Years later, odd reaction and another rant

[Ralph Parmenter Bennett]

After being a CFII for many decades years & an educator, I think I understand some of the feelings of the OP. CFI's while often being excellent pilots often lack adequate communication skills and a knowledge and sensitivity to the importance of the subtleties of the dynamics necessary for effective learning. I often found that the young male CFI's difficulties with communication skills were echoed in their interactions with the women in their life. Just like any other relationship in life, find a CFI who seems willing to adjust to who you are and your learning issues. CFI's hold a significant influence we have over the aviation present and future time of their students. It is a privilege that comes with significant responsibility.
I would guess that what I wrote will not be all that well accepted.

 

[flyingcheesehead]

There are plenty of cases saying that a CFI giving instruction is always “deemed” to be PIC.

Right, but that doesn't automatically make them the PIC as was stated. The FAA will happily fry both the instructor and the owner-pilot.

My read of 61.51(e) says both the instructor and student can log the time as PIC.

We're not talking about logging at all. That's an entirely separate issue.

After completing an IR, I am coming to a similar conclusion r/e actual IFR east of Lake Michigan. A friend commented once "there's about 5 days in the year when you can actually use an instrument rating in Michigan" Most of the time, It's either VFR , or thunderstorms, or icing.

Not even close. There are plenty of days where there's flyable actual around the Great Lakes, like @EdFred said. Unfortunately, there's also a lot of chicken/uneducated pilots/instructors who don't think that's true at any time between September and May. In reality, Jan/Feb usually don't have icing - It's too cold!

Flyable IMC days merely demand that you learn more than the bare minimum PTS/ACS stuff, plan and execute properly. Learn about what causes icing, plan so that you have outs, and go fly.

 

[chemgeek]

Well, not everyone can teach. Even in academics, where you think the should be able to. It's supposed to be fun and interactive. I guess I was lucky. A college IT Specialist I knew at work happened to be a CFII and was an excellent teacher with a plan to get me ready to fly IFR. Not to pass the checkride. To fly IFR. Every hour was fun, if occasionally task saturated. We flew all over creation, including a lot of actual getting practical experience and learning the gotchas with an experienced person by your side. The checkride was a breeze, and my first solo IFR flight was unexpectedly in IMC. Thanks, teach.

It's too bad you couldn't hook up with a good instructor. They can be hard to find.

 

[midlifeflyer]

A lot of folks knock the younger CFI's ... guess I was lucky years back needing transition training when I bought the Tiger (5 hrs insurance requirement). Did it flying home central Texas to El Paso.

CFI was 21 years old, when I asked his age, he responded if it might be a problem with me ... I indicated none whatsoever. He was flying gliders at 11 years old, took multiple check rides on his 16th birthday and had a TON of flying hours and experience. His knowledge for all the avionics capabilities including all sorts of "tricks" using the new to me Garmin 530, stormscope, etc. One of the best pilots I've ever flown with ...

I’ve flown with a number of CFIs and have worked with more. With very few exceptions, they were good and cared about their students’ progress and accomplishments.

 

[Notrub]

I would say half my instructors were D’s half I knew more and half were fantastic…. In all my 7 rides with a dpe something imperative was left out by the instructor!


I learned the most from the terrible instructors….flying is so individual, find a fast pace well healed program and travel to them!

 

[4RNB]

I’m glad that after 8 years the OP got this off his chest.

 

[Gilbert Buettner]

After completing an IR, I am coming to a similar conclusion r/e actual IFR east of Lake Michigan. A friend commented once "there's about 5 days in the year when you can actually use an instrument rating in Michigan" Most of the time, It's either VFR , or thunderstorms, or icing.

Like others, I disagree. I lived in Kalamazoo for 14 years and flew IFR most of the time. When the "permacloud" arrives in November, you really have little choice until March. You get low ceilings, but usually the tops are also fairly low as well.

 

[bbchien]

"permacloud". Can I use that?

 

[Gilbert Buettner]

"permacloud". Can I use that?

Absolutely. I first encountered it while living near Rochester, New York.

 

[chemgeek]

After completing an IR, I am coming to a similar conclusion r/e actual IFR east of Lake Michigan. A friend commented once "there's about 5 days in the year when you can actually use an instrument rating in Michigan" Most of the time, It's either VFR , or thunderstorms, or icing.

Probably the most significant value of and IFR rating in a light single is taking away all the angst of trying to fly in MVFR conditions. My impetus for the IR were several unpleasant experiences flying "VFR" in 4-5 miles visibility in summer haze, flying uncomfortably low and bumpy below a broken or overcast ceiling with low tops, and a few occasions wondering if I was going to get "stuck" on top when trying to avoid the previous situation.

IFR, you file and climb above all the crud where visibilities are better, air is cooler and smoother, and there are no worries getting back down at your destination. I've flown maybe one or two IFR flights in solid overcast or benign rain in the clag from takeoff to landing. That's not usually typical. Typical is getting above 8000 MSL tops into smooth air, or flying between layers on benign but otherwise crappy days on the ground.

Of course icing and CBs are a no-go in a light single. So mid-November to the end of April the northeast can be challenging. CBs are mostly an afternoon thing in the summer, and can often be avoided by flying in the early morning.

I fly in Central NY where there are endless lake effect clouds or cutoff lows much of the year that make VFR unpleasant, but in warmer months are otherwise no hazard. If I didn't have an IR, I wouldn't be able to take trips anywhere very often. The year I got my IR it rained every weekend from Memorial day to Labor Day. I only got 17 hours of VFR in that year.

 

[flyingcheesehead]

Of course icing and CBs are a no-go in a light single. So mid-November to the end of April the northeast can be challenging.

But again, just writing off those months as automatically unflyable means you're* missing out on a lot of good flying days and the utility of the airplane. (* the general "you", not @chemgeek specifically.)

Use the "license to learn" and LEARN. Learn to interpret Skew-Ts, learn to plan flights with outs for icing, and then go fly some of those flights. You definitely need to be willing to execute the outs, but the best way to learn is to plan and fly. Or if you can't fly, at least look at the weather and then look at PIREPs for icing and see what others are encountering.

It's sad to see how many people up here in the north close their hangar doors in November and don't open them again until spring.

 

[chemgeek]

But again, just writing off those months as automatically unflyable means you're* missing out on a lot of good flying days and the utility of the airplane. (* the general "you", not @chemgeek specifically.)

"Challenging" is not the same thing as "unflyable." It just means that during the cold-weather months you have to be a lot more flexible in your travel plans. But the reality is that no light single is an "all-weather" machine. It doesn't matter if you have an IR or not if the weather is unflyable. Having the IR unlocks some otherwise unflyable (or unsafe but flyable) weather. An aircraft with de-icing equipment and/or pressurization would unlock additional flyable weather, but that comes with a price in both acquisition and maintenance and training/competence.

I've done late fall and early spring trips, and the occasional winter trip when juicy, ice-laden lake-effect clouds are not widespread as they are wont to be in my region, but those trips require special awareness for icing avoidance in a simple light single. And often the weather is just not acceptable for flying on a given day (or week).

 

[flyingcheesehead]

"Challenging" is not the same thing as "unflyable." It just means that during the cold-weather months you have to be a lot more flexible in your travel plans. But the reality is that no light single is an "all-weather" machine. It doesn't matter if you have an IR or not if the weather is unflyable. Having the IR unlocks some otherwise unflyable (or unsafe but flyable) weather. An aircraft with de-icing equipment and/or pressurization would unlock additional flyable weather, but that comes with a price in both acquisition and maintenance and training/competence.

Yup. Each time you get more weather-capable - That is, you add the IR, and then radar, and that fancy pressurized whiny plane - You gain the capability of flying in more weather but you make the go/no-go decision harder.

I've done late fall and early spring trips, and the occasional winter trip when juicy, ice-laden lake-effect clouds are not widespread as they are wont to be in my region, but those trips require special awareness for icing avoidance in a simple light single. And often the weather is just not acceptable for flying on a given day (or week).

I have much more trouble with icing in late fall/early spring than I do in midwinter regardless of whether the clouds were lake-generated or not... And that's what I'm getting at. When it's January or February and you're sick of winter and just want to GTFO, you can almost always climb through the clag and pick up zero icing, because all that moisture is already frozen. Regardless of what month it is, it just takes a little extra knowledge (past the PTS/ACS knowledge) and the planning of outs. I still get great cross-country utility from my little metal non-deiced spam can all year long.

 

[bbchien]

I wrote an article about that in Aviation Safety- Jan 2002 ( & in Dec 2003)...and about that time, moved to a FIKI aircraft. Doesn't affect how one thinks, plans or changes plans, however....

 

[DJTorrente]

I’m glad that after 8 years the OP got this off his chest.

You have my nomination and full support for president of

...the odious bunch that considers [pilot] exclusion the feature, not the bug.

It would be in all pilots' enlightened self-interest for there to be more pilots, even if it did make them slightly less impressive at singles bars and cocktail parties.