Who do you blame for GA downfall.

When I moved here, I was going to rent planes until I found one to buy. I got a checkout in a 172 from a flight school, and then went to get on the scheduleo go fly. They said I needed insurance. No problem, sez I, renter’s insurance. Problem, sez they. I needed full coverage for the hull value. They recommended an aircraft insurance agent tow buildings over. Fancy that.

It looked like 90%+ of their business is foreign Part 141 students - already easy to soak for overpriced cookie cutter training, and just as easy to let them bear the insurance cost. Seems to me the school could spread the cost of insurance across all the students and have it baked into the hourly. With as many students as they have, it wouldn’t be a deal killer - probably along the lines of five bucks an hour, maybe ten.

I’d only gone to three flight schools, two Part 61 and one mixed, for various ratings, and never had to have full coverage.
 
AKiss20 said:
Didn’t we just have this same thread like 3 weeks ago? Has anyone’s opinion changed since then?
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KE5BM said:
Maybe a mod could just combine them all into one super-thread of gripes, moans, b***es, and complaints. :D
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Jim K said:
Then we'd have like 4 threads, and everyone would ***** about necroposting.
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Ed Haywood said:
Nominations:
1. Aviation costs money!
2. Which airplane is best?
3. Dumb stuff pilots say and do
4. Why crash happen?
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!. Everything does cost (too much) money, which is just a fancy way of saying "I don't have enough money".
2. High wing Pipers, obviously, (with the Taylorcraft and Aeronca lines being second and third).
3. "I think I'll fly a *****." (Something other than a high wing Piper, Taylorcraft, or Aeronca.)
4. Gravity, which is a fancy way of saying "the planet sucks", duh.

So, as a public service, I've answered all of those lingering questions. Now, we can discuss something else. :cool:
 
midwestpa24 said:
Possibly. Like the ever prevalent hangar shortages we all hear about. Theoretically there are less and less GA aircraft operating in the US, we are destroying them faster than we are building them, yet we have hangar waiting lists? Where are these aircraft coming from? Are we losing hangars somewhere else, or even entire airports? Is the shortage only at population centers while rural airports are going vacant?
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We are losing parking and hangers at larger airports. KPBI is a good example. Used to be many single engine planes parked at pbi. airport expansion forced them out. My airport KSUA lost three shade hangers about 24 spots. Hangers torn down to make more ramp area. Those planes left. I know three that were sold by owners. Gone forever.
 
I didn't read through the 3 pages of answers but saw @Jim K already wrote something similar: It does not seem like it's declining, at least not where I'm at or ever was. I lived on the Canadian west coast, the Canadian Prairies and spent significant time in Ontario. Now I live in the Dallas area and spend significant time in Northwest Florida. Hangars everywhere were and are packed with GA airplanes. I always got lucky to find, at the very least, a roof for my plane within a reasonable timeframe but that's not the norm in any of the 5 places mentioned above. I also reached out to clubs to have a backup for when my own plane is undergoing maintenance, no spaces available anywhere. I think a "dying" hobby looks differently. Look at stamp or coin collecting if you're looking for a dying hobby.
 
That brought back some memories. Some factoid for posterity: the original hitler video's claim to fame occurred more than 14 years ago, emanated from that bastion of quality of life known as KBAD, and the airframe contained within. It was called " hitler cant pcs", and though it originally follows hitler as a burnt out buff crew chief, the video quickly became an anthem of all manners of pcs reclamas within that black hole. This of course reaches fever pitch in the aftermath of bent spear '07, which is why the video stems from said period.

I'd know, i was there when they took down yt access on base once it went viral. I may or may not know people involved in the creation and popularization of said masterpiece. Again, just a few more years til im legally allowed to tell you how i really feel lol.

BTW, the term the beatings will continue until morale improves was popularized in SAC, which was reactivated under a different name (global strike) following that boo boo. It's amazing how trolling cult classics grow a mind of their own and make it into civilian parlance, far removed from the people and circumstances that created it. Good times.
 
Chrisgoesflying said:
I didn't read through the 3 pages of answers but saw @Jim K already wrote something similar: It does not seem like it's declining, at least not where I'm at or ever was. I lived on the Canadian west coast, the Canadian Prairies and spent significant time in Ontario. Now I live in the Dallas area and spend significant time in Northwest Florida. Hangars everywhere were and are packed with GA airplanes. I always got lucky to find, at the very least, a roof for my plane within a reasonable timeframe but that's not the norm in any of the 5 places mentioned above. I also reached out to clubs to have a backup for when my own plane is undergoing maintenance, no spaces available anywhere. I think a "dying" hobby looks differently. Look at stamp or coin collecting if you're looking for a dying hobby.
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The reason it doesn't seem to be declining is because it isn't. The FAA Airmen (and women) statistics are here. The pilot count bottomed out towards the later part of last decade, and the number of certificated pilots has been increasing since. It also is likely to be concentrating. A few days ago I saw a map of the U. S. by GDP. The wealth in this country is very concentrated around the large metro areas.
 
Iflydogs said:
Not just GA. I blame our culture of safetyism for the downfall of lots of good things, like having children. 50 years ago it was 2.5 kids per woman, now it’s 1.6—a rate at which the US would be depopulating if not for immigration. I blame carseats, I struggle getting my grandchildren into them, they are strapped in tighter than Ham the Space Chimp. Sure we want safety, but we seem to have lost a sense of reasonableness along the way, there is no appreciation for tradeoffs. Sure carseats are marginally ( arguably) safer, but how much and at what cost? I know my wife and I would not have had 5 kids if we had to deal with those seats, we would have stopped at 1.
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Given my experiences with a good chunk of the local public, I see a reduction in reproduction as a good thing…at least if their kids replicate their behavior…
 
What I find interesting with these "general aviation" discussions is the differences in how they use and define the term GA. It actually covers a number of separate markets of which 65+% are business related aircraft. So when "GA" stats are posted they're inclusive of all those markets to include the private, recreational Part 91 market... which has been in an overall decline since 1980. Unfortunately, data specific to that Part 91 market is mainly behind paywalls and other private sources.

So while it may appear that "GA" hasn't declined, it has made a huge shift to the business side of the spectrum as mentioned in post #57. Which in turn has left the Part 91 private market surviving on the scraps left over. Is it more location specific? Sure. But the overall numbers don't lie across the board. One only needs to look at what GA markets get the OEM investments and which don't. Or the numbers of small A&P shops that have closed with no replacements. Or the closing of 10 small GA airports on average per year. And so on. GA in general has never stopped growing, however, the days of the Part 91 private aircraft having all the clout are gone.

So unless Part 91 owners collectively can see that and make a stand, I think you'll see more limitations emerge as Signature buys more FBOs catering to PC-12s or Beech Denalis vs PA-28s on a burger run, or worse having to fly 200 miles to find an APIA. And if the comments I hear from my peers who still work in the mx industry are valid, unless the changes in MOSAIC or something similar are issued, it may be more a sooner than later scenario on the mx support side for those Part 91 aircraft.
 
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I live in a small town (~9,000) and we have a 3,000' paved strip operated by the local Port Authority. Despite being a small town, we have quite a bit of flight instruction going on here. Some youngsters, some folks well into their careers. It is a promising sign to me. At some point, I want there to be demand for my plane when it is time for me to take up more sedentary pursuits. Right now, that looks more likely than it did 10 years ago when I bought my plane.
 
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