$1,500 for Bonanza Landing Gear Relay

flyer299

flyer299

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Flyer299
I know older planes are getting harder and harder to find parts for and the prices are going up.

But I recently had some landing gear issues and after some good troubleshooting, my A&P says the Relay needs to be replaced. It is $1,500! ouch!

Is that the going rate for a relay?

Aircraft Details:
1980 Bonanza A36TC

Thanks
 
I've found its not that the parts are hard to find, it's just hard to pay for ;)
 
Used parts are much cheaper and readily available. I bought one less than a year ago for under $200.
 
Is that ordered through Beech/Textron ?

Often there are alternate sources for perfectly legal parts. We had an IA who would refuse to install anything not ordered through Beech. That kind of attitude can make maintaining the plane quite expensive.
 
Yep. I paid 350 bucks for a piper rheostat. Second one too (one in the Warrior, one in the Arrow). It's pretty tiresome. But, that's why I stay in the PA-28 line. Going into Comanche, bonanza or single cessna retract land is asking for even bigger niche/mummy pricing. Dreams of reprieve died with the part 23 re-write bait n switch. So for now I'll try to keep ownership on the simple side until the mission can draw down to a 2-seater, at which point I'm going exAB and never looking back. This certified mx parts costs and musky logbook documentation kabuki is the only thing that ever comes close to making me exit stage.
 
Don't let your A&P source parts like that, especially one that doesn't seem to have much regard for costs. Ask for the part number, look around, and you'll almost certainly find one cheaper. About the only thing I let my A&P source are very routine parts (gaskets, etc.) and specialty services (welding, etc.). For parts of any real value, I source them all on my own. If your A&P isn't ok with that arrangement, find a new A&P.
 
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bradg33 said:
Don't let your A&P source parts like that, especially one that doesn't seem to have much regard for costs. Ask for the part number, look around, and you'll almost certainly find one cheaper. About the only thing I let my A&P source are very routine parts (gaskets, etc.) and specialty services (welding, etc.). For parts of any real value, I source them all on my own. If your A&P isn't ok with that arrangement, find a new A&P.
Click to expand...


This, all...day....long!
 
bradg33 said:
Don't let your A&P source parts like that, especially one that doesn't seem to have much regard for costs. Ask for the part number, look around, and you'll almost certainly find one cheaper. About the only thing I let my A&P source are very routine parts (gaskets, etc.) and specialty services (welding, etc.). For parts of any real value, I source them all on my own. If your A&P isn't ok with that arrangement, find a new A&P.
Click to expand...

:yeahthat:
 
The only thing cheap about Bonanza aircraft are the pilots. If your a A&P and let your friend provide you with unairworthy parts and you install it you wont have your license for long.
 
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Someone told me this, today when I asked your question:

"About the only way to deal with that is to find a low time wreck in one of the salvage yards and get the dynamic brake relay from it.
Also, they can be disassembled carefully and the contacts cleaned to breathe new life into them if one cares to do that."
 
Nobody, but NOBODY in the general aviation manufacturing business does a "special" that the manufacturer must make specific for their product unless there is no way to use a generic OR automotive product with a "PMA" stamp put on it by the manufacturer. Sure, metalwork specific to the brand, hoses cut to length, and the like are manufactured. Most electrical parts are off the shelf from one manufacturer or another ... relays by Potter, starters by Ford or Chrysler, landing lights from Chalmers tractors, and all the rest of it.

If your A&P/IA is so paranoid that they won't let you do the legwork to find the exact replacement in a catalog and use it, then they need a refresher course on 21.303 (b)(2). All you need to do is draw the part up and then tell your NAPA or Digikey parts house you want part number A12345 from Boozefoo Manufacturing. Perfectly legal. Owner produced parts.

Brien, you are DEAD wrong. Sorry. And yes, I've had my A&P (& IA) for 50 years and so far the Feds haven't asked for them back.

By the way, relays normally don't "go bad" without being repairable, which is also legal. If you can take it out of the airplane and put 12 volts on the coil and hear a "click" then the contacts have gone TU and that is a ten cent spray of contact cleaner to fix.

Now I would NEVER recommend this as a fix, but if you spray the contacts with cleaner and then hook the relay up on the test bench with the coil connected to the normally closed contact, it will become a "buzzer" and clean the contacts in a couple of seconds. But I only know this because my friend Ernie does this, and I would NEVER do this to a certificated part. NEVER, do you hear me?

Jim
 
I have hear there are large groups of owners, including those in certain - ahem - type-specific clubs who will track down the origin of, or other sources of various parts (or a very reasonable facsimile of down to a 1/10mm of rubber trim or 0.01mA of current, or ...you get the idea) all provided by 'other than the a/c mfg' ("ottam").
I have no idea why they would do this, but have noted that it often happens after a part that might reasonably cost $0.10 to produce is found to be sold by ottam at a truly inexplicable Quintillion percentage markup.
(upon hearing about this, it is common for internet-based, wannabe pseudo-safety enforcers to exclaim how one may perish, then your soul will be forever be banished to a permanently dark place where no hope exists......and their comments you may certainly await forthwith)
I am well aware of all downsides to such actions - and only share what I hear, for the sake of friendly discussion.
 
btw....these are $15 MS parts....easily obtainable with a little internet research. Been there done it. :D
 
Its in a Beech owner's best interest that Beechcraft (whoever owns it at the time) is successful. Open wallet and hand over fists full of cash to help them be successful.

Or

Get McFarlane to build you new parts.
 
weirdjim said:
Nobody, but NOBODY in the general aviation manufacturing business does a "special" that the manufacturer must make specific for their product unless there is no way to use a generic OR automotive product with a "PMA" stamp put on it by the manufacturer. Sure, metalwork specific to the brand, hoses cut to length, and the like are manufactured. Most electrical parts are off the shelf from one manufacturer or another ... relays by Potter, starters by Ford or Chrysler, landing lights from Chalmers tractors, and all the rest of it.

If your A&P/IA is so paranoid that they won't let you do the legwork to find the exact replacement in a catalog and use it, then they need a refresher course on 21.303 (b)(2). All you need to do is draw the part up and then tell your NAPA or Digikey parts house you want part number A12345 from Boozefoo Manufacturing. Perfectly legal. Owner produced parts.

Brien, you are DEAD wrong. Sorry. And yes, I've had my A&P (& IA) for 50 years and so far the Feds haven't asked for them back.

By the way, relays normally don't "go bad" without being repairable, which is also legal. If you can take it out of the airplane and put 12 volts on the coil and hear a "click" then the contacts have gone TU and that is a ten cent spray of contact cleaner to fix.

Now I would NEVER recommend this as a fix, but if you spray the contacts with cleaner and then hook the relay up on the test bench with the coil connected to the normally closed contact, it will become a "buzzer" and clean the contacts in a couple of seconds. But I only know this because my friend Ernie does this, and I would NEVER do this to a certificated part. NEVER, do you hear me?

Jim
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Not sure that I have ever seen a entry in a log book "installed new relay part number *** from NAPA automotive parts store signed A&P ****"
 
brien23 said:
Not sure that I have ever seen a entry in a log book "installed new relay part number *** from NAPA automotive parts store signed A&P ****"
Click to expand...

That's because anyone with half a brain would stop the entry at "Installed new relay"
 
bradg33 said:
That's because anyone with half a brain would stop the entry at "Installed new relay"
Click to expand...

Actually they would start with, "Installed new relay manufactured to 21.303.b.2 in accordance with drawing XYZ123 filed in maintenance documents."

Drawing XYZ123 would then specify the manufacturer part number and any subsequent modifications the owner made, such as painting it blue, drilling a mounting hole, etc.

jw
 
weirdjim said:
Actually they would start with, "Installed new relay manufactured to 21.303.b.2 in accordance with drawing XYZ123 filed in maintenance documents."

Drawing XYZ123 would then specify the manufacturer part number and any subsequent modifications the owner made, such as painting it blue, drilling a mounting hole, etc.

jw
Click to expand...

That's how I understand it works.

Cheers
 
weirdjim said:
Actually they would start with, "Installed new relay manufactured to 21.303.b.2 in accordance with drawing XYZ123 filed in maintenance documents."

Drawing XYZ123 would then specify the manufacturer part number and any subsequent modifications the owner made, such as painting it blue, drilling a mounting hole, etc.

jw
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Why not now you send the 337 to OK city and the only one who sees it is the person scanning it into the system, you can do what you want nobody is checking the 337 anymore.
 
hindsight2020 said:
So for now I'll try to keep ownership on the simple side until the mission can draw down to a 2-seater, at which point I'm going exAB and never looking back. This certified mx parts costs and musky logbook documentation kabuki is the only thing that ever comes close to making me exit stage.
Click to expand...
If you think X/AB will get you cheaper parts try buying from Lightspeed, or SDS for parts. They ain't cheap but a better product than Factory OEM stuff.
 
GlennAB1 said:
Been doing it for 50 years and hasn't been caught. Based on what he's admitted in this forum, his A&P/IA should be revoked.
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If your caught of falsification of records all the FAA certificates you hold will be revoked, A&P, IA, Pilot everything.
 
brien23 said:
If your caught of falsification of records all the FAA certificates you hold will be revoked, A&P, IA, Pilot everything.
Click to expand...

Along with possible jail time. A friend of mine used to work for a guy who was an aircraft broker and decided to just start signing maintenance related stuff stuff off with no mechanic certificate. From what I was told, when he finally got caught he ended up spending 10 years in jail.
 
GlennAB1 said:
Been doing it for 50 years and hasn't been caught. Based on what he's admitted in this forum, his A&P/IA should be revoked.
Click to expand...

Who are you talking about? Nobody said anything about being "caught". You don't get "caught" doing things according to the regs and the opinions of the General Counsel.

OIC, this post was at 7:30 in the evening. Had your nose a little close to the schnapps bottle did we?

Jim
 
weirdjim said:
Who are you talking about? Nobody said anything about being "caught". You don't get "caught" doing things according to the regs and the opinions of the General Counsel.

OIC, this post was at 7:30 in the evening. Had your nose a little close to the schnapps bottle did we?

Jim
Click to expand...
What kind of smoke and mirrors are you pushing, a automotive part installed and assumed as a certified part for aircraft by some slick word game is falsification of records. Anybody that does that needs to get out of the aircraft maintenance business, and the Feds need to make sure they never come back.
 
If you want to use automotive parts build an aircraft or buy a Experimental aircraft and stay away from certified aircraft. You can't treat certified aircraft like Experimental aircraft and do what you want. If you can't or wont except that, you need to go someplace else like buy a boat and do what you want.
 
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weirdjim said:
Actually they would start with, "Installed new relay manufactured to 21.303.b.2 in accordance with drawing XYZ123 filed in maintenance documents."

Drawing XYZ123 would then specify the manufacturer part number and any subsequent modifications the owner made, such as painting it blue, drilling a mounting hole, etc.

jw
Click to expand...
"They would start with" is pretty vague and open ended.

I think most reasonable people will agree, 21.303 Parts Manufacturer Approvals, Application, isn't a valid sign off. It pertains to "Making application for approval, for parts manufacturing". Did you get that PMA Approval? Or do you figure that if the paperwork looks in order the FAA wont question it?
 
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remember....a PMA does not grant approval for every aircraft make and model installation.

So, you could have a part with a PMA stamp....and not approved for your aircraft. .....so, it depends on that. :D
 
We're talking about a guy taking some Chinese made auto part, modifying it, calling it "owner produced" when it was owner procured, not produced, and misconstruing PMA application process for actual PMA approval. And he's an IA.... my ass should be one too.
 
I don't know about other people's methods but installing automotive parts is not the bane of aeromotive.

brien23 said:
If you want to use automotive parts build an aircraft or buy a Experimental aircraft and stay away from certified aircraft. You can't treat certified aircraft like Experimental aircraft and do what you want. If you can't or wont except that, you need to go someplace else like buy a boat and do what you want.
Click to expand...

Try AC 20-62E on for size -

b.
Acceptable Parts. The following parts may be found to be acceptable for installation on a TC’d product:
(1)
Standard parts (such as nuts and bolts) conforming to an established industry or U.S. specification.

f.
Standard Part. Is a part manufactured in complete compliance with an established U.S. Government or industry-accepted specification, which includes design, manufacturing, and uniform identification requirements. The specification must include all information necessary to produce and conform to the part. The specification must be published so that any party may manufacture the part. Examples include, but are not limited to, National Aerospace Standard (NAS), Air Force/Navy (AN) Aeronautical Standard, Society of Automotive Engineers (SAE), Aerospace Standard (AS), Military Standard (MS), etc.
 
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