2025 C172

RyanB

Super Administrator
Management Council Member
PoA Supporter
Joined
Jul 21, 2010
Messages
17,161
Location
Chattanooga, TN
Display Name
Ryan
Had a student this morning in the flight school’s new 2025 C172S, delivered straight from Wichita. Never have flown a new plane before. Quite a nice machine I must say, hard to believe it’s a 172. The G1000NXI is definitely a step up from the previous generation. Nothing is dinged up, broken or worn - yet ;)

That is all. :D
 
Had a T206 make it's first flight from Wichita to my home drome. It was all shiny and lacked the butt sweat smell. It was weird.
 
Had a student this morning in the flight school’s new 2025 C172S, delivered straight from Wichita. Never have flown a new plane before. Quite a nice machine I must say, hard to believe it’s a 172. The G1000NXI is definitely a step up from the previous generation. Nothing is dinged up, broken or worn - yet ;)

That is all. :D

Nice! Did your school have to break the engine in, or did Cessna do that for you?

While G 1000xi are nice, I wonder if it wouldn't be a great trainer with the less expensive six pack. Or at least a couple of G275s. If you put the "standard" six pack instruments in it and the type certificate, you can rely on an STC for the G1000 xi upgrade option if you really want it.

Also, I'm thinking of a local school that got a bargain on several older 172's that had the older G1000's in them, non WAAS. As that specific model of G1000 is part of the type certificate, they'd have to spend a lot and buy an entirely new G1000 xi system (assume there's an STC for that). No option / no STC's to replace with G275's, etc. Believe it or not, your flight school's new plane's G1000 xi will be obsolete someday, well before the plane wears out.
 
Nice! Did your school have to break the engine in, or did Cessna do that for you?

While G 1000xi are nice, I wonder if it wouldn't be a great trainer with the less expensive six pack. Or at least a couple of G275s. If you put the "standard" six pack instruments in it and the type certificate, you can rely on an STC for the G1000 xi upgrade option if you really want it.

Also, I'm thinking of a local school that got a bargain on several older 172's that had the older G1000's in them, non WAAS. As that specific model of G1000 is part of the type certificate, they'd have to spend a lot and buy an entirely new G1000 xi system (assume there's an STC for that). No option / no STC's to replace with G275's, etc. Believe it or not, your flight school's new plane's G1000 xi will be obsolete someday, well before the plane wears out.
We broke it in.

G1000 NXI is a great trainer.
 
We broke it in.

G1000 NXI is a great trainer.
Or worse, you could ferry a 210 from Texas, run out of fuel and land it on a busy city street a couple miles from home, and be the owner of a major flight school operating out of KSAC.

 
I feel I got lucky when flight training in 2015. I started in a C172S six pak and about 1/2 way through they acquired a 2006? C172 G1000. I flew it about a third of my time flight training.
Helped me when I started flying G5s when installed in 2018. Still flying them today.
 
Last edited:
When I started college, we took delivery of a fleet of brand new 1999 172SPs. First and only brand new aircraft I've ever flown, complete with 6 pack and KLN89! Flying IFR with GPS felt like cheating after starting with VOR and ADF.
 
Had a student this morning in the flight school’s new 2025 C172S, delivered straight from Wichita. Never have flown a new plane before. Quite a nice machine I must say, hard to believe it’s a 172. The G1000NXI is definitely a step up from the previous generation. Nothing is dinged up, broken or worn - yet ;)

That is all. :D
Wichita or Independence?
 
In 50 years I'll be 116 years old. So if I am still alive, I am gonna put on a speedo, take a picture and post it here...
You know, with all the snazzy age enhancing photo editing software that exits, you could probably spin up a picture of what that would look like and post. Why wait! I'm sure a lot of folks here would want to take a look at Future Speedo Zeldman! :cool:

(Future Speedo Zeldman - I also vote that this becomes your new POA name).
 
You know, with all the snazzy age enhancing photo editing software that exits, you could probably spin up a picture of what that would look like and post. Why wait! I'm sure a lot of folks here would want to take a look at Future Speedo Zeldman! :cool:
For the love of humanity, I feel I should wait on this request.

But if the interest is high, I will be happy to set up a gofundme account for those wishing to purchase such pictures of future me...
 
Kind of a bummer that Textron can't come up with a business case to also produce a less nice but more affordable version. Piper 100i appears to be selling well.
Swap the G1000 for a 175 and a com, or 355, and a transponder, and steam gauges. Go with a carbureted engine instead of injected, which will also drop some weight (the newer 172s are pigs compared to vintage). Then ditch the upgraded upholstery and soundproofing and go with basic fabric seats (bring back the only adjustment being fore and aft) and minimal upholstery. All that would probably knock close a hundred grand off the price with no performance hit. Actually, there would be a useful load increase.
 
People say that, but the reality is, I haven’t been able to find a clear difference in performance. New ones (restart and later) handle so much nicer than the oldies.
I was thinking in terms of useful load and payload. Not much can be done to make them significantly faster. A constant speed prop sure helps takeoff and climb, but there’s the cost and weight.
 
Had a student this morning in the flight school’s new 2025 C172S, delivered straight from Wichita. Never have flown a new plane before. Quite a nice machine I must say, hard to believe it’s a 172. The G1000NXI is definitely a step up from the previous generation. Nothing is dinged up, broken or worn - yet ;)

That is all. :D

A Cezna ain’t a Cezna till it reeks of butt sweat and has so many bugs smashed on the LE you can’t see the paint…
 
I was thinking in terms of useful load and payload. Not much can be done to make them significantly faster. A constant speed prop sure helps takeoff and climb, but there’s the cost and weight.
Yeah useful load is a little different, but they perform equally, if not better than the old models. The extra horsepower of the 180hp makes up for the added weight of the avionics and such so it’s about a wash in that regard.
 
Swap the G1000 for a 175 and a com, or 355, and a transponder, and steam gauges. Go with a carbureted engine instead of injected, which will also drop some weight (the newer 172s are pigs compared to vintage). Then ditch the upgraded upholstery and soundproofing and go with basic fabric seats (bring back the only adjustment being fore and aft) and minimal upholstery. All that would probably knock close a hundred grand off the price with no performance hit. Actually, there would be a useful load increase.

Still no one would buy a bare bone 172 for $500k instead of $600k. The people spending that kind of money on an aircraft want the thrills.

Our FBO was one of the primary PiperSport dealers when Piper was marketing them. They offered three trim packages, base ($110k), mid ($120k), loaded ($140k). Almost everyone sold was loaded, maybe one or two mid packages, and not a single base.
 
Swap the G1000 for a 175 and a com, or 355, and a transponder, and steam gauges. Go with a carbureted engine instead of injected, which will also drop some weight (the newer 172s are pigs compared to vintage). Then ditch the upgraded upholstery and soundproofing and go with basic fabric seats (bring back the only adjustment being fore and aft) and minimal upholstery. All that would probably knock close a hundred grand off the price with no performance hit. Actually, there would be a useful load increase.
Steam gauges are full of tiny mechanical components that are all assembled by hand. Glass is full of microcircuitry that is all assembled by robotic machinery. Once enough companies are making it, the prices for glass will be cheaper than steam. We've already seen such shakeups when digital watches, at first really expensive, easily displaced the mechanical watches price-wise. Electronic calculators meant the almost-instant end of troublesome mechanical calculators. Televisions are far cheaper, once adjusted for inflation, due to their robot-assembled electronics, than the TVs of the 1960s and '70s.

A carb saves next to no weight at all over fuel injection. And it brings the risk of carb ice. About all one can say for a carb is that it's easier to start.

The FAR23 revisions of the early 1990s forced Cessna to build seats capable of withstanding 25G (front seats) and 19G (rear). THAT added a lot of weight. I have had the seats out of many 172s, and those restart seats are terribly heavy compared to the legacy stuff. But while they were at it, they also made the seat rails much (MUCH) sturdier and the locking mechanisms stronger and more stupid-proof. Much more crashworthy. They seem to have recognized that they had to build that stuff to work in spite of the poor maintenance so many airplanes get.

The leather upholstery is a little heavier than the fabric. It is thin stuff. The interior panels are considerably heavier. The larger engine adds weight. But Cessna beefed up a lot of weak areas in the structure, and beefing-up almost always adds weight. The G1000 stuff, taken together, weighs more, maybe a lot more, than the old steam gauges and radios. The PFD and MFD units (screens) alone are heavier than all the steam stuff and basic radios. I've had those out, too. Lots of stuff in them. Most would be surprised to pick one up off the bench. Weight. What it looks like from the backside. It's a couple of inches thick:

1752459077751.png

Out of sight ahead of that PFD is a 24-volt standby lead-acid battery, like so:

1752459188957.png

It's not light, either. The main battery is a 24-volt unit that weighs more than the old 25-amp-hour 12-volt battery the old 172s used.

There is a raft of G1000 stuff under the rear baggage shelf. There are several remote-mounted boxes in a rack there that very few people know are there. There isn't room in or behind the instrument panel for all the necessary computing stuff, so it went into the tailcone. More weight. Thick cables run from that rack under the floor forward and up to the instrument panel. That installation looks like this:

1752460916273.png

By now I imagine that Dynon has an equivalent system suite that is more compact and lighter.

We bought a low-time 2006 172SP in 2008. Its empty weight was about 300 pounds more than the 172Ms we had, and its gross was only 250 pounds more, so we lost about 50 pounds of useful load.

It would be hard to reduce the 172S's weight. The heavier seats are mandated, but one could make them of titanium and save weight, but then nobody could afford the airplane at all.
 
Had a student this morning in the flight school’s new 2025 C172S, delivered straight from Wichita. Never have flown a new plane before. Quite a nice machine I must say, hard to believe it’s a 172. The G1000NXI is definitely a step up from the previous generation. Nothing is dinged up, broken or worn - yet ;)

That is all. :D

Give it a week ... someone on a discovery flight during the 2 pm heat of the afternoon will probably have a puke accident:oops:

When I was a student, my scheduled C-152 was not available for this exact reason on flight right in front of my rental block time ...
 
When I started college, we took delivery of a fleet of brand new 1999 172SPs. First and only brand new aircraft I've ever flown, complete with 6 pack and KLN89! Flying IFR with GPS felt like cheating after starting with VOR and ADF.
Isn't that is the Sporty's poster picture?
99 172SP panel picture with a KLN89?
 
That’s cool flying one so new. Curious if flying wise you notice much difference flying the new vs. old if Cessnas made much improvement? I’m sure the 180 Hp news ones have helps some. But they fly any nicer and less worn out feeling or basically still the same old 172 just fancier looking?
 
I have flown several different 172's. The M and N models performed far better than the later model ones. Even flew a 150hp one on floats, it didn't do too bad. I haven't flown one of the brand new ones, but I'd bet they are really heavy. Increasing gross weight looks good on paper, but its still basically the same plane.
 
I have about 40 hrs in a 2007 C172S with a G1000. It is noticeably heavier on the front end.
I feel my N model with a power flow exhaust on a 160 HP climbs the same or better than the 2007 172 that I flew.
 
Yeah useful load is a little different, but they perform equally, if not better than the old models. The extra horsepower of the 180hp makes up for the added weight of the avionics and such so it’s about a wash in that regard.
I would think that the G1000 + radios weighs less than a bunch of steam gauges and dual Dolly Partons with separate power supplies (tube radios!)
Still, our '65 Skyhawk (the term for the loaded version, ours was built as a T41 but never accepted by USAF, so it had all kinds of weird gauges, including carb throat temperature!) had a 915 lb. useful load (after replacing the radios with "light weight" KX155s).
 
Back
Top