Was followed today.

Josh Jackson said:
Even if you were carrying a weapon, and they attempted to commit any of the above, the chances of you succeeding against three "mafioso" type males is extremely low and would probably end up in your entire family being injured or worse. It is nice to have a weapon for protection, but they all three very likely had weapons as well.
Click to expand...

3 to 1? Those are perfect odds. You haven’t seen enough Liam Neeson movies. ;)

In a populated area, broad daylight, most likely some kids getting some video of white touristy people freaking out because they’re being followed by people with different colored skin. (Because, let’s face it, the OP was a little freaked out, and it was justified.) Be careful out there, either way. Be safe. A good PIC always has an emergency exit, and the OP flew into a box canyon at one point. ;)
 
Josh Jackson said:
A few things to think of.

1) You were flying a plane. Do you imagine they could have started scouting you from the point you left the airfield? I say this, because drug trafficking occurs all over the U.S.. They could have been wanting to extort or threaten you for access to a pilot and plane.

2) Your family was with you. Were there any kids? Especially girls. A white van, with three Hispanic males, following a family with kids and recording is a massive sign of human trafficking. Not to alarm or be paranoid, but this is a scary reality.

3) Even if you were carrying a weapon, and they attempted to commit any of the above, the chances of you succeeding against three "mafioso" type males is extremely low and would probably end up in your entire family being injured or worse. It is nice to have a weapon for protection, but they all three very likely had weapons as well.

You saw three guys in the van, there could have been more. There could have been a backup vehicle nearby scouting for police while these guys followed you. Just a bunch of things to think about.

In this situation, I would have called 9-1-1 after they followed you into the parking lot. At that point, you are 100% sure that the safety of your family is in jeopardy, no matter the severity of their intent. 9-1-1 would have talked you right through it and you could have helped take a small chunk out of the criminals roving the streets.

Chances are, they moved on to the next target if they were planning anything nefarious.
Click to expand...
4) They could have been CIA agents dressed up as hispanics (those CIA types love disguises) who believed you were attempting to plant a bomb on a bus rigged to explode when the speed dropped below 55mph.

5) They could have been talent scouts from the Brazilian version of the Bachelor looking for a rich American single fella to star on the show next season.

6) They could have been aliens.
 
Lachlan said:
There’s a work around for almost everything. The best criminals have figured out the law enforcement work arounds. :)
Click to expand...

haha, work with, near, in the vicinity of, in association with. But yes, there are always work arounds for the bad dudes.
 
Juliet Hotel said:
4) They could have been CIA agents dressed up as hispanics (those CIA types love disguises) who believed you were attempting to plant a bomb on a bus rigged to explode when the speed dropped below 55mph.

5) They could have been talent scouts from the Brazilian version of the Bachelor looking for a rich American single fella to star on the show next season.

6) They could have been aliens.
Click to expand...

Just trying to tell the OP very real scenarios that happen frequently in my line of work. I do enjoy the lightness that is taken with illegal trafficking though.
 
RussR said:
Dang! Where do you guys live? Do you drive around looking for the rough parts of town, or what?

I've been driving for 30 years now, lived in about 10 different states, visited many others and have never had any of the problems you guys have. Nobody following me, nobody pulling a gun on me or making me wish I had a gun with me...
Click to expand...

Definitely need to travel more. Or be sent to neighborhoods you normally wouldn’t be in for work.

I got followed three or so times in vehicles as a traveling telecom engineer.

The Newark NJ Central Office for MCI/Verizon has razor wire around it. If the parking lot is full, you call your boss and tell him you’ll try to go to work later. You don’t park a rental car outside the razor wire there and walk with tools. Especially if the work takes you there after dark.

Been followed more on foot than in vehicles though when doing that work. Assume it was likely to be for muggings. Usually just stepped into any well-lit business to handle that.
 
denverpilot said:
Definitely need to travel more. Or be sent to neighborhoods you normally wouldn’t be in for work.
Click to expand...
I used to go to Camden regularly for work. Been to many Chicago neighborhoods for work. Never been followed. Never felt like I needed a gun. I must be the luckiest guy on the planet I guess.
 
Juliet Hotel said:
I used to go to Camden regularly for work. Been to many Chicago neighborhoods for work. Never been followed. Never felt like I needed a gun. I must be the luckiest guy on the planet I guess.
Click to expand...
Or just oblivious. Either one works, both equally well until you actually get robbed.
 
DaleB said:
Or just oblivious. Either one works, both equally well until you actually get robbed.
Click to expand...
Carrying a gun ain't gonna stop me from getting robbed. Others might be willing to shoot a man because he wants the $40 they've got in their wallet but I'm not. Carrying or not, if you want to take my wallet you can have it, I'm not going to shoot anyone over that.
 
SkyDog58 said:
Once I was cutoff in traffic by some silly lady on her phone so I honked my horn at her as she nearly hit my car. For the next 3 miles or so I followed her making every turn that she did. As we approached a left land turn into a neighborhood, a cop car pulled in behind me and after I followed the lady into the neighborhood, the cop turned on his blue lights and hit his siren once. I pulled into the third driveway while the lady drove on and the cop pulled in behind me. I parked my car, shutdown the engine, and was getting out of my car when he yelled at me to get back in. I complied. He came up to my car and asked for my license and I asked him what the problem was. He said that the driver of the car I was following called 911 because I was following her and she was scared. I then asked the cop if he noticed any similarities between the address on my driver license and the address of the driveway we were sitting in. He looks at both then a look of “oh fudge” comes over his face as he stammers “is this your house?” to which I reply that it was and that I simply had been driving home from work and that the car in front of me must have just happened to be going to the same subdivision. He tells me to wait in my car as he goes back to his car with my license. A couple of minutes later he comes back to my car, hands me my license, and apologizes for the mistake. So I asked him if I did anything wrong and he says no. So I ask if I can get out of my car and go in my house. He said to wait until he drove off. I laughed but complied.

The really sad thing is that after leaving my driveway, the cop left the neighborhood and did not go to the woman’s house to admonish her.

So, my take is that many people watch too many crime shows and movies and become paranoid. Be sure of the facts before causing anyone any trouble by calling the cops or pulling out a gun and trying to be Charles Bronson. You are more likely to be wrong than right in my opinion.
Click to expand...
More than once, I've had people flip me off, or get some sort of road rage, as I'm sure most of us have. My standard reaction is to not return the gesture, but just slow down, and let them get in front of me so I can watch them in case they try something silly. And twice now, I've happened to be going the same way as them. I had one guy lift his phone up and mouth the words "9 1 1" in his mirror at a traffic light, as if to say if I don't stop "following him" he would call 911. I watched the second guy, driving a large tow truck, run a stop sign at about 60 mph just to "get away from me", not realizing he was just driving the same way I was going.
 
EdFred said:
I only got followed once, and not really sure what the guy's issue was. I just got done instructing my martial arts class, and had a hankering for some McChickens (yeah, I know). So I go to the McDonald's around the corner. This McDonald's had two entrances, one from the back and one from the main road. I was coming in from the back entrance, and pull into the drive through lane just as a car is even with the front of the McD's - about 150 ft away (just measured on google maps). Well evidently he took that as me cutting him off. And as I am placing my order, he runs into my bumper. At the time I think "well, his foot slipped off the brake or something" I place my order and pull up to the next window. Oh, he's in a car, and I'm in a truck with the offroad package and body lift. He places his order and then bam, hits me again. OK, not an accident. I pull forward slightly, then put it in reverse and stomp on it. Not sure what damage I did to his car, but none to my bumper. As I pull out I make it look like I pull into the adjacent mall parking lot to eat, but had set it up so I was ready to enter the main road. He decides he's going to "cut me off" and beat me to somewhere in the parking lot I guess. He goes in the other entrance to get a head of me, but misses the only outlet to the main road. So I'm on the main road, and he's paralleling me in the parking lot. Road was a boulevard, and as he's racing to pace me in the parking lot (separated by a berm and curb from the street) I make a u-turn in the next turnaround and head the opposite direction.

Still no clue what was going through that guy's head.
Click to expand...

You should have taken him "down the old highway to look for bears".
 
Juliet Hotel said:
Carrying a gun ain't gonna stop me from getting robbed. Others might be willing to shoot a man because he wants the $40 they've got in their wallet but I'm not. Carrying or not, if you want to take my wallet you can have it, I'm not going to shoot anyone over that.
Click to expand...

A pistol in that situation is a standoff weapon. It retains distance. Any sane mugger who only wants $40 is going to depart when the pistol is deployed.

If the distance is closed after you’ve deployed it, the moron no longer just wants $40. They’re aiming to harm. Pull the trigger.
 
It’s a crazy world. With more ppl on drugs looking for money for their next high, more really to prevent withdrawal. They will do anything to prevent a withdrawal. Anything.
 
Josh Jackson said:
I work around law enforcement on the southern border.....
Click to expand...
Josh Jackson said:
A few things to think of.

1) You were flying a plane. Do you imagine they could have started scouting you from the point you left the airfield? I say this, because drug trafficking occurs all over the U.S.. They could have been wanting to extort or threaten you for access to a pilot and plane.

2) Your family was with you. Were there any kids? Especially girls. A white van, with three Hispanic males, following a family with kids and recording is a massive sign of human trafficking. Not to alarm or be paranoid, but this is a scary reality.

3) Even if you were carrying a weapon, and they attempted to commit any of the above, the chances of you succeeding against three "mafioso" type males is extremely low and would probably end up in your entire family being injured or worse. It is nice to have a weapon for protection, but they all three very likely had weapons as well.

You saw three guys in the van, there could have been more. There could have been a backup vehicle nearby scouting for police while these guys followed you. Just a bunch of things to think about.

In this situation, I would have called 9-1-1 after they followed you into the parking lot. At that point, you are 100% sure that the safety of your family is in jeopardy, no matter the severity of their intent. 9-1-1 would have talked you right through it and you could have helped take a small chunk out of the criminals roving the streets.

Chances are, they moved on to the next target if they were planning anything nefarious.
Click to expand...
You "work around" law enforcement...lol. TV script producer for fiction cop show?
Your scenarios prove your ignorance to drug running, human trafficking, etc.
 
Fallsrider said:
The best rule of thumb is, IMO, to never draw unless you're ready to use it right then, right now.
Click to expand...

That would be correct. The few times I have had to show my pistol I was ready to shoot. I had already planned how close I would let the threat get to me, but fortunately for those people they saw I was more of a threat and left the area.

New Mexico has an open carry, so usually the sight of a sidearm on a person changes the situation. Still, cracks me up to see a redneck all decked out in Walmart camouflage with his 10 inch barrel .22 on the belt reading a ''Soldier of Fortune'' magazine...
 
Weekend Warrior said:
You "work around" law enforcement...lol. TV script producer for fiction cop show?
Your scenarios prove your ignorance to drug running, human trafficking, etc.
Click to expand...

Wow lol. I will not reveal my job, but I can assure you, this happens very often.
 
Fallsrider said:
The best rule of thumb is, IMO, to never draw unless you're ready to use it right then, right now.
Click to expand...

Best rule of thumb is escape and evade. If you had time to think about it, then you had time to avoid it. Shoot outs never ever end well for anyone.
 
RussR said:
Dang! Where do you guys live? Do you drive around looking for the rough parts of town, or what?

I've been driving for 30 years now, lived in about 10 different states, visited many others and have never had any of the problems you guys have. Nobody following me, nobody pulling a gun on me or making me wish I had a gun with me...
Click to expand...

For me it’s been 45 years driving and lived in 9 different states and three of those twice. This includes the Los Angles area, Chicagoland, and Memphis. Three areas that do not have a stellar reputation. I’ve also lived in Las Vegas and Charlotte. Never had a reason to freak out or fear for my life. And I’ve hung out in some seedy bars and poor parts of town at times. I think there’s some embellishment going on in this thread by some folks.
 
wilkersk said:
Best rule of thumb is escape and evade. If you had time to think about it, then you had time to avoid it. Shoot outs never ever end well for anyone.
Click to expand...
Most of the time, yes. But it is not always possible to avoid a confrontation. No matter how good one's situational awareness, criminals are really good at ambush. If you suddenly find yourself surrounded by two or three thugs, or boxed in by their car, evade and escape may be difficult or impossible.

Many times every year, it does not end well for the criminal, but the victim walks away unharmed. That doesn't mean they won't have an emotional hit to deal with over the succeeding weeks and months, but they live another day to spend with family and friends.

I have a 12-year-old son with autism. Evading and escape would almost never be possible when I am out in public with him. I'll have to take my stand against anyone who tries to cause us harm. If I have the opportunity to fight back, that's better than waiting to see if they are going to harm us.
 
SkyDog58 said:
For me it’s been 45 years driving and lived in 9 different states and three of those twice. This includes the Los Angles area, Chicagoland, and Memphis. Three areas that do not have a stellar reputation. I’ve also lived in Las Vegas and Charlotte. Never had a reason to freak out or fear for my life. And I’ve hung out in some seedy bars and poor parts of town at times. I think there’s some embellishment going on in this thread by some folks.
Click to expand...

It honestly just sounds like you werent aware of your surroundings. Pull up a crime tape of every area you were in... free of violent crimes?

Its surprising the amount of people that do not WANT to know these things happen. They go into denial and claim we are all nuts.
 
Mtns2Skies said:
Why would she need admonishing? How was she supposed to know you lived there? Road rage and following is real so I'm not sure why you deserve benefit of the doubt.
Click to expand...

For wasting the cop’s and my time with her paranoia. I deserved benefit of the doubt because I broke no law and did nothing wrong.
 
SkyDog58 said:
For wasting the cop’s and my time with her paranoia. I deserved benefit of the doubt because I broke no law and did nothing wrong.
Click to expand...
But from her POV you were intending to cause her harm. Even with only hearing your side of the story it's easy to see how she was right to do what she did. No one in this story except for you knew that your house was along her route. Why are you expecting everyone to know where you live?
 
Weekend Warrior said:
More than once, I've had people flip me off, or get some sort of road rage, as I'm sure most of us have. My standard reaction is to not return the gesture, but just slow down, and let them get in front of me so I can watch them in case they try something silly. And twice now, I've happened to be going the same way as them. I had one guy lift his phone up and mouth the words "9 1 1" in his mirror at a traffic light, as if to say if I don't stop "following him" he would call 911. I watched the second guy, driving a large tow truck, run a stop sign at about 60 mph just to "get away from me", not realizing he was just driving the same way I was going.
Click to expand...

Yep people are idiots. I will blow kisses at folks who flip me off.
 
SkyDog58 said:
For wasting the cop’s and my time with her paranoia. I deserved benefit of the doubt because I broke no law and did nothing wrong.
Click to expand...

She didnt waste the cops time. He did his job. If you felt your time was wasted, I'm sorry. I would rather have my time wasted by a cop doing his job and know the police in my area are concerned with vehicle followings., because they are well aware of the dangers associated to it.
 
Juliet Hotel said:
Carrying a gun ain't gonna stop me from getting robbed. Others might be willing to shoot a man because he wants the $40 they've got in their wallet but I'm not. Carrying or not, if you want to take my wallet you can have it, I'm not going to shoot anyone over that.
Click to expand...
I'm not going to shoot someone for wanting the cash in my wallet. That would be inhuman. However, I'm not going to just give him my wallet just because he thinks he wants it. I'm not really all that worried about the wallet, but those things too often don't end with the wallet being taken.

Some people like to pretend that random violence just doesn't happen to the average person, you have to be looking for trouble or doing something stupid or risky. That's a pretty stupid way of thinking. A friend of mine and his wife were murdered in their own home by a nutbar who wanted to rob them and steal their vehicle. I'm certain he would have given the guy whatever he asked for; Steve was the nicest, most reasonable guy you could ever hope to meet. The ******* murdered them both with a shotgun anyway, apparently just for fun.
 
Josh Jackson said:
She didnt waste the cops time. He did his job. If you felt your time was wasted, I'm sorry. I would rather have my time wasted by a cop doing his job and know the police in my area are concerned with vehicle followings., because they are well aware of the dangers associated to it.
Click to expand...

Everyone follows and is followed by others every time they drive. I guess we should all just freak out and call 911 all the time.
 
SkyDog58 said:
Everyone follows and is followed by others every time they drive. I guess we should all just freak out and call 911 all the time.
Click to expand...
No, but there was an instance which caused anger and then you happened to follow her during a long portion of her drive, even down private roads. How are you not seeing this from her perspective? Where is this lack of empathy coming from?
 
SkyDog58 said:
Everyone follows and is followed by others every time they drive. I guess we should all just freak out and call 911 all the time.
Click to expand...

Come on now.... surely that irrational thinking is not conducive to being in the sky...

You know exactly what I am referencing. When in doubt, call the police... it's so much better than the alternative.

My daughter is almost 6 and easily grasps this concept.
 
Mtns2Skies said:
No, but there was an instance which caused anger and then you happened to follow her during a long portion of her drive, even down private roads. How are you not seeing this from her perspective? Where is this lack of empathy coming from?
Click to expand...

What anger? I honked my horn and hit my brakes in a successful effort to avoid getting hit. The horn woke her up as it was evident that she wasn’t paying attention or looking in her mirrors. I exhibited no anger, did not yell at her, did not flip her off, and did not tailgate her as I continued on my way home “following” her. Those are displays of anger. A warning blast on the horn is hardly a display of anger.

I’m more likely to believe that she knew she screwed up and almost caused an accident and then knowing that she would be angry in my shoes she assumed I was. But I really wasn’t. These sort of close calls happen far more frequently these days due to cellphones and a general diminishing level of defensive driving by many. That is why I always have my head on a swivel for drivers like that. I might get disgusted at such drivers but I seldom get angry and never drive in a threatening manner.

Btw, no private roads were involved as they were all fairly well traveled city streets. And our subdivision is a large one with just the one entrance. Almost every time I turn in or leave, so is someone else. Traffic is hardly a rarity.

This happened over a distance of about three miles max which hardly qualifies as a long portion of someone’s drive unless their drive was only 5 miles or less.

Also the first turn that we both made was right after the event from the turn lane that I was already in and which she crossed over to when she nearly hit me. It should have been evident that I had already planned to turn there.

There was really no need for her to fear me as I did nothing besides the horn. I would have expected and deserved a blast of someone’s horn if I had done what she did.
 
Josh Jackson said:
Come on now.... surely that irrational thinking is not conducive to being in the sky...

You know exactly what I am referencing. When in doubt, call the police... it's so much better than the alternative.

My daughter is almost 6 and easily grasps this concept.
Click to expand...

She must have inherited your level of intelligence. How unfortunate.
 
denverpilot said:
A pistol in that situation is a standoff weapon. It retains distance. Any sane mugger who only wants $40 is going to depart when the pistol is deployed.

If the distance is closed after you’ve deployed it, the moron no longer just wants $40. They’re aiming to harm. Pull the trigger.
Click to expand...
Well I've always been of the mind that if you carry concealed, you never pull it out just to show it off. If it comes out, it gets used or it doesn't come out. Which is why I don't carry.
 
Yep, better to be safe...

Couple years back I had the cops called on me. The day the Saga of the Drunk Neighbor started its final chapter (I need to really put all that in writing, as my friend Pat puts it the best part of that story isn't even the part where he was presumed dead, but anyway...) I came home for lunch and was going to talk to a neighbor two houses down about it. When I got to my driveway I didn't see her car in the driveway, but by the time I let the dog out, and walked back out to get my mail her car was there. Let the dog back in, and walk over there. Knock on the door, dog (little white yappy dog) starts going crazy like it always does, I can see human movement inside, but can't make anything out. I know she sees me, so I wait a bit, and wait a bit. I think maybe she's on the phone, I'll just walk back home. I'm making lunch and I see a police car pull into my driveway since I have my garage door still open. I go out the garage door and as the the cop gets out of his car he has a real confused look on his face when he sees me.

"I'm looking for a tall, white, male wearing...a....bright blue....po....lo."
"Well that sounds like you are looking for me! Did you get a call from [surname]'s"
"I can't say."
"Probably did, I just walked down there to tell [name] about this house between us I just bought at auction, knocked on the door, saw movement, no one answered. Must be one of her daughters called."
He tries not to admit that was the case, but realizes that I'm not the suspicious person that was reported. Well I was, but I was no longer a person of interest. We talk for 2 minutes, he gets my name writes it down and he goes back down to their house. I finish eating lunch, get in my truck and pull into their driveway behind the cop. He's talking with them, the daughter (of at least driving age) starts profusely apologizing to me because she didn't recognize me and freaked out. I might have been the opposite of clean shaven and she'd only seen me baby-faced.

Well, the house had been up for foreclosure auction, and over the previous few days, people had been pulling into that driveway, walking around the house, and scoping it out. The daughter didn't know what was going on with that, didn't see a car in her driveway (because I walked over) and since she didn't know it was me, called 911. The officer, daughter, mom, and I had a good laugh about it, and were all in agreement nothing wrong was done.

Of course it didn't help that in previous years they had to call the cops on Drunk Neighbor Guy (that lived between us) because of the way he was acting towards her daughters (when they were preteen age).

No admonishing was done.
 
Juliet Hotel said:
I used to go to Camden regularly for work. Been to many Chicago neighborhoods for work. Never been followed. Never felt like I needed a gun. I must be the luckiest guy on the planet I guess.
Click to expand...

Could be. We had a technician followed at night when he (stupidly) decided to take a walk from his hotel in Newark. A cabbie pulled over and told him to get in the cab.

Being dense he said he didn’t need a ride.

“Just get in the f***ing cab. Don’t look but there’s three guys following you with baseball bats.”

Good guy, that cabbie.
 
There’s a good bit of interesting (?disturbing) conversation here, but what I find disturbing is those here who have cute names for their firearms.
I carry, but I don’t name my tools.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top