Can you learn in any plane?

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TAL

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Im looking at getting my PPL and buying the plane to learn in. At this time it is more research and learning than anything else and I feel it is best to ask questions early. ;)

So, can you learn and get your PPL in any plane? I ask because I was reading about endorsements required and all the planes I like require at least one and in some cases many endorsements.

Wondering if I can do it in a 6 seat dual turbo prop or if I need to look at specific planes for the lessons.
 
Go take an introductory flight and see if you even like flying. Seems almost like a troll to come and ask if you can begin lessons in a 6 seat dual turbo prop. Probably should start out in a Cessna 172 like most everyone else did.
 
Daleandee, im not a troll its an honest question. There is a story behind this but I did not want to post a wall of text to ask a single question. So Long story short.

I spent most of my teenage years living blocks from the local municipal airport and hanging out there summers and weekends. Ive ridden in many planes and loved it. (Though all of them were 6 to 12 seat planes.) However when I tried to sign up for training (30+ years ago) I was asked my weight and told that I could not do training. (6'@290lb) I took this to mean I could be get my PPL and kind of gave up on it. I did not realize that it probably had more to do with the UL of the training planes available at the school than my weight/ability to get the license. This was recently brought to my attention and ive been looking into it again.
 
Well, a friend of mine used to be a check pilot for one of the major airlines. According to him, some pilots seem like they never actually learned to fly anything before belting into a 777, so maybe it'll work out to start in a twin.
 
TAL said:
Daleandee, im not a troll its an honest question. There is a story behind this but I did not want to post a wall of text to ask a single question. So Long story short.
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Apologies to you ... didn't mean to offend but buying a six seat twin turbo prop airplane to learn to fly in seemed a bit unusual to say the least.

At your height and weight you cold do training in a Cessna 172/182 which are easier to find. But if you have enough coin for the six seat twin turbo then the problem will be finding an instructor. They are out there but might not be close to you.

Enjoy the ride ...
 
TAL said:
Daleandee, im not a troll its an honest question. There is a story behind this but I did not want to post a wall of text to ask a single question. So Long story short.

I spent most of my teenage years living blocks from the local municipal airport and hanging out there summers and weekends. Ive ridden in many planes and loved it. (Though all of them were 6 to 12 seat planes.) However when I tried to sign up for training (30+ years ago) I was asked my weight and told that I could not do training. (6'@290lb) I took this to mean I could be get my PPL and kind of gave up on it. I did not realize that it probably had more to do with the UL of the training planes available at the school than my weight/ability to get the license. This was recently brought to my attention and ive been looking into it again.
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Oh. So it could have been there was an issue with weight in whatever they're training in, but it also could have been the instructor didn't think you'd be able to get a medical. To get a PPL you need an FAA medical, and there are some things that can disqualify you for that. Post an anonymous message in the medical thread to ask about that. Whatever you do, don't just go schedule a medical without looking into it, because failing one can have permanent consequences. I'm not a doctor, but 6'/290 sounds like you might have some health things going on to me.

If you want to learn to fly and not get a PPL, you might be able to go sport pilot, but that will be tricky, too. Max weight is 1320lbs I believe, so typical payloads for those aircraft is in the 400lb range, more or less.
 
@Albany Tom At the time (high school) I was on the shot put and discus team and doing weight lifting. Now I weigh a bit more than that (desk jobs and covid work from home added some to my weight) and just did a physical with my Dr. Im not on any medication and my only medical condition is osteoarthritis in my shoulders and knees. For which the advice was take tylenol or ibuprofen.

@Daleandee Thank you, the budget is there I was just not sure if it was something that could be done or if I should look at smaller single prop planes to start and then when done try to sell the plane and buy the one I want.
 
I'm 6'6" and 300 lbs. I fly a 172 with instructors weighing 185-215. The only problem is we can't top the tanks on a hot summer day with high density altitude. Other than that no problem. I've looked at several options. Due to my size I'm avoiding most twins because I don't want to have to climb over seats when entering from the right. I've considered the Cessna 337, but the retractable gear really ups the insurance cost. Finally decided on the 182 since it has the useful load in most configurations to carry all four of my family with decent range, and excessive range if I fly solo with full tanks. Again, not the retractable version. Easier/cheaper to maintain than a twin, simpler to fly, stable and fun. A little on the slow side, but a fair trade-off. We're currently actively shopping for a 182 for the family (all four of us fly including the 16 year old twins).
 
Awesome that you are in good health. I'd still double check on the medical, as you can be in pro-basketball shape and be a big guy, but still trip up some automatic things that are based on weight/height of average people. Maybe and hopefully nothing, but doesn't hurt to check first.

I like Pipers, but I'll second the 172/182 recommendation. Shouldn't be too tough to find someone to teach in that.
 
It will be really hard to insure, I’d think. If it can be done it will be crazy expensive for the first few years.
 
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Ah, no, bad idea. Find a local school, get your ppl in a trainer. Then work up to a twin turbo prop. Go for a discovery ride to get an idea of what it is about.

If you have any psych meds, adhd, or dui in your past, then getting a medical will be an issue. I believe the faa may require a sleep study if you are over a certain bmi.

Do your homework, there's a lot to learn.
 
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Can you? Yes. Should you? No.

Learning to fly, including learning to land, is rough on airplanes sometimes. Bang up someone else’s airplane, then buy what you want.
 
I soloed in an sr20 and took my checkride in an sr22 with a high performance endorsement. Technically you could learn in a TBM or Bonanza but the costs and learning curve will be steep.

no reason why you can’t do it in a T or TN high performance single. You could get a PPL in a multi if you were really inclined.
 
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TAL said:
Im looking at getting my PPL and buying the plane to learn in. At this time it is more research and learning than anything else and I feel it is best to ask questions early. ;)

So, can you learn and get your PPL in any plane? I ask because I was reading about endorsements required and all the planes I like require at least one and in some cases many endorsements.

Wondering if I can do it in a 6 seat dual turbo prop or if I need to look at specific planes for the lessons.
Click to expand...
There is a lot to learn to fly an airplane. There is a lot to learn to become a private pilot. There is also a lot to learn to become an airplane owner. Right now you have near zero knowledge on each of them. That means the amount you can learn is limited by how much you already know. As your knowledge and experience grows so does your ability to learn more.

Start with a good forgiving single engine fixed prop and fixed tri-gear, and learn how to fly and land. Buy one like it and learn XC, get your PPL and learn how to own and maintain your bird. Then look for the best bird for you and get the ratings you need to fly it. There is a whole lot more to selecting and flying an airplane then how many engines and the number of passengers. Forgiving flight characteristics is high on my list of must haves.
Hope this helps.
 
William Pete Hodges said:
There is a lot to learn to fly an airplane. There is a lot to learn to become a private pilot. There is also a lot to learn to become an airplane owner. Right now you have near zero knowledge on each of them. That means the amount you can learn is limited by how much you already know. As your knowledge and experience grows so does your ability to learn more.
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This is why I find it best to ask questions early. The responses often show/highlight just what I dont know and many times lead to questions I never knew to ask.


So let me open this up. Seeing as there is a lot I dont know, What would everyone suggest as a starting point? Not necessarily the plane but in general.
 
TAL said:
This is why I find it best to ask questions early. The responses often show/highlight just what I dont know and many times lead to questions I never knew to ask.


So let me open this up. Seeing as there is a lot I dont know, What would everyone suggest as a starting point? Not necessarily the plane but in general.
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Discovery flight at a local airport, ask the questions of the cfi who takes you up. In fact, rather than a discovery flight, which are cheap so therefore usually very short, since funds aren't an issue for you, ask for a lesson, tell them it's your first and you are trying to figure out how to proceed. Tell them you want to spend an hour flying. You'll get a good taste of what it's about and what you need to do to get going.
 
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TAL said:
This is why I find it best to ask questions early. The responses often show/highlight just what I dont know and many times lead to questions I never knew to ask.


So let me open this up. Seeing as there is a lot I dont know, What would everyone suggest as a starting point? Not necessarily the plane but in general.
Click to expand...
IMO, the path of least resistance - and efficiency - is to start in a simple trainer. At the student-to-private pilot stage you are really learning the basics of aircraft control, navigation, and communication. Comes down to learning to walk before learning to run a marathon. Once the basics are learned and evaluated by a checkride, the whole world is open to you.

One can, of course, take their very first driving lessons in an 18-wheeler if that's their ultimate goal, but for most, I suspect a car makes more sense.
 
TAL said:
So let me open this up. Seeing as there is a lot I dont know, What would everyone suggest as a starting point? Not necessarily the plane but in general.
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I’ve always loved the B-25 and the P-38, but if you really need turbine power I think a Twotter would be cool. Have fun. I think you should go with your original plan. No one ever goes all out any more; we’re getting soft. Do it. Buy the twin, get your ticket in it. Start a YouTube channel. :)
 
In 1993, the Busch folks invaded CPS due to flooding at their preferred airport.

While I was there, I became aware of a new King Air 200 that had arrived. Being a "little small" for the Busch collection, I asked one of the staff about it.

Was told it was bought so that August IV could earn his PPL.

So, yeah, you can.
 
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midlifeflyer said:
IMO, the path of least resistance - and efficiency - is to start in a simple trainer. At the student-to-private pilot stage you are really learning the basics of aircraft control, navigation, and communication. Comes down to learning to walk before learning to run a marathon. Once the basics are learned and evaluated by a checkride, the whole world is open to you.

One can, of course, take their very first driving lessons in an 18-wheeler if that's their ultimate goal, but for most, I suspect a car makes more sense.
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Yes, this is good advice. My experience training (when moving up) in faster more expensive airplanes is that instructors tend not to be as relaxed. They don't let things get as out of sorts as they do in slower, less expensive, easier to recover airplanes. So my sense is that you miss out on figuring out some things for yourself. Also, there is a lot more worry about when your time could be better spent learning fundamentals.
 
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TAL said:
This is why I find it best to ask questions early. The responses often show/highlight just what I dont know and many times lead to questions I never knew to ask.


So let me open this up. Seeing as there is a lot I dont know, What would everyone suggest as a starting point? Not necessarily the plane but in general.
Click to expand...

Try reading "Buying and Owning Your own Airplane" it has a ton of information you will find useful.
 
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TAL said:
Wondering if I can do it in a 6 seat dual turbo prop
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Assuming money is no object and you can self-insure, etc...

One could argue that training in something simple like a Navion or Bonanza and them moving up would be more economical, but if money is no object...
 
If you want to learn how to fly an airplane and you are not constrained by budget, go for the two-seat version of the Extra 300. Starting out in a King Air just won’t let you learn enough about stalls and unusual attitudes.
 
You learn more about sailing from the little boats than the big ones. I feel aviation follows that line.

Find a 172 to train in, they're everywhere. If the ergonomics are no good, find a 182. If that's no good, find a baby Beech (Sundowner/Musketeer) -- the fellow I bought my Sundowner from was 6'6 and 360#.

You should probably also track down that CFI and kick him in the bonch for discouraging you so early without explaining his reasoning. A vendetta is a great use of a new private pilot certificate. :D
 
midlifeflyer said:
One can, of course, take their very first driving lessons in an 18-wheeler if that's their ultimate goal, but for most, I suspect a car makes more sense.
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Funny story, I only ever had one driving lesson. When I was 16 I bought an early 70's mustang with a 4 speed stick. The guy I bought it from took me out to the lake, I drove around the lake a couple of times, then drove him back to his house and drove home. Over the next week I read the dmv book and took the test. Passed on my first try.

William Pete Hodges said:
Try reading "Buying and Owning Your own Airplane" it has a ton of information you will find useful.
Click to expand...

Thank you, Ill look into getting that book.

Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe said:
Assuming money is no object and you can self-insure, etc...
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Wait, you can self-insure? Ive not come across that anywhere. As to money being no object, Im married so there is a limit. :p
 
TAL said:
Funny story, I only ever had one driving lesson. When I was 16 I bought an early 70's mustang with a 4 speed stick. The guy I bought it from took me out to the lake, I drove around the lake a couple of times, then drove him back to his house and drove home. Over the next week I read the dmv book and took the test. Passed on my first try.
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Once upon a time, everyone learned with a stick. Complexity comes in levels.
TAL said:
Wait, you can self-insure? Ive not come across that anywhere. As to money being no object, Im married so there is a limit. :p
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Unless you are based in the handful of states (less than a half dozen as I recall) which require it or you are based at an airport which requires it, there is currently no required liability insurance in the US. Hull insurance ("collision/fire & theft" in car lingo) is, of course, always optional. You'd have to read the state statutes and airport minimum standards to find whether you can self insure where it is required. But I suspect that self-insuring will be more trouble than it's worth.
 
I think it’s a bad idea in general, but regardless, it will be faster and cheaper to train in a rented 172 than in an owned turboprop. Hourly fuel costs alone for the turboprop are more than wet rental costs for a 172. It doesn’t make financial sense, and it doesn’t make practical training sense.

If you’ve got turboprop money, the cost of renting a plane for training is immaterial anyway.
 
I learned in a 182, so did my father and my son. That will give you plenty of room and enough speed and payload to go on trips after you get your PPL. Good instrument platform as well. Get your PPL and IR, then multi IR and you'll be legal in smaller twin turbo props, not smart or insurable, but legal!!
 
TAL said:
Im looking at getting my PPL and buying the plane to learn in. At this time it is more research and learning than anything else and I feel it is best to ask questions early. ;)

So, can you learn and get your PPL in any plane? I ask because I was reading about endorsements required and all the planes I like require at least one and in some cases many endorsements.

Wondering if I can do it in a 6 seat dual turbo prop or if I need to look at specific planes for the lessons.
Click to expand...
Insurance will be well nigh impossible to get. But insurance might not be an issue if it’s just you because survival rate for turbine twin crashes isn’t good
 
TAL said:
Im looking at getting my PPL and buying the plane to learn in. At this time it is more research and learning than anything else and I feel it is best to ask questions early. ;)

So, can you learn and get your PPL in any plane? I ask because I was reading about endorsements required and all the planes I like require at least one and in some cases many endorsements.

Wondering if I can do it in a 6 seat dual turbo prop or if I need to look at specific planes for the lessons.
Click to expand...

i’m impressed. usually the silly money wait until they at least get their 60 hours on their ppl before they start buying into planes that they have no business
See people this is what I’ve been talking about. All, this is an accident waiting to happen. There’s always somebody says oh but now I can do it all and I have the money and it doesn’t really matter because I have the money. Did I tell you I have a Lotta money. Because money is not an problem. Im a smart guy, I should be able to fly in anything I can afford to pay for, right? I’m tired of flying the airlines and I really need something to replace my Escalade because it is so slow. so I can take all my buddies and all our fishing/diving/skiing gear up/down to wherever.
And no this is not an anti-rich rant, it’s an anti-stupid rant.
 
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Morgan3820 said:
And no this is not an anti-rich rant, it’s an anti-stupid rant.
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Buying a King Air before your first flight lesson would be ignorant. Doing that after seeking advice about whether it’s a good idea would be stupid. Getting the advice and then adjusting the plan to achieve a better outcome is neither.
 
iamtheari said:
Buying a King Air before your first flight lesson would be ignorant.
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I would have argued for the Pilatus PC-12, but the O.P. specified a twin.

I'd buy one myself, but I don't have that kind of money, and it doesn't qualify as an LSA. But other than that...
 
TAL said:
Im looking at getting my PPL and buying the plane to learn in. At this time it is more research and learning than anything else and I feel it is best to ask questions early. ;)

So, can you learn and get your PPL in any plane? I ask because I was reading about endorsements required and all the planes I like require at least one and in some cases many endorsements.

Wondering if I can do it in a 6 seat dual turbo prop or if I need to look at specific planes for the lessons.
Click to expand...

I needed a endorsement to even touch the controls in the aircraft I learned in, plus a extra endorsement, on top of the normal solo endorsement, to act as pic.
 
If buying a twin turboprop is budget friendly for you, then buying a 172 and trading up after initial training shouldn't be an issue either.
 
Kevin Eggert said:
If buying a twin turboprop is budget friendly for you, then buying a 172 and trading up after initial training shouldn't be an issue either.
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And there will come a time when you'll reflect on how many types of aircraft you've flown. Training in a trainer before buying a twin turboprop will up your number by 1. Or more.
 
There is a whole generation of pilots from Asian countries, trained from the ground up in simulators, who have never actually flown an airplane before taking the right seat of a passenger jet. And for that matter, have never hand-flown a real airplane other than on takeoff and short final. So yeah, you can learn in whatever. Do I think it's a good idea? Ask the passengers of Asiana Airlines Flight 214 how well that worked out.
 
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