What do we think of the GNX 375?

Discussion in 'Avionics and Upgrades' started by alfadog, Oct 12, 2019.

  1. alfadog

    alfadog Final Approach

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    So I just bought a basic airplane. An American Yankee AA-1. I'm going to need ADSB out and I don't think the Sky Beacon is an option. Maybe the Tailbeacon will be but I can go with a Garmin transponder ADSB out for $3K. ADSB in and out for $5K. If I was just going with the transponder I wouldn't spend the extra $2K. But right now the airplane has no nav option at all, just a single com radio, so I was thinking of springing for the Garmin GNX 375 combination transponder with ADSB in / out along with a WAAS approach-approved GPS. That's $8K plus installation and I can probably work something out which one of the avionics guys on the field so the installation doesn't set me back too much.

    Obviously, this is an expensive add to a cheap airplane but I can always take it with me when I sell and if I sell. Meanwhile I'll have some functionality that I would like to have as a backup. What do you all think?
     
  2. av8en1

    av8en1 Filing Flight Plan

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    You can install a Tailbeacon on Yankee, provided you have a working transponder. The down side is that transponder may be 45 years old. For a little more money you could replace the antique transponder with new digital Stratus ESG.

    The GNX 375 question is a whole nother question ; )
     
  3. alfadog

    alfadog Final Approach

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    Another option for close to the same money would be an new transponder and a used 430/430W. That gives me more functionality in the second radio and the nav radio so probably the better option.
     
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  4. asicer

    asicer En-Route

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    That would be more expensive, though. $5k for the transponder + $6k for the 430w. So the math works out to be $3k more for the extra NAV/COM functionality over the 375, plus more stack space, and slightly reduced ADS-B In capability.
     
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  5. unsafervguy

    unsafervguy Pattern Altitude

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    As I've said a million times, a used 430/530 is a bad decision for a new install. It has been out of production for 8 years. It will be an orphan soon, the screen supply is almost gone. If you want the big screen spring for a new production unit, either garmin or Avidyne. I would go with a 375 and an iPad.
     
  6. Walboy

    Walboy Cleared for Takeoff

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    I just finished a long cross country with someone who installed a 375 in his airplane. It is a fantastic piece of equipment. It's hard to imagine flying cross country without FIS-B or ADS-B in.

    I found that the need for a tablet was pretty minimal. Unless you need access to approach plates or airport diagrams, I don't think you'll look at a tablet much. I also don't think the smaller screen size is much of an issue either and I do most of my flying with a GTN 750.

    I wouldn't hesitate to buy one if it fit my needs.
     
  7. Rgbeard

    Rgbeard Cleared for Takeoff

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    Ask me in a couple of weeks.

    My birdie is getting one as I type this.
     
  8. asicer

    asicer En-Route

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    How many hours did you get quoted for the install? What other supporting pieces did you need to buy for the 375? (e.g. GAE12? GTP59?)
     
  9. Rgbeard

    Rgbeard Cleared for Takeoff

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    My installation isn't limited to the GNX-375, so I'm sorry, but I can't answer your question directly.

    I don't see either of those pieces you mention on my quote.
     
  10. NordicDave

    NordicDave Cleared for Takeoff

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    A close friend of mine just put a 375 in his Yankee. Beautiful solution if the existing radios are good and need WAAS GPS and ADS-B transponder. Looks great and works great. Nice in a Grumman with limited panel space.

    For many the most expensive labor cost is touching anything touching the audio panel. It’s connected to everything. A big reason why the GNX-375 is so successful.
     
  11. Sinistar

    Sinistar En-Route

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    The GNX-375 should be connected to the audio panel.
     
  12. NordicDave

    NordicDave Cleared for Takeoff

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    Good to point of clarity. Agree it should be connected to the audio panel. We’re talking about a couple of wires, where new audio panel or radios is more invasive.
     
  13. James331

    James331 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    But it would make your plane a /G, which unlike just adding ADSB adds real function to the plane.

    Or maybe find a 330ES and 430w used.
     
  14. flyingcheesehead

    flyingcheesehead Touchdown! Greaser!

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    What are you going to use the plane for?

    If all you're going to do is poke holes in the sky VFR, an iPad, portable ADS-B In device (Stratus, Sentry, Scout, GDL 39/50/52), and a cheap ADS-B solution (Skybeacon, Tailbeacon, or GDL 82) is plenty for navigation and ADS-B.

    However, if you're going to do any IFR at all, the 375 is a pretty compelling solution. It gives you ADS-B In and out plus connection to portables plus WAAS GPS for a LOT less than that would have cost just a year or two ago.

    Not at all, unless you're not planning on having this plane for long, in which case you probably shouldn't be doing either.

    The install itself is likely to run you $5,000 regardless of which GPS you put in, so why waste your money installing something that's outdated and will soon be orphaned?

    The GNS series is a fine unit if you already have it - Not worth ripping it out and replacing it, yet. But it's certainly past the age where it's a worthwhile new install. The 375 is a better choice and will cost you less too.
     
  15. James331

    James331 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Not sure how a 430W is outdated, can a 375 shoot a LPV approach lower than a 430W?

    Also the format of the 430 looks to be better than a small cramped touchscreen.

    That said, the 375 isn’t shabby, I wouldn’t mind it if it could cross fill to a 530 or something and if it was 5k, 8k seems a little steep for what you get, especially when you compare to dynon sky view prices and the like.

    I’d say if you can wait till like 2021/22 before any major avionics buys.
     
  16. asicer

    asicer En-Route

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    Wrong. A 375 includes ADSB In, Out and /G WAAS (i.e. LPV approaches).
     
  17. unsafervguy

    unsafervguy Pattern Altitude

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    It’s outdated in that it has not been in production for 8 years. It’s reaching eol status. If you have one, great keep it it’s a great unit, but It makes no sense for a new install.
     
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  18. James331

    James331 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Depends on the price.
     
  19. unsafervguy

    unsafervguy Pattern Altitude

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    sorry, not at any price. bad economics spending 5k having a piece of equipment installed that may be un-fixable in the next few years. with the cost of avionics installs it makes no sense to do a new install on a out of production GPS.
     
  20. Fearless Tower

    Fearless Tower Touchdown! Greaser!

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    That’s just it. There are no ‘cheap’ 430/530s out there. People are still asking $5-7k for an old used 430 which is kind of nuts to spend that kind of money on box that is becoming harder to support
     
  21. flyingcheesehead

    flyingcheesehead Touchdown! Greaser!

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    The 430W isn't outdated from an operational perspective. Like I said, if you already have one in the panel, keep it.

    But to use it for a new install would be foolish. It's been out of production for 8 years, and the spare parts supply is dwindling. We are not long from the end of life, at which point anything goes wrong with it and you're stuck trying to get a new one from eBay (which will probably still be expensive if it's in working order) or spending another several AMUs to install something else.
     
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  22. NordicDave

    NordicDave Cleared for Takeoff

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    Garmin has stated they have no plans to cease support for the 430. Look how many years they support the 150XL or 300XL.

    The 430 product went EOL but not EOS. People make an assumption the two are tied closely together and they are not with most Garmin Avionics products.
     
  23. PPC1052

    PPC1052 En-Route

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    Do you have an indicator that will work with it? If not, throw in a few more AMUs for purchase and install of those, as well.
     
  24. PPC1052

    PPC1052 En-Route

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    The 375 adds /G.
     
  25. PPC1052

    PPC1052 En-Route

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    It's not. The 430 user interface is painful. And the screen resolution is poor compared to the GNX. It does have NAV/COM though.
     
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  26. unsafervguy

    unsafervguy Pattern Altitude

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    the eol will happen when there are no more screens, and that is rapidly approaching. lcds are not a part you just run out and have made. you have the number you expect to need for the life of the part made at one time. when garmin has none left, and that day is close from what i have been told, then any screen issue and the unit it a boat anchor. I am also sure that even if someone would do board level repairs, and that is not easy on high density surface mount boards, the components that were used in the 430 are most likely EOL also. a couple of the units in the 430 line are already non-serviceable do to parts availability.
     
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  27. Fearless Tower

    Fearless Tower Touchdown! Greaser!

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    And the cost for any repair of a 430/530 is rapidly rising.
     
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  28. Hunt-man

    Hunt-man Pre-Flight

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    Garmin stopped supporting my 480 but the 480 keeps powering up and flying approaches. I'll use what I have. In a few years something newer and cheaper will be on the market.
    The 375 does look like a good choice. But $$$
     
  29. flyingcheesehead

    flyingcheesehead Touchdown! Greaser!

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    I'm not assuming they're closely tied together... It's been 8 years, there are a lot of units in the field, and there is a finite supply of components. I'm sure Garmin will support them for as long as they can, more so in the case of the GNS x30 series than anything they've ever produced, because the backlash from haters is going to be huge when they finally announce end of service, and there are a lot of people with recently-installed GNS boxes who are going to be unhappy.

    Up until about two years ago, I'd have said that a 430W or 530W was worth installing, and that it had enough life left in it to make the installation worthwhile. I think there's a decent chance that the x30W series will still be supported in 5 years, but very little chance it'll be supported in 10 years... And it may be done in as little as 3 years. I wouldn't spend the money to newly install one at this point because you may end up spending that money again in fairly short order. Plus, for the prices that used GNS stuff is going for, you can get a brand new box with more features that will be supported for a very long time.

    I think maybe he was confusing it with the 345?

    Garmin really needs to do a better job of naming their stuff. The 335 and 345 are transponders, the 355 is a GPS/Com, and the 375 is a GPS/Transponder. Then, there's the "G5" thing. Before the G5 came out, everyone called the G500 the G5 for short... And now there's the G5, G500, G500 TXi, and GFC 500. No wonder people are confused about their products! Did they hire the people from GM who named the Volt and the Bolt?

    But would you pay to have a used 480 installed today? Probably not. And what happens if your 480 dies tomorrow?
     
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  30. Rgbeard

    Rgbeard Cleared for Takeoff

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    My Avionics guy said he's going to evaluate my blind encoder, and see if the GAE12 is needed. We hadn't talked about the temperature probe yet.
     
  31. Rgbeard

    Rgbeard Cleared for Takeoff

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    Hear hear!!

    I've not been a Garmin-ite until now, and damn, these model schemes are FAR from easy.

    I want to understand it... I do... (up to the point I get what I want....then eff it!!)
     
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  32. chemgeek

    chemgeek Cleared for Takeoff

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    I think the GNX 375 is a nearly ideal solution for those needing both ADS-B compliance and IFR-capable GPS. I would not install a GNS-430W today as an upgrade--just not enough service life left to make it a good investment. While the GNS-430W works well and is still serviceable (I have one), it's long-term support is going to be limited by parts availability or technical advances, and is is rather old technology now. The newer Garmin or Avidyne units have much, much better screen displays and are likely to be easier to connect to future avionics.
     
  33. hindsight2020

    hindsight2020 En-Route

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    The irony. I could make the same argument about a lot of peoples' airplane model themselves, let alone installing any avionics on them..... :D
     
  34. MIFlyer

    MIFlyer Cleared for Takeoff PoA Supporter

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    Well, I think there are two issues. Since there is no slide in for a 480, if I had one, i'd probably just run it.

    If I had no GPS, I'd buy a new one, not pay thousands to install a used 430/530. There are great options in the GTN or Avidyne products. That way your installation cost is hopefully buying you decades of use.

    Now, the controversial one. What to do if you have a 430/530 that's working fine today. This is going to be different for everyone, but I think the smart money is to sell it immediately (6-7K) and slide in an IFD 440/540. My thinking is the GNS are worth gold right now, so for a few thousand bucks, you can leapfrog 15 years forward in features and supportability with a free or at most 1 hour install cost and you can sell your perfectly working GNS for top dollar right now as a lot of folks are doing panel upgrades and they are familiar with GNS.

    Since I never really learned the GNS, I kind of don't want to. I'd rather start my IFR on a GTN or IFD and just stick with that for the GPS portions.
     
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  35. MIFlyer

    MIFlyer Cleared for Takeoff PoA Supporter

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    Really? not being a smart alec, but what newer piston singles or twins are better than the 40 year old ones? Less UL, same speeds, same engines and mags?

    I guess the Cirrus or some of the new mooney's are actually fundamentally different, but I'd shop for condition, not age.
     
  36. Rgbeard

    Rgbeard Cleared for Takeoff

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    I have the conversation every work-day in my life regarding old equipment.

    I work in the IT field, and compared to avionics, the equipment I deal with ages in dog-years. Companies spend millions on equipment with a five to seven-year expected life, on average.

    We deal with a set of dates to help make the decision:

    Product was announced
    Product was generally available
    Product was withdrawn from marketing
    Product will no longer be serviced

    The Garmin 430/530 product is definitely going towards that last date, and once it's finally there, the values should plummet. It's in the area of IT equipment where I'd advise my customers to avoid investment.

    I feel the Garmin 650 is closing in on withdrawal from marketing, as it's nearly 10 years since general availability. I was twitchy about investing in one. That is one of the reasons why I chose the newly-released 375.
     
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  37. MBDiagMan

    MBDiagMan En-Route

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    There is a model newer than the 375 that also includes a radio for not much more. Putting in that one and using your existing radio as back up would provide LOTS of functionality and usefulness.

    My $0.02,
     
  38. hindsight2020

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    The jest was meant it in the context of support/orphaning. Because of course, their 1960/70s spam cans are gonna be supported forever, so they don't think twice sinking 50K in avionics.....:rolleyes::D
     
  39. PPC1052

    PPC1052 En-Route

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    I think that is the smart thing to do. Get what money you can now out of it before it becomes a door stop.
     
  40. PPC1052

    PPC1052 En-Route

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    But I don't think that one is ADSB-Out, and it's only a COM. No NAV radio.
     
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