the most difficult to launch in as a noob. A 7 mph wind and your are up with little effort, no wind you are running like a mule trying to power a giant kite up while patting your head and rubbing your stomach while juggling chain saws at the same time all while scared out of your mind! By the this morning we were all able to get in the air which was sweet....then two more flights tonight.

It is freaking awesome but at the same time the learning process is bar none the most terrifying thing I have ever tried to attempt. Imaging getting your PPL and having never been airborne yet and your CFI running each individual step in a simulator only one piece at a time then he tosses you in a plane and says..."now put it all together" and launches you into the air for your first solo without the CFI next to you and add in very real possibility of damage and injury cuz the motor and prop are screaming on your back if you screw up.

In this case it is opposite of GA, landing and flying is absolutely a piece of cake...the take off is terrifying as you are learning!

Damage while not regular is not uncommon...one guy crashed on takeoff, slammed the cage back into the ground and the prop flexed and punctured the fuel tank sending a blast of fuel everywhere (luckily no fire and that is apparently VERY rare to happen...but it did)...about a $700 oops in new prop and a gas tank. I ripped a harness strap on an abort sliding in on my knees...but luckily was an easy re-sew. Prop strikes and damage is a regular occurrence during training, there are a pile of damaged props sitting in the corner...you just hope it is only just the gear that breaks and not the pilots!
 
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No one seems to have that fear materialize generally although many have expressed it. Totally different sensations from skydiving. You are piloting a wing and the harness feels like you are cradled in a giant camping chair once you are up in your seat. You are extremely strapped in. Once launched and relaxed, none of the straps are even tight to your body but you could not get out the harness if you tried. If GA does not freak you out, paramotors will not.

I was hopeful, but that's great to hear! Keep us posted on your progress!
 
Yea I was referring to the tandem option which he offers. I did tandem paragliding and had a blast but to each his own I guess.
 
Yea I was referring to the tandem option which he offers. I did tandem paragliding and had a blast but to each his own I guess.

Yeah...if he offers tandem absolutely go for it. Most instructors and outfits are not rated for tandem flights and my comments were meant to mean that if an instructor or school does not offer tandems, there is little benefit to go seek it out elsewhere before starting and needing a "discovery flight".
 
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Just curious, will whatever certification they give you also qualify you to fly at a hang gliding site? Also how different are the PPG vs Paraglider wings?
 
Just curious, will whatever certification they give you also qualify you to fly at a hang gliding site? Also how different are the PPG vs Paraglider wings?

I can't think you'd fly a paramotor at a hang gliding launch. The whole point of hang gliding and paragliding is to get launched to try to find some lift, where every paramotor I've ever seen takes off from a flat open field and climbs away on it own power.

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Hang gliding seems so sketchy haha but I hear it's just as safe as paragliding if not safer because the wing won't collapse...still just seems scary!
 
Hang gliding seems so sketchy haha but I hear it's just as safe as paragliding if not safer because the wing won't collapse...still just seems scary!

The fatality per participant per year is very similar to what it is for flying certificated light airplanes. If you got up close and personal with a hang glider I think you'd be impressed with it, it's just as airworthy as is any GA airplane and is capable of withstanding 6 g's.
 
I can't think you'd fly a paramotor at a hang gliding launch. The whole point of hang gliding and paragliding is to get launched to try to find some lift, where every paramotor I've ever seen takes off from a flat open field and climbs away on it own power.

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That at lookout Mountain? That is a gnarly ramp. I visited there when I was ridge flying the Sequatchie Valley in my sailplane 6 years ago.

Probably should have stated my question differently. I was wondering if you could reuse the wing to go soaring sans weed whacker backpack.
 
The fatality per participant per year is very similar to what it is for flying certificated light airplanes. If you got up close and personal with a hang glider I think you'd be impressed with it, it's just as airworthy as is any GA airplane and is capable of withstanding 6 g's.

I'm sure it's a blast. There are a lot of hangliding sites around me here in Arizona. Mingus Mountains in Prescott, Humboldt Mountain by Horseshoe Lake, etc
 
Probably should have stated my question differently. I was wondering if you could reuse the wing to go soaring sans weed whacker backpack.

Maybe, but I'd think, like hang gliding, that the wing is sized for the weight flying it. Put a light hang glider on a wing designed for a heavy person and they will find it hard to fly, slow to respond to command inputs, and would be pretty scary in thermals.
 
Just curious, will whatever certification they give you also qualify you to fly at a hang gliding site? Also how different are the PPG vs Paraglider wings?

There is no certification required for PPG. The US Powered Paragliding Association has a rating program but it doesn't really get you anything. A US Hang Gliding rating, which is different, is generally required to use established HG launch sites.

The same wing can be used for PG or PPG, though the trend in PPG has been toward specialized motor wings emphasizing speed and handling over soaring performance.
 
Yeah, paramotor and paragliding are similar in that you have a wing over your head but the type of flying is very different. In paragliding you are looking for the wind and thermals to provide your lift...with paramotors you have the forward thrust of the fan providing the lift for the wing and want smooth buttery and want to avoid those thermals of rising and sinking air...that is where collapses happen.

Wing collapse is a very real threat, but that is why quality training is critical to be able to identify what is safe weather and what is not...that is why here in the midwest we have such a short window to fly each day in a normal weather pattern. Goes from butter smooth at sunrise, then as the sun rises and air heat us it will start getting bumpy and turbulent...then once the ground heat up thermals begin and that is when collapse happen...then it all reverses as the sun sets in the evening. Beach flying where you have a steady cool breeze and the air had not been affected ground heating and rising thermals you can fly all day...high winds are the danger there. If you know how to avoid thermals, rotors, and up/down drafts you will never even be in a collapse prone situation in the first place.

Reserve chutes are an option but they come with their own risks and training to not be more of a danger than a help. Learn and understand when and why you would want one and you will probably never need one.

Is is an amazingly unregulated sport in the Ultralight category flying under FAR part 103 which is like two pages long vs the King James Bible version of regs in the FAR/AIM that even part 91 falls under...and 103 is specifically EXCLUDED from the part 91 rules.
 
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Are paramotor wings that much more prone to collapse than regular paraglider wings? I find that surprising since these things are direct descendants from paragliders which are perfectly happy (to an extent) in turbulent thermal and ridge conditions.
 
Are paramotor wings that much more prone to collapse than regular paraglider wings? I find that surprising since these things are direct descendants from paragliders which are perfectly happy (to an extent) in turbulent thermal and ridge conditions.

No, not at all. Some actually use the same wing for both but as mentioned above more wings are being engineered for PPG specifically that have better speed and cruising efficiency characteristics.

You CAN fly PPG in these conditions...but it really does require additional training. The recommendation from my instructor is to go do a paragliding class to understand how to learn how to remain safe in thermal conditions, but you should learn in your PPG class how to identify and avoid those conditions all together so you would never get into a collapse scenario in the first place without additional training on how to handle that safely...hence why there are more paraglider ratings that actually mean something than the PPG ratings which are really self implemented by the industry as they try and set standards before the FAA does.

Kinda like IFR and VFR...you would never wanna venture into a cloud as an VFR pilot without IFR training...but when you are training for that IFR, you are seeking out IMC where the VFR guy should avoid it like the plague. Both use the same plane. The VFR pilot does not know what he does not know entering those conditions.
 
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