19 Year Old Woman Begins Attempt Of Solo Around The World Flight

EdFred said:
She's been around aviation for most of her life. Pretty sure she has as as much or more experience than quite a few in this thread. Maybe not loggable experience, but experience. Just because it doesn't go in the logbook doesn't mean it didn't happen. I don't give a crap whether she's a she, a he, a he-she, a she-he or a banshee. She's an adult, she can do what she wants. If she has the financial backing and logistics to get it done, then go for it. Now if she ends up in Peru and has run out of money and starts a gofundme or something to get her the rest of the way, then criticism is in full order. I hope she does better than that last kid who attempted it and started begging for help.

The only disdain I have is that she has someone else paying for all of it and, well, I have to self finance my flying. But we have those people here on PoA too. So it is what it is.

As far as the record goes...without looking it up...who held the 100m record before Usain Bolt? Set the bar high enough (or age low enough) and you'll be remembered for a long time.
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I hope you’re right. I suspect the “80 hours” is probably a lie to hype it up all the more. But not Having an instrument rating before this type of attempt is a bad thing any way you look at it.
 
Everskyward said:
It means modest.

Not sure how that squares with wanting to do this so publicly. But I have never understood the wish for this kind of attention. Or maybe I should say I understand it, I just never desired it.

I have no problem with her doing this. As @steingar points out, 19-year-old men and women go to war, which is far more dangerous. A 16-year-old girl has sailed around the world singlehanded and there were the same sorts of arguments. I think a number of teens, both male and female have done this.
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I find the going to war arguments very weak. Before war there is a lot of training and during war the kids are not in charge or alone. That’s my hang up with all of the “youngest to do” records. Minimal experience and youthful minds cast out alone do do something that isn’t worth it in my opinion.

And that’s really the bottom line. It’s my opinion. I’m not claiming any righteousness but to have my opinion dismissed because I’m a sexist is just insulting.

shame on you @David Megginson
 
Tarheelpilot said:
...And that’s really the bottom line. It’s my opinion. I’m not claiming any righteousness but to have my opinion dismissed because I’m a sexist is just insulting....
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that's how it's done these days...........any different opinion and you instantly become a sexist, racist, any other ist. if you aren't jumping up and down, cheerleading for the topic at hand, you're the devil. it's pathetic, boring, and weak, but it's all the rage these days.
 
Tarheelpilot said:
Minimal experience and youthful minds cast out alone do do something that isn’t worth it in my opinion.
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You might ask where the parents were if we're talking about minors, but as @EdFred pointed out, she's 19 and an adult. She's not being "cast out" as far as I can tell. She's making her own decision, which seems much less risky than other decisions a 19-year-old could make about her (or his) life.
 
Salty said:
I hope you’re right. I suspect the “80 hours” is probably a lie to hype it up all the more. But not Having an instrument rating before this type of attempt is a bad thing any way you look at it.
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If you have the time to sit for a week or so and have access to all weather, no matter where you are in the world, I don't see the IR being really necessary, or even the lack of it a bad idea. I did a 4400nm XC and I had the IR, and didn't incorporate any of my training into that flight save once. I only used it out of convenience (I didn't want to get banged around at 3000' over Oklahoma in July, and had a nice cool flight above the cloud deck and only got a pop up clearance to descend through it, though I probably could have found a hole.
 
eman1200 said:
that's how it's done these days...........any different opinion and you instantly become a sexist, racist, any other ist. if you aren't jumping up and down, cheerleading for the topic at hand, you're the devil. it's pathetic, boring, and weak, but it's all the rage these days.
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Exactly. I'm an emanist.
 
It's a good thing that none of the people actually out there accomplishing their goals have to get permission from the Nervous Nellies of POA. It's a tiresome ****ing theme how discouraging some people are.
 
Tarheelpilot said:
I find the going to war arguments very weak. Before war there is a lot of training and during war the kids are not in charge or alone. That’s my hang up with all of the “youngest to do” records. Minimal experience and youthful minds cast out alone do do something that isn’t worth it in my opinion.

And that’s really the bottom line. It’s my opinion. I’m not claiming any righteousness but to have my opinion dismissed because I’m a sexist is just insulting.

shame on you @David Megginson
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I think the war comparison is that there were a lot of pilots thrown into the fire with less than 100 hours. Of course that wasn't a good thing and a lot of those guys proved to be easy prey for more experienced pilots.
 
Salty said:
I hope you’re right. I suspect the “80 hours” is probably a lie to hype it up all the more. But not Having an instrument rating before this type of attempt is a bad thing any way you look at it.
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OTOH,....

If an 80-hour, 19-year-old VFR pilot in a light sport manages to pull this off, maybe people will finally stop talking about what a great pilot Amelia was supposed to have been. ;)
 
EdFred said:
If you have the time to sit for a week or so and have access to all weather, no matter where you are in the world, I don't see the IR being really necessary, or even the lack of it a bad idea. I did a 4400nm XC and I had the IR, and didn't incorporate any of my training into that flight save once. I only used it out of convenience (I didn't want to get banged around at 3000' over Oklahoma in July, and had a nice cool flight above the cloud deck and only got a pop up clearance to descend through it, though I probably could have found a hole.
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I agree that it's not that big of a deal. Just means she'll have to be more careful about the weather and be prepared for delays that might not have occurred otherwise. Looking at her schedule it looks like she spent an extra day in Greenland presumably due to weather.
 
Everskyward said:
You might ask where the parents were if we're talking about minors, but as @EdFred pointed out, she's 19 and an adult. She's not being "cast out" as far as I can tell. She's making her own decision, which seems much less risky than other decisions a 19-year-old could make about her (or his) life.
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I respect your opinion but don’t agree.
 
misogynist hat on
The most famous female pilot is Amelia Earhart and she's famous for failing. Jus' sayin'
Y'all should get a move on to get someone more famouser to represent ya.
/hat off

This girl would be a better example than Amelia.
 
EdFred said:
misogynist hat on
The most famous female pilot is Amelia Earhart and she's famous for failing. Jus' sayin'
Y'all should get a move on get someone more famouser to represent ya.
/hat off

This girl would be a better example than Amelia.
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Didn't Amelia have her boy friend with her too?...but this gal now has GPS...so there is that.
 
EdFred said:
misogynist hat on
The most famous female pilot is Amelia Earhart and she's famous for failing. Jus' sayin'
Y'all should get a move on to get someone more famouser to represent ya.
/hat off

This girl would be a better example than Amelia.
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There is no way this little poser will replace my female pilot hero. That lady taught me how to fly. She’s a saint among sinners.
 
Tarheelpilot said:
I understand the argument. I just don’t think it holds water.
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I'm not saying it's a good comparison, just that I understand where it came from.

I don't think it holds up well either due to the distinct differences in necessity between this and wartime.
 
EdFred said:
....This girl would be a better example than Amelia.
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eh, magenta line, yadda yadda.....so much easier to do these days, as proven by the dozens and dozens who've already done what she's doing.
 
eman1200 said:
eh, magenta line, yadda yadda.....so much easier to do these days, as proven by the dozens and dozens who've already done what she's doing.
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Technology improves. That's like dissing Gagarin or Armstrong because they weren't strapped to some cage Goddard designed.
 
EdFred said:
Technology improves. That's like dissing Gagarin or Armstrong because they weren't strapped to some cage Goddard designed.
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no it's not. you can SEE the moon. you know, get there VFR. heck, with no instruments.
 
EdFred said:
Dude, you can't even get to two states away on time.
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see, exactly my point. that's because I still use a mechanical watch. if I had one of them fancy apple watches it'd be a piece of cake!
 
Log book hours, other hours, and IFR skills. Yes, she lacks the magic IR on her passport to legal flying.

When my son bought a logbook and started his training, it was empty. But back when he was too small to see over the instrument panel of a C 172 with the adjustable seat all the way up, he flew 2 continuous hours in actual instrument conditions. I did the ATC communications and changed radio frequencies, but he climbed to the cruise altitude and maintained altitude to IR standards, and center line of the VOR airways. No magenta line, the old stuff.

I was quite proud, as I had taught him that skill

The point is that this 19 year old may actually have quite a bit of IR TRAINING AND SKILLS, BUT NO RATING.

My son found that flying by outside reference harder than on instruments, but a lot more fun.
 
geezer said:
Log book hours, other hours, and IFR skills. Yes, she lacks the magic IR on her passport to legal flying.

When my son bought a logbook and started his training, it was empty. But back when he was too small to see over the instrument panel of a C 172 with the adjustable seat all the way up, he flew 2 continuous hours in actual instrument conditions. I did the ATC communications and changed radio frequencies, but he climbed to the cruise altitude and maintained altitude to IR standards, and center line of the VOR airways. No magenta line, the old stuff.

I was quite proud, as I had taught him that skill

The point is that this 19 year old may actually have quite a bit of IR TRAINING AND SKILLS, BUT NO RATING.

My son found that flying by outside reference harder than on instruments, but a lot more fun.
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Years ago, my daughter, by the age of 13, had over 100 unlogged hours flying the plane, including some IMC. I didn't have an autopilot at the time, but she was quite good at holding an altitude and heading, once for 3 hours straight (in VMC). I never took my eyes off the panel for more than a few seconds, and occasionally gave a small assist with the trim wheel or rudder, but her help made it easier to fold maps, take bearings (no GPS yet), figure out new clearances, or just rest my arms. She was also solid for preflighting the plane, spotting traffic, etc, and even once reminded me about a missed radio call.

Kids in flying families who are engaged with the activity grow up to the trade, like a kid on a farm or in a family with a fishing boat. University and moves to other cities got in the way of her pursuing a PPL after she was 17, but she's still interested when her own family finances permit, and she'll inherit C-FBJO if I still own it when I close my logbook for the last time.
 
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geezer said:
The point is that this 19 year old may actually have quite a bit of IR TRAINING AND SKILLS, BUT NO RATING....
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which will help when she either purposely OR accidentally flies into IMC?? I mean I agree, and I 'think' most of us agree as well...it's far better to have the training and clearly much more beneficial to have the rating than to not have it. I don't think anyone is saying much else besides it would really benefit her to have more training/real world experience THAN WE KNOW SHE HAS. a lot of "maybe she has this, maybe she has that". that's worth absolutely nothing.
 
I have no skin in this and so I really don't know why I'm even posting... but whatever, a few posts caught my eye

Tarheelpilot said:
Before war there is a lot of training and during war the kids are not in charge or alone
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I think it's reasonable to assume that this flight has a fair bit of preparation involved with it too.. I agree in principle that the "go to war" argument is a weak one, but why the assumption this person will be alone and have no training or preparation?

Salty said:
without having properly prepared for it
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There's a theme of lack of training / preparation for this in a number of posts. Why are we assuming that she has no real training and lack of preparation for this? I haven't kept up with this that closely other than what's been posted in PoA, but is there some reason we're assuming she's unprepared?

Salty said:
If she started training 5 years ago, how does she only have 80 hours of experience? And do you think someone that’s racked up 80 hours in 5 years is so passionate about aviation that she’s the driving force in her making this trip
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$$? It took me seven, 7, freaking years to get to 100 hrs. Doesn't mean I was any less passionate about flying, I simply couldn't afford it until 5-6 years ago. I log 100-120 hrs/yr now, but that's not because of any shift in my desire


RE: IR
-I agree the training would be beneficial, BUT, she's probably better off avoiding any kind of clouds/weather altogether to begin with

In general:
I didn't read the media posting etc., but I will say that aviation needs more people flying, and needs more positive (vs negative) media attention. This country was founded on a desire to be free, and aviation is one of those activities that best embodies that sense of freedom. We are very lucky to live somewhere that anyone with basic health, intellect, and financial means, CAN, with enough hard work, walk out to an airport, get in a plane, and go flying. How cool is that?! I wish the pilot success
 
geezer said:
Log book hours, other hours, and IFR skills. Yes, she lacks the magic IR on her passport to legal flying.

When my son bought a logbook and started his training, it was empty. But back when he was too small to see over the instrument panel of a C 172 with the adjustable seat all the way up, he flew 2 continuous hours in actual instrument conditions. I did the ATC communications and changed radio frequencies, but he climbed to the cruise altitude and maintained altitude to IR standards, and center line of the VOR airways. No magenta line, the old stuff.

I was quite proud, as I had taught him that skill

The point is that this 19 year old may actually have quite a bit of IR TRAINING AND SKILLS, BUT NO RATING.

My son found that flying by outside reference harder than on instruments, but a lot more fun.
Click to expand...

David Megginson said:
Years ago, my daughter, by the age of 13, had over 100 unlogged hours flying the plane, including some IMC. I didn't have an autopilot at the time, but she was quite good holding at an altitude and heading, once for 3 hours straight (in VMC). I never took my eyes off the panel for more than a few seconds, and occasionally gave a small assist with the trim wheel or rudder, but her help made it easier to fold maps, take bearings (no GPS yet), figure out new clearances, or just rest my arms. She was also solid for preflighting the plane, spotting traffic, etc, and even once reminded me about a missed radio call.

Kids in flying families who are engaged with the activity grow up to the trade, like a kid on a farm or in a family with a fishing boat. University and moves to other cities got in the way of her pursuing a PPL after she was 17, but she's still interested when her own family finances permit, and she'll inherit C-FBJO if I still own it when I close my logbook for the last time.
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Flying on instruments is like a video game. Great fun if you’re into that. Maybe kids these days would be a natural!
 
Rushie said:
Flying on instruments is like a video game. Great fun if you’re into that. Maybe kids these days would be a natural!
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I have to say, too, that a lot of the flight instructors at my airport look like children to me now. I know they're probably well into their 20s, but they seem like teenagers. That's just the perspective you end up with as you get older, I guess.

When I was young, I'd watch films of WWII aircrews and think "look at those brave men going up into battle"; now, I look at them and think "what kind of a monster would send those children up in that thing?"
 
David Megginson said:
I have to say, too, that a lot of the flight instructors at my airport look like children to me now. I know they're probably well into their 20s, but they seem like teenagers. That's just the perspective you end up with as you get older, I guess.

When I was young, I'd watch films of WWII aircrews and think "look at those brave men going up into battle"; now, I look at them and think "what kind of a monster would send those children up in that thing?"
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OMG YES!! It’s so disconcerting to have an apparent 14 year old drill my teeth or do laser surgery on my eyeball…
 
David Megginson said:
I have to say, too, that a lot of the flight instructors at my airport look like children to me now. I know they're probably well into their 20s, but they seem like teenagers. That's just the perspective you end up with as you get older, I guess.

When I was young, I'd watch films of WWII aircrews and think "look at those brave men going up into battle"; now, I look at them and think "what kind of a monster would send those children up in that thing?"
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All of my CFIs were younger than my youngest kid. But they didn't mind teaching tricks to an old dog and it didn't bother me too much.

In my last couple of years at work, though, I'd often walk into a meeting, look around at the attendees, and think "Did I miss the announcemet about 'Bring Your Kid to Work Day?'"
 
Half Fast said:
All of my CFIs were younger than my youngest kid. But they didn't mind teaching tricks to an old dog and it didn't bother me too much.

In my last couple of years at work, though, I'd often walk into a meeting, look around at the attendees, and think "Did I miss the announcemet about 'Bring Your Kid to Work Day?'"
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I'm the oldest person in my UN team now, by almost 10 years. I used to be only the second oldest until a colleague left a couple of years ago. I should have bribed him to stay.

I remember decades back at age 27, when I was a new assistant prof teaching my first graduate course. I was the youngest person in the class then (younger than all the graduate students); I have a better idea now what that must have been like for them.

And to be fair, while some of the posts in this thread have specifically disparaged Zara because of her gender (and one even got transphobic for some undetermined reason), there is a good chance that others are just plain ageist.

I get that. When you're over 55, you both worry that you're not getting the respect or reward you think you deserve for your own life experience, and you start to underestimate the abilities of younger people in an attempt to make yourself feel more important (witness all the millennial jokes from people who don't realise that the millennials are into their 40s now). Male mid-life crisis is an emotionally-vulnerable time of life, almost as rough as adolescence. It's good business for airplane and avionics vendors, though, because we middle-aged men have a lot more spending money than teenage boys. :)
 
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