which plane best fits this mission?

bluerooster said:
What I find interesting, not bad, but interesting, is that there are many choices out there for a fast airplane that will fit the bill. I crunched the numbers, and in my Cherokee, the trip from NJ to FL can be made in about 9 hours, with one fuel stop. At 160kt, it's just under 8 hours, with one fuel stop.
What I found to be most interesting indeed was indicated on a recent trip to TX, I flew commercial. Took about 12 hours to get to my final destination, when had I gone by Cherokee, it would have been ~8 hours. And believe it or not, would have been less expensive. (but at least the booze on the tube was free, :D )
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We were recently doing some figures for a potential trip out to Montrose from San Diego.. the commercial tickets were about $600 (crazy), had at least one stop and took about 8 hrs total travel time. A car trip is 12-14 hrs, and flying via AztecAirlines is by far the fastest, and actually as far as fuel goes, the cheapest option

There are (some, limited) perks to traveling commercial, but by and large GA always beats out. Sure the A320 is going 500-600 knots, but when you add all the extra nonsense time in I have found for anything under 1,000 to 1,200 nm just easier to go GA
 
82Wideglide said:
I've been watching Comanches lately, because they really seem like a great answer for the "real" 4 seat XC, but insurance for a low time pilot has gone through the roof on them - I have seen $4600 / year. Same for a Cherokee 6. Not sure how some of the other choices fair in this regard.
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I know things are changing in the insurance world, but in 2018 I bought a Comanche 250 as a one year vfr ppl and insurance was 2400.

Edit: Also my longest leg/flight was 1200 miles and my useful load is 1250lbs. I love my Comanche.
 
Cessna T182T. I’ll get 160-165kts up high, 150 below 10k feet not taking wind into consideration. Pretty much book numbers.
 
AA5Bman said:
Are you flying 500 miles one way or 900 miles one way? If it’s the latter, I would put a real premium on speed. As mentioned above, an M20K seems pretty good for your mission. Your focus on six seats vis-a-vis insurance cost is misguided. I can almost guarantee that my six seat plane (205) costs me about half of what it would cost me to insure a four-seat M20K.
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900 one way. One stop usually around South Carolina.
 
asicer said:
That's 2 fuel stops if IFR. Even going VFR, that's cutting things a bit too close for my comfort level.
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I plan for 10gph. I have 49.75 gallons usable, that's so close to 5 hours. And given an actual burn of ~8gph it's way more than 5 hours fuel on board.
For VFR, an hour reserve is way plenty. for a 9 hour trip, that's one fuel stop.
 
Tantalum said:
We were recently doing some figures for a potential trip out to Montrose from San Diego.. the commercial tickets were about $600 (crazy), had at least one stop and took about 8 hrs total travel time. A car trip is 12-14 hrs, and flying via AztecAirlines is by far the fastest, and actually as far as fuel goes, the cheapest option

There are (some, limited) perks to traveling commercial, but by and large GA always beats out. Sure the A320 is going 500-600 knots, but when you add all the extra nonsense time in I have found for anything under 1,000 to 1,200 nm just easier to go GA
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Depends. Starting and ending points make a huge difference. If both are in major cities, then non-stop flights can make a difference.

Atlanta to Denver - airlines
Atlanta to Pueblo - toss-up
Ringgold to Pueblo - definitely GA​

The distances between those three sets is pretty much the same.

We flew from Atlanta to Pueblo a month ago to visit our daughter. We flew the SR22. We could bring stuff to her. We could set our schedule. The fastest way there via airlines was to fly to Denver and then drive 2 hours to Pueblo. Now I count more than fuel costs. Partially because there are more costs, and partially because I'm in a co-ownership which means I get to recognize those other costs right away. The airlines would have been cheaper, for just economy seats, but fairly close for business. I didn't check on rental cars prices :eek: , which right now could easily swing the cost advantage back to GA. We also got to see Doc, the B-29, in Wichita on our lunch stop. :cool:

Back when the kids were younger and four of us were flying, it was often cheaper to fly GA. Often quicker to arrive too. :D Definitely more fun and more options.

Now with just the two of us, it's flexibility over costs for the most part. Oh, we can do shorter hops cheaper. Like up to see our daughter in Lexington. Plus thing like being able to bring back bottles of bourbon from various distilleries when we visit our daughter in Lexington. :D Those flights are quicker also, as we don't have 1.5 hours at Hartsfield on the way there.

I personally wouldn't plan a skiing trip months in advance and plan to fly from Atlanta to Salt Lake City or somewhere in Colorado (Vail, Breck, etc). Too far and too much ice. Even if we lived closer, it is just too much of a chance for ice. :eek:

We were going back-and-forth on flying the SR22 or going commercial to Albuquerque in October to see the balloon festival. Finally bought airline tickets. It's a little cheaper, but not a lot as I'm not getting stuffed into a coach seat. Nuh uh, no way. Comfort+ at a minimum. Part of that is driving up to Santa Fe, then Taos as well to visit some of my wife and SIL's family, then to Pueblo to see our daughter. Doing all of that with my wife's sister and BIL. If it had just been Albuquerque, then Pueblo and back home we might have flown in the SR22.

So, it depends. :)
 
wayne said:
Depends. Starting and ending points make a huge difference. If both are in major cities, then non-stop flights can make a difference.

Atlanta to Denver - airlines
Atlanta to Pueblo - toss-up
Ringgold to Pueblo - definitely GA​

The distances between those three sets is pretty much the same.

We flew from Atlanta to Pueblo a month ago to visit our daughter. We flew the SR22. We could bring stuff to her. We could set our schedule. The fastest way there via airlines was to fly to Denver and then drive 2 hours to Pueblo. Now I count more than fuel costs. Partially because there are more costs, and partially because I'm in a co-ownership which means I get to recognize those other costs right away. The airlines would have been cheaper, for just economy seats, but fairly close for business. I didn't check on rental cars prices :eek: , which right now could easily swing the cost advantage back to GA. We also got to see Doc, the B-29, in Wichita on our lunch stop. :cool:

Back when the kids were younger and four of us were flying, it was often cheaper to fly GA. Often quicker to arrive too. :D Definitely more fun and more options.

Now with just the two of us, it's flexibility over costs for the most part. Oh, we can do shorter hops cheaper. Like up to see our daughter in Lexington. Plus thing like being able to bring back bottles of bourbon from various distilleries when we visit our daughter in Lexington. :D Those flights are quicker also, as we don't have 1.5 hours at Hartsfield on the way there.

I personally wouldn't plan a skiing trip months in advance and plan to fly from Atlanta to Salt Lake City or somewhere in Colorado (Vail, Breck, etc). Too far and too much ice. Even if we lived closer, it is just too much of a chance for ice. :eek:

We were going back-and-forth on flying the SR22 or going commercial to Albuquerque in October to see the balloon festival. Finally bought airline tickets. It's a little cheaper, but not a lot as I'm not getting stuffed into a coach seat. Nuh uh, no way. Comfort+ at a minimum. Part of that is driving up to Santa Fe, then Taos as well to visit some of my wife and SIL's family, then to Pueblo to see our daughter. Doing all of that with my wife's sister and BIL. If it had just been Albuquerque, then Pueblo and back home we might have flown in the SR22.

So, it depends. :)
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As with anything there's a balance. Flying yourself is more fun, but once you mix in weather, a tighter schedule, and other constraints you start leaning towards commercial. Totally agree on the city pairs as well.. a lot of the places I like to go are "off the beaten path" so the GA option gets more and more favorable
 
I am surprised no one has mentioned the Bellanca Viking. Published TAS is 163kts and 800 NM range. It is a 3 place but you only need 2 seats anyway. The rest is for baggage.

Addendum: apparently early Vikjngs were 3 place and later ones were 4 place? I am not sure here and am continuing my research. I seriously considered a super Viking before buying my Mooney Super21
 
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William Pete Hodges said:
I am surprised no one has mentioned the Bellanca Viking. Published TAS is 163kts and 800 NM range. It is a 3 place but you only need 2 seats anyway. The rest is for baggage.

Addendum: apparently early Vikjngs were 3 place and later ones were 4 place? I am not sure here and am continuing my research. I seriously considered a super Viking before buying my Mooney Super21
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There are 4 seats in my 1989 Viking. There were 4 seats in the 1966 model my father bought in 1966.
 
jimhorner said:
There are 4 seats in my 1989 Viking. There were 4 seats in the 1966 model my father bought in 1966.
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I like the Viking but I was reluctant because my airplane sits outside a week at a time when I travel. Last year that added up to over 6 weeks in the rain and sun. I have been told that the Viking would be ok, but then I found my Super21 and that settled it.
 
Viking is viable, presuming the following:
1. Hangared. No exceptions
2. Knowledgeable shop that’s knows the type, including wood wing and fabric covering.
3. Awareness that electronic upgrades are possible, but a narrower range sometimes due to STCs.
Four people? Yes, so long as they’re not buffalos. Useful load is btwn 950 and 1000;
60gals in the mains and 15 in the aux, so with all tanks filled, it’s a two seater.

160mph is not a reach. It likes the taste of avgas; expect 14-15gph, so on the mains alone you could make 600 miles… just. Plan 500: many of us have 3-4 hour bladders.
One of many options.
Money no object? Get a Mooney Acclaim. Loved mine; easy 200 knots and over 900 mile range. Sold mine because I couldn’t justify it.
 
Dustin Hawkinson said:
I know things are changing in the insurance world, but in 2018 I bought a Comanche 250 as a one year vfr ppl and insurance was 2400.

Edit: Also my longest leg/flight was 1200 miles and my useful load is 1250lbs. I love my Comanche.
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In late 2020 I was quoted $2500 with 1200 hrs, IR, 15 hrs complex/hp retract time, 0 Comanche time.
 
Rcmutz said:
60k
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That's about what mine is insured for. Expect that number to drop by about half when you hit the magic number of retract/time in type. I don't know if that's 25, 50, 100...
 
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