What is appropriate behavior for a DPE?

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lbbj14

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lbbj14
I just recently had a checkride, and passed. However, it was probably one of the worst experiences I have had in my life. I was completely caught off guard with how this examiner treated me while flying the aircraft. I have had other DPE's in the past for other checkrides and have never had any issues. During the flight portion of the checkride, the examiner berated and yelled at me the ENTIRE time. I honestly don't know how I pulled through it and didn't end up crashing the plane into the ground. He was extremely impatient, constantly looking at his watch and phone, had me rush through my maneuvers, and told me maybe I should reconsider flying. To say that he was a "jerk" would be putting it lightly. I have never been so berated in my life. After the flight, he told me that the FAA is currently doing surveys on checkrides due to certain events that have happened, and that I would be getting a survey on how the checkride went. He slyly threatened me to answer it carefully, because if he falls under investigation, then my rating could possibly be at stake and I would have to redo the checkride with an FAA DPE. I feel that how I was treated was unacceptable, but I'm not sure what to do and who to go to with this. Any help or suggestions would be great, thanks.
 
lbbj14 said:
I just recently had a checkride, and passed. However, it was probably one of the worst experiences I have had in my life. I was completely caught off guard with how this examiner treated me while flying the aircraft. I have had other DPE's in the past for other checkrides and have never had any issues. During the flight portion of the checkride, the examiner berated and yelled at me the ENTIRE time. I honestly don't know how I pulled through it and didn't end up crashing the plane into the ground. He was extremely impatient, constantly looking at his watch and phone, had me rush through my maneuvers, and told me maybe I should reconsider flying. To say that he was a "jerk" would be putting it lightly. I have never been so berated in my life. After the flight, he told me that the FAA is currently doing surveys on checkrides due to certain events that have happened, and that I would be getting a survey on how the checkride went. He slyly threatened me to answer it carefully, because if he falls under investigation, then my rating could possibly be at stake and I would have to redo the checkride with an FAA DPE. I feel that how I was treated was unacceptable, but I'm not sure what to do and who to go to with this. Any help or suggestions would be great, thanks.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=71Lft6EQh-Y
 
lbbj14 said:
Any help or suggestions would be great, thanks.
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Tell your CFI that you recommend no further students be sent to that examiner because he treats them shabbily.

It's about all that you can do.

Then move on.
 
Did he scorn iacra and bring his own electric typewriter?
 
LOL. If you're not a troll, PM me the name of your examiner. Sounds kind of like the DPE I went to, but I passed, so I didn't give it much more thought. :D
lbbj14 said:
I just recently had a checkride, and passed. However, it was probably one of the worst experiences I have had in my life. I was completely caught off guard with how this examiner treated me while flying the aircraft. I have had other DPE's in the past for other checkrides and have never had any issues. During the flight portion of the checkride, the examiner berated and yelled at me the ENTIRE time. I honestly don't know how I pulled through it and didn't end up crashing the plane into the ground. He was extremely impatient, constantly looking at his watch and phone, had me rush through my maneuvers, and told me maybe I should reconsider flying. To say that he was a "jerk" would be putting it lightly. I have never been so berated in my life. After the flight, he told me that the FAA is currently doing surveys on checkrides due to certain events that have happened, and that I would be getting a survey on how the checkride went. He slyly threatened me to answer it carefully, because if he falls under investigation, then my rating could possibly be at stake and I would have to redo the checkride with an FAA DPE. I feel that how I was treated was unacceptable, but I'm not sure what to do and who to go to with this. Any help or suggestions would be great, thanks.
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This is the problem with the FAA's extreme rationing of examiner designations. In an open market these turkeys would be weeded out in a hurry.
 
Without going into the details of what would be appropriate behavior, that described by the OP ain't it. If you get that survey, be completely honest, as once the button was pushed in IACRA, there is nothing more that examiner can do to you (as long as you don't go back to him for a future certificate/rating, and it sounds like there's not much chance of hat happening). Beyond that, discuss it with your instructor and let him/her decide if bringing this to the attention of the FSDO is warranted.
 
Be ironic if bad surveys caused another round of retests...
 
Ron Levy said:
Without going into the details of what would be appropriate behavior, that described by the OP ain't it. If you get that survey, be completely honest, as once the button was pushed in IACRA, there is nothing more that examiner can do to you (as long as you don't go back to him for a future certificate/rating, and it sounds like there's not much chance of hat happening). Beyond that, discuss it with your instructor and let him/her decide if bringing this to the attention of the FSDO is warranted.
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Except that the OP's DPE was (allegedly) invoking the spectre of Edward Lane. The "threat" would be coming from the FAA in the form of a retest or 709 ride, if the complaint resulted in the DPE's designation getting pulled.

But I agree that the OP is likely a troll.
 
azure said:
Except that the OP's DPE was (allegedly) invoking the spectre of Edward Lane. The "threat" would be coming from the FAA in the form of a retest or 709 ride, if the complaint resulted in the DPE's designation getting pulled.
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Telling the FAA the DPE was a total jerk and too harsh may get his designation yanked, but it won't result in people being retested.
 
Ron Levy said:
Sure -- and that had nothing to do with the examiner being a jerk or too harsh -- just selling ratings without properly testing the applicants.
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But... But... The pilots had to RE TEST...:rolleyes:
 
N801BH said:
Agreed 100%....

Guy shows up on POA.. First post...:rolleyes:,....:rolleyes2:
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First off, not a guy. Sorry to everyone, my intentions are not to troll. I actually had to look up what that meant, since I generally don't use forums. After this situation, I searched the internet to help guide me in the right direction on what I should do and couldn't find much. So I joined this forum in a genuine search for help. I was hoping that I could get any good feedback or advice from other fellow pilots. So I do appreciate the responses.
 
MauleSkinner said:
Can you say, "I am terminating this checkride. Please provide a Letter of Discontinuance."?
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I really wish I would have done that, and if I could go back in time, I would have. I was just so caught off guard that it didn't cross my mind until after.
 
lbbj14 said:
First off, not a guy. Sorry to everyone, my intentions are not to troll. I actually had to look up what that meant, since I generally don't use forums. After this situation, I searched the internet to help guide me in the right direction on what I should do and couldn't find much. So I joined this forum in a genuine search for help. I was hoping that I could get any good feedback or advice from other fellow pilots. So I do appreciate the responses.
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That's funny.....
Every lbbj14 I ever met was a guy.......;)

Sorry for the mistake...........:redface:........:D
 
Ron Levy said:
Without going into the details of what would be appropriate behavior, that described by the OP ain't it. If you get that survey, be completely honest, as once the button was pushed in IACRA, there is nothing more that examiner can do to you (as long as you don't go back to him for a future certificate/rating, and it sounds like there's not much chance of hat happening). Beyond that, discuss it with your instructor and let him/her decide if bringing this to the attention of the FSDO is warranted.
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Thanks for the help, I appreciate it
 
lbbj14 said:
I really wish I would have done that, and if I could go back in time, I would have. I was just so caught off guard that it didn't cross my mind until after.
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He issued the rating. No way to go back on that without it splattering on him way more than it would on you.

Only problem would be if he had a buddy in the FSDO "fixing" stuff (it happens), but if you are getting a survey it sounds like they've already had complaints and are investigating. Be honest and let him get what he deserves.
 
Ron Levy said:
Telling the FAA the DPE was a total jerk and too harsh may get his designation yanked, but it won't result in people being retested.
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Of course, being a jerk wouldn't have that result, but it all depends on whatever else they find when they investigate him. An abusive DPE may have a history of abusing his authority in other ways too. Just something to be aware of before dropping the dime.
 
N801BH said:
That's funny.....
Every lbbj14 I ever met was a guy.......;)

Sorry for the mistake...........:redface:........:D
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:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:
Damn, there are funny people on this board.
That's just funny right there.
 
azure said:
Of course, being a jerk wouldn't have that result, but it all depends on whatever else they find when they investigate him. An abusive DPE may have a history of abusing his authority in other ways too. Just something to be aware of before dropping the dime.
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Well, yeah, they might find out he abuses children or is a sexual predator or any number of other things, too, but that isn't the issue. The FAA only does that reexamination deal if they think the examiner involved has been letting people slide without meeting the requirements, and there is nothing here to suggest that's happening.
 
Ron Levy said:
Well, yeah, they might find out he abuses children or is a sexual predator or any number of other things, too, but that isn't the issue. The FAA only does that reexamination deal if they think the examiner involved has been letting people slide without meeting the requirements, and there is nothing here to suggest that's happening.
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Only the DPE's own statement that the OP would be facing a retest. Could be an empty bluff or a sly admission that he's done that too. If it was me I would be all the more determined to bring him to the attention of the FAA, but it's a possibility if this guy is really that ornery. IOW, if he likes an instructor he overlooks deficiencies that should be a bust, others he treats their students like he treated the OP.

Funny you should mention child abusers. Trying to dissuade the victim from turning them in by threatening consequences from parents or the police is a classic abuser tactic. Different context, same pattern.

Just saying that assuming the OP is for real and is describing what happened accurately, there may be more than meets the eye here.
 
azure said:
Only the DPE's own statement that the OP would be facing a retest. Could be an empty bluff or a sly admission that he's done that too.
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Could be the DPE isn't really a DPE at all but is using another DPE's identity, but there's no evidence of that, either, so I'll stick with the empty bluff theory.
 
Frnakly, if someone encouraged me to falsify a survey (under threat or not) I'd report him even if it did mean I was volunteering for a 709 ride. Hell the FAA can give you a 709 ride for any reason, so one ought to be prepared.
 
flyingron said:
Frnakly, if someone encouraged me to falsify a survey (under threat or not) I'd report him even if it did mean I was volunteering for a 709 ride. Hell the FAA can give you a 709 ride for any reason, so one ought to be prepared.
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That's true, the rules allow them to, but I've never heard of a case where they've made someone do a 709 ride for no reason at all. In this case, the DPE's alleged behavior was so beyond the pale that it would be worth a 709 ride if it were me, and the threat would just clinch it. But I'd do a little more homework too, just to see if a retest was a reasonable expectation under the circumstances.

BTW, I'm really not sure what the criteria are for forcing graduates of ex-DPEs de-designated for pencil whipping to get retested. A local DPE in my previous area had his designation pulled for paperwork errors that gave the appearance of pencil whipping, but AFAIK his graduates were never retested. I think the offenses that they nailed him on were on BFRs or IPCs and not checkrides, not sure if that would make a difference.
 
azure said:
That's true, the rules allow them to, but I've never heard of a case where they've made someone do a 709 ride for no reason at all. In this case, the DPE's alleged behavior was so beyond the pale that it would be worth a 709 ride if it were me, and the threat would just clinch it. But I'd do a little more homework too, just to see if a retest was a reasonable expectation under the circumstances.
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All good advice, I appreciate it! I've been told by some that I should just drop it and be happy with my rating and others have said to report it. I personally am not the kind to let someone get away with this sort of behavior, especially when given a threat to "answer carefully". I wasn't even happy after I passed the checkride. I agree that a 709 ride would be worth it if it means that this guy is held accountable.
 
lbbj14 said:
All good advice, I appreciate it! I've been told by some that I should just drop it and be happy with my rating and others have said to report it. I personally am not the kind to let someone get away with this sort of behavior, especially when given a threat to "answer carefully". I wasn't even happy after I passed the checkride. I agree that a 709 ride would be worth it if it means that this guy is held accountable.
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I would turn his butt in ASAP... You sound like a stand up kinda gal.... Congrats..:)
 
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